Tour de Suisse, Stage 2 Sunday, June 10 Verbania - Verbier 218 km

[roundabout]

Kessiakoff did a good ride but I wouldn't favor him for a win/yellow just yet.

 

[The Sheep]

The Butcher for me

 

[will10]

Gotta love how the momentum behind one guy can pick up so easily on this forum.

And I'm not talking about Sagan, but Kessiakoff.

 

[Froome19]

Gotta love how the momentum behind one guy can pick up so easily on this forum.

And I'm not talking about Sagan, but Kessiakoff.

I have been a massive fan of his since the Vuelta yet it was all about waiting for the right time before really doing all the fanboy stuff for him.. and this opportunity is ideal.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

Gotta love how the momentum behind one guy can pick up so easily on this forum.

And I'm not talking about Sagan, but Kessiakoff.

He has the potensial to be better than Kreuziger....

 

[maltiv]

Nordhaug dissapointed me abit today, so do not think he is in quite top shape (neither do i think Kiserlovski is in top shape either) But Kessiakoff looks like he is going strong

Nordhaug is not in shape, he's been sick and was on antibiotics last week. So he won't do well tomorrow.

 

[xmoonx]

The argument that "the riders make the race" has some merit,....................And "the riders make the race" worked wonders for this year's embarrassment of a Giro. Yes, the route was bad, but not as bad as the racing. Since the riders are unwilling to race, we may as well try to force them to by making courses hard enough to create a selection even if they continue to race like cowards.

Personally I really enjoyed the GIRO and was on the edge of my seat, maybe 'cause of what I thought might happen than actually did.

Still " riders make the race" and "Since the riders are unwilling to race, we may as well try to force them to by making courses hard enough to create a selection even if they continue to race like cowards" are VALID points. To be honest however, what JROD or MScarponi etc. shoulda, coulda, woulda done, may be a thing of the past if you get my drift. I think the days of the SUPER commanding attack may be over, or few and far between.

I think the powers that be are over these events like white on rice. Makes me wonder about PG & TH for example.

 

[Squire]

What on earth has Kessiakoff done to merit such hefty predictions?

And why is nobody mentioning Valverde? He always shows up in these June races. He will tear it up tomorrow.

 

[cineteq]

The argument that "the riders make the race" has some merit, but not completely.

Ok you're not too biased then.

It would be hard for people to make up all of the time lost in the ITT on a route as bad as this year's Dauphiné even without UK Postal grinding everybody into dust. And "the riders make the race" worked wonders for this year's embarrassment of a Giro. Yes, the route was bad, but not as bad as the racing. Since the riders are unwilling to race, we may as well try to force them to by making courses hard enough to create a selection even if they continue to race like cowards.

Dauphiné is a bad example. It's just a warm up race. The Giro didn't have enough quality riders. The Tour should be different, since this year we'll have a plethora of top riders and teams with ambitions. Valverde, for instance, said he'll win the Tour. Hopefully having these many contenders will debunk your theory that this year's Tour will be a boring race because of a bad designed parcours.

 

[Publicus]

Sagan to dance like Alberto http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibVr481vCIk

By far my favorite scene from the 2009 Tour. It looks like he's saying bye to friends at the end of a group ride and heading home.

 

[BillytheKid]

Sagan to dance like Alberto http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibVr481vCIk

Sagan can hang with some of the climbers here if they mess about marking each other and don't make a move a complete attack until midway up this climb. It does come down to the riders. In this case, the GC climbers need to attack from the base of the Verbier or face the possibility of Sagan for the overall.

Sorry, I don't think will see Sagan make a Contador move here. Contador can do that. Others will need to try though to dislodge an impressive Sagan.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Ok you're not too biased then.

Dauphiné is a bad example. It's just a warm up race. The Giro didn't have enough quality riders. The Tour should be different, since this year we'll have a plethora of top riders and teams with ambitions. Valverde, for instance, said he'll win the Tour. Hopefully having these many contenders will debunk your theory that this year's Tour will be a boring race because of a bad designed parcours.

The problem is, in recent memory, the case has more been about the Giro having 10 guys trying to win and the Tour having 30 guys trying not to lose. Garmin getting on the front to pull back the break on the Pau stage in 2010 to prevent Plaza and Horner threatening Ryder Hesjedal's 10th place was the nadir of this. Yes, people want to win, but a good GC position is so important to sponsors that they often don't dare do anything that will risk their spot.

This year, you'll still have 30 guys trying not to lose. It's just that this year the Giro didn't have 10 guys trying to win, they were trying not to lose too. It's not that the Tour will be any better than usual, it's that the Giro was way worse.

