USADA - Armstrong

[Anonymous]

One thing that most overlook in this melee is the COLOSSAL incompetence of USADA in all of this. If LA is proven to be guilty as charged then conversely USADA will also be proven to be guilty from the CEO on down -of incredible incompetence. If LA is proven guilty, I for one am very happy to see the proverbial clock cleaned, but also think that Tygart and the rest of the idiots at usada that allowed this to go one for a decade under their very noses should also go down in flames. It stands to reason that no one can get away with cheating unless the system that oversees them is either incompetent or corrupt. Neither of those conditions is acceptable.

Lots of specifics in there to support the incompetence.

 

[Ninety5rpm]

Do you have one or two words left to actually describe said incompetence?

I think he believes that if Armstrong is proven guilty that means he got away with it for all those years, which in and of itself proves that the people in charge of finding cheats (which he seems to assume is the USADA) are incompetent.

Never mind that the Armstrong method was all about using Ferrari's expertise to fool the tests and testers, and that until his associates began to sing at the Federal trial they simply had no evidence.

 

[Orvieto]

One thing that most overlook in this melee is the COLOSSAL incompetence of USADA in all of this. If LA is proven to be guilty as charged then conversely USADA will also be proven to be guilty from the CEO on down -of incredible incompetence. If LA is proven guilty, I for one am very happy to see the proverbial clock cleaned, but also think that Tygart and the rest of the idiots at usada that allowed this to go one for a decade under their very noses should also go down in flames. It stands to reason that no one can get away with cheating unless the system that oversees them is either incompetent or corrupt. Neither of those conditions is acceptable.

Huh? Did you take a logic break? If they successfully catch a drug cheat they prove themselves incompetent for not doing it sooner?

By your delusional logic, those buffoons at CERN should resign in shame if they find Higgs boson now. After all, they've been looking for it for decades. Finding it now only proves their colossal incompetence .

 

[PedalPusher]

So if US Court issues injunction then USADA turns over case to WADA? Wouldn't the injunction prevent that? But if WADA assumes the case then it's outside US jurisdiction?

First that injunction would have to be permanent, which it won't be until a hearing on the merits of the injunction, which have already been tried before, and failed.

Lance's legal team grasping at straws...

 

[aphronesis]

Huh? Did you take a logic break? If they successfully catch a drug cheat they prove themselves incompetent for not doing it sooner?

By your delusional logic, those buffoons at CERN should resign in shame if they find Higgs boson now. After all, they've been looking for it for decades. Finding it now only proves their colossal incompetence .

Not remotely parallel, he has a basic point, no matter how expressed.

 

[shawnrohrbach]

111 pages is a data dump. It is a desperation play that hopes a local judge is a groupie who will ignore the law and delay things for a while. I can't see how any of it will ever stand up.

Did Lance even read the contract he signed with the UCI?



That USADA is not a state actor has been proven many times. USADA wins.

Having worked for several years in a law firm (not as a lawyer but as a construction and technology specialist)aggressive people pay lawyers to change the rules when it suits them (i.e. that was a silly contract) and they very often find judges who see it their way and rule in their favor. It's the American Way, if you can afford it.

 

[MacRoadie]

Huh? Did you take a logic break? If they successfully catch a drug cheat they prove themselves incompetent for not doing it sooner?

By your delusional logic, those buffoons at CERN should resign in shame if they find Higgs boson now. After all, they've been looking for it for decades. Finding it now only proves their colossal incompetence .

The great NASA coverup: Wilbur and Orville should have landed on the moon in 1903, but it took an additional 66 years of incompetence to finish the job.

 

[Anonymous]

Not remotely parallel, he has a basic point, no matter how expressed.

No, actually he does not.

 

[MarkvW]

First that injunction would have to be permanent, which it won't be until a hearing on the merits of the injunction, which have already been tried before, and failed.

Lance's legal team grasping at straws...

If Lance can keep the case alive and defeat the expected motion to stay discovery pending resolution of the motion to dismiss then he can use the expansive discovery provisions of the federal rules to discover every last little thing that USADA knows about him. That, alone, is a good reason for bringing the case. Not a legitimate reason, but . . .

 

[Oldman]

Having worked for several years in a law firm (not as a lawyer but as a construction and technology specialist)aggressive people pay lawyers to change the rules when it suits them (i.e. that was a silly contract) and they very often find judges who see it their way and rule in their favor. It's the American Way, if you can afford it.

No doubt the basis for an injunction in TEXAS federal court. If they grant the injunction it will be appealled by USADA to higher venue; wouldn't it? Just a stall tactic to find time to silence more witnesses.

 

[ggusta]

I think Armstrong should come clean and ask for forgiveness. It wouldn't dramatically change most people's opinions of him, and inside the sport it is already known about.

I think this would be the rational thing to do but we are dealing with a narcissist of incalculable proportions. This course of action would be the very last thing he would ever do although it would probably be the safest course of action for the value of his name which I think ought to be his primary concern. He'd survive coming clean now without the degree of damage he would have suffered 5 or 6 years ago. I just don't think he has it in him.

Oh yeah, and for all you self deluding sycophants, yes, and of course, he could be telling the truth, and Santa could leave those Swedish bikini model sex-addict cheerleaders under my fireplace mantle a few months early this year.

