Tour de Suisse (2.UWT), 9-17 June 2018

[Broccolidwarf]

Re: Re:

Predicted podium after Sunday:

Porte
Kelderman
Oomen

No way Quintana loses a minute to Oomen

On a 34 k flat TT?

I predict he loses closer to 2 minutes.

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Not really understanding "..." Fuglsang basically riding for Porte last over 2km.

Only chance at the stage win, was those two working together..... and Fuglsang had given up the overall win after the TTT anyway, so today was about taking time on everyone behind, to get a shot at the podium.

 

[yaco]

The last lead up race before the TDF is a chance for the GC contenders to ride consistently and to show their form on one stage - A few of the GC riders for the TDF have shown promising signs in Dauphine and Suisse.

 

[durtyfat7]

Yeah, i know there's many people who overhyping him too much. But, he's clearly one of the best climbers in the field. You can't really rate his performance by what he has won at this stage of his career. He didn't really had a chance to prove himself as a leader. He hast his share of bad luck in the last 3 years. Until now, if you want to compare him to Quintana, he proved he is at least equal to him.

 

[jaylew]

Re: Re:

Predicted podium after Sunday:

Porte
Kelderman
Oomen

No way Quintana loses a minute to Oomen

On a 34 k flat TT?

I predict he loses closer to 2 minutes.

2 minutes? No way. Unless Oomen suddenly became a master of the flat TT when I wasn't looking. Kelderman could put some significant time into him but I don't see Oomen doing it.

 

[Kazistuta]

Re: Re:

Predicted podium after Sunday:

Porte
Kelderman
Oomen

No way Quintana loses a minute to Oomen

On a 34 k flat TT?

I predict he loses closer to 2 minutes.

To Oomen, the famous time trialist? No way.

Oomen must be at least some kind of spent from the giro, where he btw finished 28th on a similar length TT behind guys like Preidler, Formolo, Cattaneo and Denz.

I'd say those two will be pretty close sunday.

 

[silvergrenade]

Re:

Yeah, i know there's many people who overhyping him too much. But, he's clearly one of the best climbers in the field. You can't really rate his performance by what he has won at this stage of his career. He didn't really had a chance to prove himself as a leader. He hast his share of bad luck in the last 3 years. Until now, if you want to compare him to Quintana, he proved he is at least equal to him.

Really? :lol:

 

[hfer07]

finally some decent bike racing. Quintana & LRP doing their thing, Fuglsang coming back really well, & Landa a bit off his pace....

good day for cycling

 

[durtyfat7]

Re: Re:

Yeah, i know there's many people who overhyping him too much. But, he's clearly one of the best climbers in the field. You can't really rate his performance by what he has won at this stage of his career. He didn't really had a chance to prove himself as a leader. He hast his share of bad luck in the last 3 years. Until now, if you want to compare him to Quintana, he proved he is at least equal to him.

Really? :lol:

I meant this year lol

 

[railxmig]

Not really understanding "..." Fuglsang basically riding for Porte last over 2km.

Only chance at the stage win, was those two working together..... and Fuglsang had given up the overall win after the TTT anyway, so today was about taking time on everyone behind, to get a shot at the podium.

Maybe... even if he had no chance at a stage win as it was a stable 20s on mainly flat.

As for the Landa hype... he seems to me yet another Oscar Sevilla or Iban Mayo - a very talented bloke with a bit too big ego (or i'm reading it wrongly and he's just very expressive) who will fade rather quickly. I guess and partly hope i'm wrong. It's just my own intuition.

 

[AlexNYC]

Re:

Yeah, i know there's many people who overhyping him too much. But, he's clearly one of the best climbers in the field. You can't really rate his performance by what he has won at this stage of his career. He didn't really had a chance to prove himself as a leader. He hast his share of bad luck in the last 3 years. Until now, if you want to compare him to Quintana, he proved he is at least equal to him.

When did he prove this? He’s older than Quintana and hasn’t won anything important in his career. Over a long enough period of time, past performance is a great predictor of future performance. It doesn’t mean Landa can’t win a GT in the future, but the probability of he doing so are way lower than Quintana’s. Make of that what you will.

BTW, Porte is on a similar boat, although he has won a lot more over his career than “Landani”

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Re: Re:

Yeah, i know there's many people who overhyping him too much. But, he's clearly one of the best climbers in the field. You can't really rate his performance by what he has won at this stage of his career. He didn't really had a chance to prove himself as a leader. He hast his share of bad luck in the last 3 years. Until now, if you want to compare him to Quintana, he proved he is at least equal to him.

When did he prove this? He’s older than Quintana and hasn’t won anything important in his career. Over a long enough period of time, past performance is a great predictor of future performance. It doesn’t mean Landa can’t win a GT in the future, but the probability of he doing so are way lower than Quintana’s. Make of that what you will.

