UCI questioning a small number of riders on blood values

[theswordsman]

I'll just toss in a reminder that Morkeborg didn't just compare the changes in Armstrong's Tour de France values to previous studies, but to Armstrong's from the Giro d'Italia a couple of months before.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

If I recall correctly, first thing LA's camp tried to do when Mørkeberg questioned LA's blood values was discredit the guy with the anology: "What to you call the lowest ranking graduate of medical school? A Doctor" or something along those lines.

Yes, don't judge the numbers or even speculate. If you do, you're nothing but an armchair hematologist. Unless you're Lance Armstrong or one of his supporters of course, then you can speculate and judge away.

 

[Cobblestones]

If the UCI is looking for high retics, can we assume that they are looking for EPO use, which will be used by lower level riders who cannot afford to freeze their RBCs months in advance, instead of higher level riders, who if they have a brain would only be using blood transfusions? Under this plan Armstong's funky low retics during the TdF would not raise an eyebrow.

After a blood donation the retics should climb but maybe (???) not as much as with EPO use, but that would be during training when testing frequency is very low.

Probably. Except that EPO->Hematide or something else new.

Anyway, the limits on crit and off score are ridiculously high that they're next to useless. Right now, exceeding the limits gives you a 2 week start ban for health reasons. Not a doping conviction (except if you're a speed skater and your name is Pechstein).

 

[IntheMidwest]

Yes, don't judge the numbers or even speculate. If you do, you're nothing but an armchair hematologist. Unless you're Lance Armstrong or one of his supporters of course, then you can speculate and judge away.

I'm not sure that LA will give anyone a chance this year, seeing as how the whole 45 to 43 hct switcharoo was immediately called out last year, followed by a prompt removal of all values from the LS site.......

 

[IntheMidwest]

Probably. Except that EPO->Hematide or something else new.

Anyway, the limits on crit and off score are ridiculously high that they're next to useless. Right now, exceeding the limits gives you a 2 week start ban for health reasons. Not a doping conviction (except if you're a speed skater and your name is Pechstein).

Exactly, that's why they'll never check crit immediately before a race either. I think Test to EpiT ratio is 4:1 (someone please correct me if I'm wrong). 4:1! Even if a PRO has a higher than normal value (1:1), there's no way that ratio would stay 4:1 training/racing as a living. So guys that have 1:1 are now allowed to have 4:1 - and keep it there. Guys that have a 39.5 crit are now allowed to have 43-45 as long as they keep it there the z score is within limit, which can be done quite efficiently with microdosing. Please feel free to comment

(Link below on T/TE, but most all are probably familiar b/c of FL)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epitestosterone

 

[blackcat]

Exactly, that's why they'll never check crit immediately before a race either. I think Test to EpiT ratio is 4:1 (someone please correct me if I'm wrong). 4:1! Even if a PRO has a higher than normal value (1:1), there's no way that ratio would stay 4:1 training/racing as a living. So guys that have 1:1 are now allowed to have 4:1 - and keep it there. Guys that have a 39.5 crit are now allowed to have 43-45 as long as they keep it there the z score is within limit, which can be done quite efficiently with microdosing. Please feel free to comment

(Link below on T/TE, but most all are probably familiar b/c of FL)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epitestosterone

you want to use a plant based testo gel, not the testo that is sourced from animal. I think that is correct, so you can subvert the isotope testing. If you add a little epi with the testo gel, you are sweet.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Exactly, that's why they'll never check crit immediately before a race either.

True, this is why during last year's Tour the surprise test on Astana where the testers were delayed a half-hour over coffee is so significant, as that would be the ideal time to test as discussed many times on this and other forums.

 

[blackcat]

True, this is why during last year's Tour the surprise test on Astana where the testers were delayed a half-hour over coffee is so significant, as that would be the ideal time to test as discussed many times on this and other forums.

yeah, but did that cause them to leave their trash out cos they were pressed for time? The UCI might have been smarter than you give 'em credit for.

 

[IntheMidwest]

you want to use a plant based testo gel, not the testo that is sourced from animal. I think that is correct, so you can subvert the isotope testing. If you add a little epi with the testo gel, you are sweet.

Can the ratio be manipulated with the supplementation of DHEA? See the bottom of my wiki link in the purple box (Cholesterol and steroid metabolic intermediates). Check out what appears right next to Epitestosterone. For the most part DHEA is taken as a post cycle therapy by some since it can convert to either estrogen or T. Or taken while on an estrogen blocker since it would only convert to T in that scenario. Why the hell else would PRO be controled for DHEA if it's not performance enhancing? Just a thought..

 

[BroDeal]

Kirk, Spock, McCoy, and Ensign Ricky get put into the UCI bio passport program. Guess who gets questioned about his profile.