Tour de France 2020 | Stage 4 (Sisteron – Orcières-Merlette, 160.5 km)

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Were they accidentally shipping them rebadged Apex groups instead of Red or something? Short of actually missing shifts, or having bearings that just don't turn, i'm not sure what SRAM could be doing wrong that would be "killing their legs."

FWIW, I have Campag and shimano on my road bikes, and a SRAM equipped cargo bike, and Campag is definitely my favourite.

For one they were forcing them to ride 48-10 cranks. Valverde has only ever used a 53-11 crack and the 48-10 was destroying his legs. There were Katusha riders confirming this with what they had to deal with for their first year with SRAM. That the gearing would destroy their legs and they'd have nothing left by the time they got to end of the race to do anything. During the lock down Valverde posted a picture of his bike leaning against his fireplace and you could more or less count the gearing and know he had new gearing. Not sure if it's his preferred 53 or if it's a 52, but it's definitely either a 52 or 53 for the big ring now and he's looked better with the more appropriate gearing.

I personally have Shimano on my road bikes. Come to think of it, I have Shimano on all my bikes. I've heard from people who use campy that it's their favorite, but it's also more expensive and I'm just riding for fun so Shimano works just fine for that. Valverde's amateur team uses Shimano.
 
Were they accidentally shipping them rebadged Apex groups instead of Red or something? Short of actually missing shifts, or having bearings that just don't turn, i'm not sure what SRAM could be doing wrong that would be "killing their legs."

FWIW, I have Campag and shimano on my road bikes, and a SRAM equipped cargo bike, and Campag is definitely my favourite.
It might just be that Bala and Movistar are having a bad year but dont tell Koronin as it gets her a bit upset
 
For one they were forcing them to ride 48-10 cranks. Valverde has only ever used a 53-11 crack and the 48-10 was destroying his legs. There were Katusha riders confirming this with what they had to deal with for their first year with SRAM. That the gearing would destroy their legs and they'd have nothing left by the time they got to end of the race to do anything. During the lock down Valverde posted a picture of his bike leaning against his fireplace and you could more or less count the gearing and know he had new gearing. Not sure if it's his preferred 53 or if it's a 52, but it's definitely either a 52 or 53 for the big ring now and he's looked better with the more appropriate gearing.

I personally have Shimano on my road bikes. Come to think of it, I have Shimano on all my bikes. I've heard from people who use campy that it's their favorite, but it's also more expensive and I'm just riding for fun so Shimano works just fine for that. Valverde's amateur team uses Shimano.
Actually, I forgot about the gearing, and I totally agree with you. Cyclingtips had an article about it; Trek have actually blocked off the 10 with their limiting screws, and are running effectively 11-speed with 53-39 rings.

https://cyclingtips.com/2020/08/gallery-new-bikes-at-the-2020-tour-de-france/



This is basically part of the same problem Aquablue had with SRAM; with a smaller chainring, the gaps between even your straight-block gears are effectively larger than with a 53. That isn't such a big deal on a mountain bike, but it's crucial on the road.
 
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In french television, nobody talks about Pogacar but what he is doing at ONLY 21 (!!!) is amasing.
It is sensationnal.
White Jersey on Le tour at only 21. I don't remember other player with white jersey at the same age. (Bernal at 22 ?)
Bernal finished second in white jersey comp at 21. I believe he led the competition at some point.
 
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In french television, nobody talks about Pogacar but what he is doing at ONLY 21 (!!!) is amasing.
It is sensationnal.
White Jersey on Le tour at only 21. I don't remember other player with white jersey at the same age. (Bernal at 22 ?)
I like the French riders, but if the French media dare to not talk about Pogacar it would be great if he won the whole thing!

Really, it's incredible how biased the media in all the countries are. Sure they want to sell their stuff, but how can journalists be so f** ignorant and nationalistic? (I'm assuming that's it and not just oblivion?)
 