BTW, Porte is on a similar boat, although he has won a lot more over his career than “Landani”

Landa has been riding as a domestique the entire time, Quintana mostly as captain - it's two very different scenarios.

You can compare Landa to Fuglsang in that respect - except, Landa is 5 years younger.

I think we will see him be a constant podium threat the next 5 years, minimum.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

Yeah, i know there's many people who overhyping him too much. But, he's clearly one of the best climbers in the field. You can't really rate his performance by what he has won at this stage of his career. He didn't really had a chance to prove himself as a leader. He hast his share of bad luck in the last 3 years. Until now, if you want to compare him to Quintana, he proved he is at least equal to him.

When did he prove this? He’s older than Quintana and hasn’t won anything important in his career. Over a long enough period of time, past performance is a great predictor of future performance. It doesn’t mean Landa can’t win a GT in the future, but the probability of he doing so are way lower than Quintana’s. Make of that what you will.

BTW, Porte is on a similar boat, although he has won a lot more over his career than “Landani”

He's like 1 or 2 months older than Quintana. For all intent and purposed they are the same age.

 

[Alexandre B.]

Glad Quintana showed why he's better than Landa.

 

[AlexNYC]

Re: Re:

Yeah, i know there's many people who overhyping him too much. But, he's clearly one of the best climbers in the field. You can't really rate his performance by what he has won at this stage of his career. He didn't really had a chance to prove himself as a leader. He hast his share of bad luck in the last 3 years. Until now, if you want to compare him to Quintana, he proved he is at least equal to him.

When did he prove this? He’s older than Quintana and hasn’t won anything important in his career. Over a long enough period of time, past performance is a great predictor of future performance. It doesn’t mean Landa can’t win a GT in the future, but the probability of he doing so are way lower than Quintana’s. Make of that what you will.

BTW, Porte is on a similar boat, although he has won a lot more over his career than “Landani”

Landa has been riding as a domestique the entire time, Quintana mostly as captain - it's two very different scenarios.

You can compare Landa to Fuglsang in that respect - except, Landa is 5 years younger.

I think we will see him be a constant podium threat the next 5 years, minimum.

And there are very good reasons why he has been a domestique. He’s had very good opportunities to ride for himself, including this year I might add, but there’s always ‘something’. Also, no one gave Quintana anything for free in his career. He made the most of his chances in a team built around a huge star. Landa is basically being gifted Tour co-leadership because he’s Spanish.

 

[carton]

Nice win by Quintana.

But let's not overhype it. H was mainly stretching his legs. Once he had a gap he decided to go for it since he had nothing to lose and a stage win is like a red rag for Nairo. But he's old enough he know's what's what. This isn't the way he's going to ride the Tour unless he has to. And there's no way to know if he's in peak form quite yet.

 

[Red Rick]

Very, very strong win by Quintana. Can't say anything else really.

Except

Wait

Hang on

The route...

 

[RedheadDane]

Re:

Nice win by Quintana.

But let's not overhype it. H was mainly stretching his legs. Once he had a gap he decided to go for it since he had nothing to lose and a stage win is like a red rag for Nairo. But he's old enough he know's what's what. This isn't the way he's going to ride the Tour unless he has to. And there's no way to know if he's in peak form quite yet.

Well, if he hasn't quite peaked yet I'd say things are looking pretty well.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Lambrecht and Sivakov still going strong. Lambrecht is 3rd in the young riders classification, Sivakov is 5th, 59 seconds behind Lambrecht, but i'm guessing after the timetrial, those places will be reversed.

Young riders classification# Rider Name (Country) Team Result
1 Enric Mas (Spa) Quick-Step Floors 26:07:03
2 Sam Oomen (Ned) Team Sunweb 0:00:20
3 Bjorg Lambrecht (Bel) Lotto Soudal 0:02:22
4 Hugh Carthy (GBr) EF Education First-Drapac p/b Cannondale 0:02:26
5 Pavel Sivakov (Rus) Team Sky 0:03:21

 

[Samamba]

Re:

Lambrecht and Sivakov still going strong. Lambrecht is 3rd in the young riders classification, Sivakov is 5th, 59 seconds behind Lambrecht, but i'm guessing after the timetrial, those places will be reversed.