 

[Microchip]

 

[PedalPusher]

If Lance can keep the case alive and defeat the expected motion to stay discovery pending resolution of the motion to dismiss then he can use the expansive discovery provisions of the federal rules to discover every last little thing that USADA knows about him. That, alone, is a good reason for bringing the case. Not a legitimate reason, but . . .

That is a stretch to get to discovery. He asked for an injunction based on constitutional protections. His team is grasping. The law is pretty clear here and precedent.

Graham v. United States Anti-Doping Agency, 2011 U.S. Dist. LEXIS 34637 (D.N.C. 2011)

The court stated, "Again, although Graham, similar to Lee, purports to present claims outside of the Amateur Sports Act, namely, under the Constitution and the law of slander, ultimately, he is contesting his eligibility to coach amateur athletes involved in Olympic sports, a remedy only available under the Amateur Sports Act. Consequently, these claims are outside the subject matter jurisdiction of this court. The court further notes that the two exceptions to this general rule, as laid out in Lee, do not apply in this case. First, the court does recognize that it has a limited role in ensuring that the amateur sports organizations follow their own rules for determining eligibility. However, in this case, USADA followed the proper protocol in determining the proper sanction for Graham. USADA offered arbitration to Graham, but he subsequently withdrew.8 As a result of the withdrawal, [*19] Graham was subject to any sanction proposed by USADA, which in this case was a lifetime ban from coaching amateur athletes involved in Olympic sports. Second, although the court is in recognition that the Amateur Sports Act does not explicitly preempt a federal right independent of those conferred by the Act, this exception is not applicable here as Graham's claims are, once again, labeled as violations of constitutional rights and slander, but essentially seek to challenge his eligibility to coach amateur Olympic athletes. Therefore, USADA's Motion to Dismiss [DE-19] is ALLOWED for lack of subject matter jurisdiction. Because these claims are dismissed pursuant to Rule 12(b)(1), the court does not reach USADA's ground for dismissal pursuant to Rule 12(b)(6)."

So we have subject matter jurisdiction before we even get to Lance's crazy claims.

That arbitration is mandated by the Ted Stevens Olympic and Amateur Sports Act, which includes a due process checklist that delineates athletes’ procedural rights. Any appeals of the arbitrators’ decision would be heard by the Court of Arbitration for Sport, sport’s highest authority, and that decision would be final.

 

[Race Radio]

My favorite part of the complaint so far

At the age of 12, Mr. Armstrong finished fourth for his age group in the Texas youth swimming championships in the 1,500- meter freestyle event.

 

[D-Queued]

My favorite part of the complaint so far

At the age of 12, Mr. Armstrong finished fourth for his age group in the Texas youth swimming championships in the 1,500- meter freestyle event.

He must have been the kid doing the backstroke in the pool on a bicycle.

(just trying to connect the dots here to understand the relevance)

Dave.

 

[Microchip]

My favorite part of the complaint so far

Quote:
At the age of 12, Mr. Armstrong finished fourth for his age group in the Texas youth swimming championships in the 1,500- meter freestyle event.

That sentence alone must've cost $__________ . ___ !

 

[MacRoadie]

Maybe a good time to fire up the sticky at the top of the page and incorporate some of the legal links for quick reference?

 

[Orvieto]

Not remotely parallel, he has a basic point, no matter how expressed.

It's absolutely parallel. His only point is that USADA should have found evidence of Lance's cheating sooner,and only incompetence prevented them. Feel free to point out the flaw in the parallel to CERN finding the Higgs boson. Both agencies were looking to establish a truth, both took time and various directions of inquiry to collect evidence. Both made their cases when they thought they'd established sufficient proof.

The OP is simply lashing out. It's called shooting the messenger.

 

[Mount Megiddo]

I think this would be the rational thing to do but we are dealing with a narcissist of incalculable proportions. This course of action would be the very last thing he would ever do although it would probably be the safest course of action for the value of his name which I think ought to be his primary concern. He'd survive coming clean now without the degree of damage he would have suffered 5 or 6 years ago. I just don't think he has it in him.

Oh yeah, and for all you self deluding sycophants, yes, and of course, he could be telling the truth, and Santa could leave those Swedish bikini model sex-addict cheerleaders under my fireplace mantle a few months early this year.

It looked like he was considering coming clean until USADA made the decison to go after seven tours. I wonder who made the call.

 

[Anonymous]

My favorite part of the complaint so far

Last clean performance?

 

[on3m@n@rmy]

Last clean performance?

No. First experimental performance

 

[spetsa]

Last clean performance?

Post of the day!

 

[Square-pedaller]

It looked like he was considering coming clean until USADA made the decison to go after seven tours.

That's one I haven't heard before. Where does that come from?

 

[Clemson Cycling]

It looked like he was considering coming clean until USADA made the decison to go after seven tours. I wonder who made the call.

If they succeed, and I think Lance has the law (or the people that make it anyway), who gets the wins

 

[ggusta]

It looked like he was considering coming clean until USADA made the decison to go after seven tours. I wonder who made the call.

Perhaps he may yet still cut that deal if in fact it was ever offered.