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Actually, I forgot about the gearing, and I totally agree with you. Cyclingtips had an article about it; Trek have actually blocked off the 10 with their limiting screws, and are running effectively 11-speed with 53-39 rings.

https://cyclingtips.com/2020/08/gallery-new-bikes-at-the-2020-tour-de-france/



This is basically part of the same problem Aquablue had with SRAM; with a smaller chainring, the gaps between even your straight-block gears are effectively larger than with a 53. That isn't such a big deal on a mountain bike, but it's crucial on the road.

Their stupidity of going with SRAM to me is a much bigger problem than the decision to go with a youth movement and do an almost complete rebuild. At this point to me, they'd be better off breaking the contract with SRAM and just buying parts for the riders if they can't get something with either Shimano or Campy. Hopefully they've finally gotten the same gearing that Trek has and have done the same thing, because this was a big part of the issue back at the start of the season. Valverde's temper tantrum of threatening to not race UAE and then showing up with a monoplate (that I heard he went and bought) to prove a point, appears to have at least partially worked to get at least better gearing to the team during the lock down. I guess they never had a rider at his level throw a temper tantrum over the junk they were forcing them to use.
 
In french television, nobody talks about Pogacar but what he is doing at ONLY 21 (!!!) is amasing.
It is sensationnal.
White Jersey on Le tour at only 21. I don't remember other player with white jersey at the same age. (Bernal at 22 ?)

I wish the US media would remember he's there. It's all Ineos, Ineos, Ineos, and Alaphilippe, Alaphilippe, Alaphilippe and continue to push Quintana as well. Then maybe remember that Jumbo Visma has a strong team, but why isn't it Ineos doing something. UGH!!!!!! Someone else's feed has got to be better than NBC's.
 
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Aug 31, 2020
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I like the French riders, but if the French media dare to not talk about Pogacar it would be great if he won the whole thing!

Really, it's incredible how biased the media in all the countries are. Sure they want to sell their stuff, but how can journalists be so f** ignorant and nationalistic? (I'm assuming that's it and not just oblivion?)
Yeah, they talk about Barguil but we all know that he is out for the yellow.
But this is not surprising the french coach Thomas Voeckler is part of the television staff so .......
 
Really, it's incredible how biased the media in all the countries are. Sure they want to sell their stuff, but how can journalists be so f** ignorant and nationalistic? (I'm assuming that's it and not just oblivion?)
The worst is Britain when England, Wales and Scotland are competing as separate entities. You'd think Wales and Scotland are foreign countries.
 
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The worst is Britain when England, Wales and Scotland are competing as separate entities. You'd think Wales and Scotland are foreign countries.
Lol. Well on German TV they like to include Swiss and Austrian riders in "their" riders, rooting for them heavily, as long as they are not in direct rivalry to Germans... So when there is no German rider in direct contention we root for Hirschi and Mühlberger. When Buchmann does well we might mention them, but don't actually care.

Also, note that of course Sunweb is a "German team", so when a Sunweb rider does well, it's always a rider "from the German team Sunweb".
Today at times you'd think Jumbo is a German team, because they have Grischa Niermann... so basically Roglic's win was a success for us...
 
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oh he will pull
he will only pull if a climber who threatens roglic is up the road with more than a mountain to go and Kuss, Bennett, WVA and Gesink have all been dropped...

what, honestly, is the chance of that?

i would not be surprised if roglic is in yellow going into the TT with 2-3 climbers within two minutes. and Dumo in 5th.

Dumo will then likely finish second in the TDF -- and first, if something happens to Roglic. Not a bad insurance.

best to allow Dumo to power up every climb and limit any losses to a handful of seconds and then pass all the climbers in the TT (much as he did in the Giro in 2017 and would have done in 2018, if not for Froome).
 
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he will only pull if a climber who threatens roglic is up the road with more than a mountain to go and Kuss, Bennett, WVA and Gesink have all been dropped...

what, honestly, is the chance of that?

i would not be surprised if roglic is in yellow going into the TT with 2-3 climbers within two minutes. and Dumo in 5th.