Sadly, people forgot about the godawful first 2 weeks of last year's Tour because the last week was great, so it got better reviews than it deserved and the ASO thinks that the best way to make the race exciting is to make sure as little as possible happens until week 3. I'm sure the riders will be only too happy to oblige. Except that there's always a risk that few time gaps = more crashes as more riders are trying to protect something.

 

[blaxland]

The problem is, in recent memory, the case has more been about the Giro having 10 guys trying to win and the Tour having 30 guys trying not to lose. Garmin getting on the front to pull back the break on the Pau stage in 2010 to prevent Plaza and Horner threatening Ryder Hesjedal's 10th place was the nadir of this. Yes, people want to win, but a good GC position is so important to sponsors that they often don't dare do anything that will risk their spot.

This year, you'll still have 30 guys trying not to lose. It's just that this year the Giro didn't have 10 guys trying to win, they were trying not to lose too. It's not that the Tour will be any better than usual, it's that the Giro was way worse.

Sadly, people forgot about the godawful first 2 weeks of last year's Tour because the last week was great, so it got better reviews than it deserved and the ASO thinks that the best way to make the race exciting is to make sure as little as possible happens until week 3. I'm sure the riders will be only too happy to oblige. Except that there's always a risk that few time gaps = more crashes as more riders are trying to protect something.

spot on Libertine.I just really hope that the tour doesnt end up like last year,with everyone waiting until the third week to see any exciting racing..This years Giro was extremely boring with very few highlights.This Dauphine also seems to be following todays race trends,with one strong team controlling every move.Then ONLY racing the last 5-10kms or so....I dont blame the riders anymore,i blame the course designers....they should make the routes more testing,and dangerous.

 

[gregrowlerson]

Roman to take this stage.

 

[cineteq]

This year, you'll still have 30 guys trying not to lose. It's just that this year the Giro didn't have 10 guys trying to win, they were trying not to lose too. It's not that the Tour will be any better than usual, it's that the Giro was way worse.

This year there is no dominating force, such as Contador. At least everybody thinks they have chance, even if it's a slight chance like Nibali, Sanchez and Gesink do. And Wiggins and Sky, they're just a mirage. I doubt very much it's gonna be 30 guys trying not to lose.

Roman to take this stage.

Thanks, let's get back to topic.

 

[xmoonx]

spot on Libertine.I just really hope that the tour doesnt end up like last year,with everyone waiting until the third week to see any exciting racing..This years Giro was extremely boring with very few highlights.This Dauphine also seems to be following todays race trends,with one strong team controlling every move.Then ONLY racing the last 5-10kms or so....I dont blame the riders anymore,i blame the course designers....they should make the routes more testing,and dangerous.

I realize it's subjective, but how a GT that's decided on the last day and could potentially have been won by anyone of 3 or 4 riders is boring is beyond me. Also prior to the second to last stage could easily have been won by any one of 6 riders.

I imagine 5 high mountain stages 4 of which were mountain top finishes was a cakewalk but stage 20 coming on the heels of stage 19 must have a little hard. Lol, ask Cav he'll tell you.

Dangerous? What did you have in mind an active Volcanoe? A super fast and steep descent on a bad road next to a cliff?

 

[phanatic]

Sagan to dance like Alberto http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibVr481vCIk

Frank seems to be the highest placed rider present.

 

[xmoonx]

Kloden may actually race this thing I doubt he's saving anything for the Tour. Would like to see how Valverde goes he's been MIA for like a month or so.

 

[blaxland]

I realize it's subjective, but how a GT that's decided on the last day and could potentially have been won by anyone of 3 or 4 riders is boring is beyond me. Also prior to the second to last stage could easily have been won by any one of 6 riders.

I imagine 5 high mountain stages 4 of which were mountain top finishes was a cakewalk but stage 20 coming on the heels of stage 19 must have a little hard. Lol, ask Cav he'll tell you.

Dangerous? What did you have in mind an active Volcanoe? A super fast and steep descent on a bad road next to a cliff?

Regaurding cliffs and volcanos ofcourse not..I was thinking more of using cycling as we know it..Meaning more cobbled stages in Gts,more teamtime trial stages over 35kms,maybe even downhill individual tt's,something for everyone.Atm the Gts have turned into parades until the last week with riders not willing to take risks.This can be corrected by organiser making the first and second week of GTs higher/more difficult as their main priorities.But this is just my opinion.as always i still love the sport,just sometimes not the spectacle.