Young riders classification# Rider Name (Country) Team Result
1 Enric Mas (Spa) Quick-Step Floors 26:07:03
2 Sam Oomen (Ned) Team Sunweb 0:00:20
3 Bjorg Lambrecht (Bel) Lotto Soudal 0:02:22
4 Hugh Carthy (GBr) EF Education First-Drapac p/b Cannondale 0:02:26
5 Pavel Sivakov (Rus) Team Sky 0:03:21

Yeah, Lambrecht will lose A LOT of time in the TT. I'll be happy if he can secure his top-20 spot in the GC.
I'm positively surprised by his performance today though. He finished in front of Ion and Haig, that's pretty good.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Re: Re:

Lambrecht and Sivakov still going strong. Lambrecht is 3rd in the young riders classification, Sivakov is 5th, 59 seconds behind Lambrecht, but i'm guessing after the timetrial, those places will be reversed.

Young riders classification# Rider Name (Country) Team Result
1 Enric Mas (Spa) Quick-Step Floors 26:07:03
2 Sam Oomen (Ned) Team Sunweb 0:00:20
3 Bjorg Lambrecht (Bel) Lotto Soudal 0:02:22
4 Hugh Carthy (GBr) EF Education First-Drapac p/b Cannondale 0:02:26
5 Pavel Sivakov (Rus) Team Sky 0:03:21

Yeah, Lambrecht will lose A LOT of time in the TT. I'll be happy if he can secure his top-20 spot in the GC.
I'm positively surprised by his performance today though. He finished in front of Ion and Haig, that's pretty good.

Yesterday he only lost 15 seconds on the favorites sans Porte. Today was his "worst" day in terms of GC. The rest of the time he lost is all down to the TTT.

 

[Escarabajo]

Re: Re:

Chapeau. This must be Quintana's longest succesful solo attack ever

Nope

Care to elaborate? I'm not familiar with much of his career as from before 2012

Besides Route du Sud 2012, Dauphine 2012, Giro 2014. Nope.
Giro 2014 he was pulling on his own all the way up the finish. The other 2 were just hanging up for dear life so for all purposes that was a solo effort.
What about that Comunidad Valenciana 2017?
Additionaly the other solo efforts that didn't come to a win like Ventoux, Pailhères, Alpe, etc.

 

[Cance > TheRest]

Re: Re:

Chapeau. This must be Quintana's longest succesful solo attack ever

Nope

Care to elaborate? I'm not familiar with much of his career as from before 2012

Besides Route du Sud 2012, Dauphine 2012, Giro 2014. Nope.
Giro 2014 he was pulling on his own all the way up the finish. The other 2 were just hanging up for dear life so for all purposes that was a solo effort.
What about that Comunidad Valenciana 2017?
Additionaly the other solo efforts that didn't come to a win like Ventoux, Pailhères, Alpe, etc.

Oh yeah, the Gavia stage. That might well be the performance I was looking for to compare with today, although ofcourse it's doubtful if his attack had succeeded without the neutralization.

Dauphine 2012, I don't recall if he was in the break of the day, or if he "just" outpaced the SKY train up Joux Plane?

As for Valenciana 2017, I assume you are referring to the stage to Denia. I would not call that a solo attack. The stage to Mas de la Costa, he attacked with, what, 4km left, as the climb itself is short?

Anyway, the point was merely, that I'm happy to see him try a daring attack and wanted to have an indicator of whether he was expanding his repertoire as a GC contender by taking a chance like this today. I mean, he could have just played it defensively and gone back to the Porte group, when the gap was 20 seconds and he had to lead over the flat sections. But he didn't. So I genuinely think what he did today was something special.

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Re: Re:

Yeah, i know there's many people who overhyping him too much. But, he's clearly one of the best climbers in the field. You can't really rate his performance by what he has won at this stage of his career. He didn't really had a chance to prove himself as a leader. He hast his share of bad luck in the last 3 years. Until now, if you want to compare him to Quintana, he proved he is at least equal to him.

When did he prove this? He’s older than Quintana and hasn’t won anything important in his career. Over a long enough period of time, past performance is a great predictor of future performance. It doesn’t mean Landa can’t win a GT in the future, but the probability of he doing so are way lower than Quintana’s. Make of that what you will.

BTW, Porte is on a similar boat, although he has won a lot more over his career than “Landani”

Landa has been riding as a domestique the entire time, Quintana mostly as captain - it's two very different scenarios.

You can compare Landa to Fuglsang in that respect - except, Landa is 5 years younger.

I think we will see him be a constant podium threat the next 5 years, minimum.

And there are very good reasons why he has been a domestique. He’s had very good opportunities to ride for himself, including this year I might add, but there’s always ‘something’. Also, no one gave Quintana anything for free in his career. He made the most of his chances in a team built around a huge star. Landa is basically being gifted Tour co-leadership because he’s Spanish.

Dude, you sound more like a hater, than like someone commenting objectively.

Waste of my time, sorry to have disturbed your rant

 

[AlexNYC]

A hater? Because I don’t think he deserves co-leadership at the Tour? LOL.