Dumo will then likely finish second in the TDF -- and first, if something happens to Roglic. Not a bad insurance.

best to allow Dumo to power up every climb and limit any losses to handful of seconds and then pass all the climbers in the TT (much as he did in the Giro in 2017 and would have done in 2018, if not for Froome).
The key is Kuss. He's got extremely good form right now. Where exactly is he getting dropped right now? He's their last man standing before Roglic and Dumoulin and he was there until almost the top of today's final climb just like at the Dauphine. When he's on the front it's going to be difficult for anyone to really attack and get very far.
 
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Some theories after today's stage:
Froome fans feel a little lost. It's the Catalina wine mixer of cycling: the tour de France. But it's September and not July and there's no Froome. Maybe cheer for Roglic. He's on course to crush the life out of the tour and his biggest rival looks like Quintana like 2013 and 2015.
On another note, maybe Alaphillipe was bluffing today. He only had to finish in front of Yates to keep yellow and he kept looking back at him. Maybe Ala is saving himself after burning out last year and he can now climb like Herera.
Both tongues in both cheeks.
 
Here's the answer for Movistar, according to two of their riders, they appear to be riding for GC. It appears that Soler is just building form and may go stage hunting later. However, between Mas' comment that he had good legs and is upset about losing a few seconds and these comments from Valverde (these are from Movistar's page and their translation):
We’re still in the early stages of the Tour and everyone is still pretty fresh. There are teams with great strength which put on a pace that makes impossible for attacks to gain an advantage – if you try a move, you come back to the group with less energy. I think we did well, considering how we tackled this Tour. Enric just lost those little nine seconds and I was able to finish close, 20″ down – the feel after the stage is that we’re doing better and better. People must keep in mind that the Tour is only starting. We already saw during the Dauphiné how things changed from the start to the final stage, with many surprises. The same could happen in the Tour.

Mas and Valverde are riding for GC. He also sounds a little more optimistic than he did a few days ago when he said they had no chance to get inside the top 15 let alone the top 10 and had no chance to win any stages.
 
I really don't like this stage design, such MTF early in the tour, not overly steep, makes it easy for the still fresh teams to control the race. If you want a MTF that early then do it rather on a really steep Murito, I would rather have 2-3km at 10%+ than this completely predictable first Cat. Climb.
 
he will only pull if a climber who threatens roglic is up the road with more than a mountain to go and Kuss, Bennett, WVA and Gesink have all been dropped...

what, honestly, is the chance of that?

i would not be surprised if roglic is in yellow going into the TT with 2-3 climbers within two minutes. and Dumo in 5th.

Dumo will then likely finish second in the TDF -- and first, if something happens to Roglic. Not a bad insurance.

best to allow Dumo to power up every climb and limit any losses to a handful of seconds and then pass all the climbers in the TT (much as he did in the Giro in 2017 and would have done in 2018, if not for Froome).
To me he hasnt show anything I would consider him a podium candidate, Pogacar is a lot more likely to be second.
I keep reading he is improving but all I see is the same I did a month ago. If he doesnt improve I dont expect him do do that great in the TT
 
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I don't understand the critics: Stage 1 was a horror movie, Stage 2 was Alaf' calling it and doing it, Stage 3 a fantastic sprint, and today, maybe not a great mountain stage, but still a GC appetizer.

Don't you remember all these years of Cance/Panzer wins the prologue, Cavendish wins two pan flat bore fests, and Hushovd or another lucky sprinter make it three pan flat bore fests in a row?

Just sayin'...
 
I really don't like this stage design, such MTF early in the tour, not overly steep, makes it easy for the still fresh teams to control the race. If you want a MTF that early then do it rather on a really steep Murito, I would rather have 2-3km at 10%+ than this completely predictable first Cat. Climb.
Both are viable. Murito's are pretty predictable as well. At this stage in the race I'd actually prefer them shorter. Mur de Huy was fantastic for a 3rd stage.
 

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