 

[Trofinios]

What on earth has Kessiakoff done to merit such hefty predictions?

Not that much, but when he is in shape he is quiet good, won Tour of Austria last year and did well in the Vuelta before he got stomach problems. His spring season was spoiled because of allergies. His 5th place yesterday signals that he might be back in last years shape. I'm not holding him up as a favorite or anything, but it's possible he could do well on Verbier tomorrow. I'm more worried if he will manage to be consistent over 9 days of racing.

 

[wirral]

Steephill seem to have the start time wrong. They are saying 2:20pm local time. The official website says 11:15am. It looks like they have used the start and finish time for the prologue and applied them to today's stage.

 

[Trofinios]

Nordhaug is not in shape, he's been sick and was on antibiotics last week. So he won't do well tomorrow.

Always something with Nordhaug. Hopefully he can race himself in shape and be competitive in the final stages.

 

[taiwan]

I realize it's subjective, but how a GT that's decided on the last day and could potentially have been won by anyone of 3 or 4 riders is boring is beyond me. Also prior to the second to last stage could easily have been won by any one of 6 riders.

I imagine 5 high mountain stages 4 of which were mountain top finishes was a cakewalk but stage 20 coming on the heels of stage 19 must have a little hard. Lol, ask Cav he'll tell you.

Dangerous? What did you have in mind an active Volcanoe? A super fast and steep descent on a bad road next to a cliff?

Because if on the penultimate stage there are no big gaps, nothing significant has happened in the top of the GC for 19 days.

What does Cav have to do with it? He's not even a good climber for a sprinter, I he starts designing the Giro route, we're screwed.

I don't believe Zomegnan included those elements for danger. The (safe I thought) Etna ascent for spectacle, and the Crostis descent for the Crostis ascent and it's difficulty. That was a good parcours, good race, although only one rider could win.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

I realize it's subjective, but how a GT that's decided on the last day and could potentially have been won by anyone of 3 or 4 riders is boring is beyond me. Also prior to the second to last stage could easily have been won by any one of 6 riders.

I imagine 5 high mountain stages 4 of which were mountain top finishes was a cakewalk but stage 20 coming on the heels of stage 19 must have a little hard. Lol, ask Cav he'll tell you.

Dangerous? What did you have in mind an active Volcanoe? A super fast and steep descent on a bad road next to a cliff?

The Germany-Portugal football match last night had a really exciting finish, and either team could have won it at the end.

However, for 70 minutes it was boring as sin. A great finish does not mean a great match. Hell, the Monaco GP 1982 has gone down in history because of a chaotic final 2 laps where 6 different people were in a position to win. But the first 76 laps were a parade with little of interest happening. We forget that when looking back on it nostalgically.

So yes, it is exciting when the GC mix is still in the balance in stages 19 and 20. But you can guarantee that the GC mix will still be in the balance on those stages if you don't include anything that will open gaps before that.

If a last stage showdown where you don't know who will win is all it takes to make a race exciting, they could just have three weeks of flat stages with one difficult one to finish. Would that be an exciting race?

Last year's Tour was boring. The finish was GREAT, but they made sure that it would be by making sure that the first two weeks were dull as hell.

 

[Lanark]

The Germany-Portugal football match last night had a really exciting finish, and either team could have won it at the end.

However, for 70 minutes it was boring as sin. A great finish does not mean a great match. Hell, the Monaco GP 1982 has gone down in history because of a chaotic final 2 laps where 6 different people were in a position to win. But the first 76 laps were a parade with little of interest happening. We forget that when looking back on it nostalgically.

So yes, it is exciting when the GC mix is still in the balance in stages 19 and 20. But you can guarantee that the GC mix will still be in the balance on those stages if you don't include anything that will open gaps before that.

If a last stage showdown where you don't know who will win is all it takes to make a race exciting, they could just have three weeks of flat stages with one difficult one to finish. Would that be an exciting race?

Last year's Tour was boring. The finish was GREAT, but they made sure that it would be by making sure that the first two weeks were dull as hell.

I agree with the gist of your point, but I don't think the ASO can be completely blamed for that. The first half had some good stages (Mont des Allouettes, Mur de Bretagne, Super-Besse, Saint-Flour). But the riders made a complete mockery out of the stages to Luz-Ardiden and Plateau de Beille, both great stages that are more difficult than anything we have in this year's Tour. It was still backloaded to the second half, but there was some interesting stuff in the first half of the course, it's just that the riders did little with it (certainly Luz-Ardiden).

This year's Giro route was almost a bigger disgrace, with the first real difficult mountain stage on the last thursday.