USADA - Armstrong

[LauraLyn]

So the dream is alive?
That Lance was employed at a company that didn't follow US labor laws?
Is the dream alive that the governing body of his sport allows cheaters to continue...if the reason is really,really good?
If these guys broke the rules and get a deferred so that they can promote federation races and make money,I hope the court weighs that

Yups. After USADA arbitration. After CAS. After a Swiss appeal.

Thus, not much of a dream.

 

[serottasyclist]

No.

You cannot challenge in Federal court and then pretend it doesn't matter.

If he doesn't arbitrate, it means he has been abandoned.

When the Federal court dismisses that challenge without prejudice, and without deciding on the issue of whether or not USADA has a right to sanction you, you can certainly still pretend the sanction doesn't matter.

 

[fatandfast]

The 300000 cycling fans dropped him years ago. The millions of cancer groupies are still willing dupes.

Was he to maintain a fan base while not racing? Dropped from his 140 character money maker?
He is an icon..to me no.to you no.but have seen yellow bracelets in Olympic coverage..little league world series..why are they not getting the message

 

[Race Radio]

No.

You cannot challenge in Federal court and then pretend it doesn't matter.

If he doesn't arbitrate, it means he has been abandoned.

He will pretend the process is rigged and he cannot get a fair arbitration hearing

 

[fatandfast]

He will pretend the process is rigged and he cannot get a fair arbitration hearing

And this is not true?

 

[DirtyWorks]

Armstrong was only an employee of the teams he raced for and whose jerseys he wore when he raced.

Yes, maybe, no. He had/has a role in the Tailwind corporation and Capital Sports and Entertainment and effectively called the shots from what has been gathered.

How that works out legally in regards to his status as the legal definition of an "employee" I don't have a clue. Colloquially, he was at minimum one of the bosses.

 

[the big ring]

And this is not true?

No.

The rules must be followed to the letter or he has recourse.
The panel is independent and 1/3 of his choosing.

 

[Oldman]

Was he to maintain a fan base while not racing? Dropped from his 140 character money maker?
He is an icon..to me no.to you no.but have seen yellow bracelets in Olympic coverage..little league world series..why are they not getting the message

They can't/don't read? Most people get their news through habitual sources and frankly; we are in our own little world here.
Speaking to a former racer, cancer survivor and Lance idolator (still has the poster down in his training room); he treated any information I presented as heresay and was skeptical when shown Mr. Ashendon's comments and other developments. He is normally a rational individual but it's clear you cannot discount the level of internal faith he gained during his cancer treatment.
My departed Dad was leery of icons and he and his oncologist discussed the pending developments over a year ago. That resulted in the doctor removing his yellow band as did everyone in his unit. They just didn't have the time to follow up on the news and the symbol had become so generalized as a sign of support. Not as simple as: Lance is evil or good.

 

[MacRoadie]

From "never cheated, never doped, passed 600 tests" to this:

That Lance was employed at a company that didn't follow US labor laws?

Only problem is, he was a co-owner. Does he sue himself?

 

[DirtyWorks]

From "never cheated, never doped, passed 600 tests" to this:

Originally Posted by fatandfast
That Lance was employed at a company that didn't follow US labor laws?

Post of the day! Regardless of what may come later on. Maybe it's time to make some yellow anodized tin foil hats for the faithful.

 

[86TDFWinner]

I just can't see him wanting to go to arbitration with USADA. He knows they have enough on him to do major damage, and the endless witness appearances would destroy his public image. No way he can discredit more than 10 witnesses, especially when their stories corroborate.

Not long to wait to find out what the next move will be.

Spot on!!! It's a shame lance can't comprehend any of this. When you've lived in Denial land for so long, you just can't think straight. i think it's time he come face to face w/reality and realize: he's BUSTED!!!!

 

[fatandfast]

Oldman I go with Dad. Lance is the greatest racer of our generation. I am amused that our paths crossed at Ocean Beach bike shop,wed rides, Zigguratt and other informal rides . He is no guru. The guy was good when he raced Kenny Souza at his start. He trained with Tinley,Molina and Scott to start.

The guy is was extraordinary from his beginning

If he upended bike racing fine. But doping? No dope in the NHL,NBA,FIFA teams?
This is the UCI and it's smallness. Dopers are all over.from drisage to world leaders trying to look viral to the voter..leave my sport alone..give everyone Rubios and this is done.

 

[86TDFWinner]

Post of the day! Regardless of what may come later on. Maybe it's time to make some yellow anodized tin foil hats for the faithful.

Please make sure they're in the shape of hockey helmets, and they MUST have chin straps too.

 

[Susan Westemeyer]

As to the "employee" question, that would depend on his contract. In Europe, most pro cyclists are most certainly not employees, but are free-lancers who contract to provide a service.

Obviously I do not know whether this applies to Amstrong, but it is just as possible as the application of US labour laws. Especially since his last few teams were not US based.

Susan

 

[User Guide]

Spot on!!! It's a shame lance can't comprehend any of this. When you've lived in Denial land for so long, you just can't think straight. i think it's time he come face to face w/reality and realize: he's BUSTED!!!!

I dont think hes in denial land, more "string this out while I squirrel away these ill gotten millions" land.

 

[DirtyWorks]

CN does a nice summary and brings up the suppressed positive story again while elegantly quoting Ashenden.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/ashenden-says-mcquaid-must-now-help-usadas-investigation

Though I think Ashenden is wrong about McQuaid being the source of problems. Hein is part of the problem.

Overall, very nice bit of journalism.

 

[DirtyWorks]

As to the "employee" question, that would depend on his contract. In Europe, most pro cyclists are most certainly not employees, but are free-lancers who contract to provide a service.

Obviously I do not know whether this applies to Amstrong, but it is just as possible as the application of US labour laws. Especially since his last few teams were not US based.

Susan

Right! Add jurisdiction into the question of employee status and there's an even bigger puzzle to sort out.

 

[eyemgh]

And this is not true?

The only "evidence" Armstrong has offered is that the USADA has a very high success rate. What do they call a DA or a defense lawyer with a high success rate? GOOD. The USADA ONLY CONTESTS EGREGIOUS CASES THEY ARE LIKELY TO WIN ON THE EVIDENCE.

M

 

[Mishrak]

Was he to maintain a fan base while not racing? Dropped from his 140 character money maker?
He is an icon..to me no.to you no.but have seen yellow bracelets in Olympic coverage..little league world series..why are they not getting the message

I think they aren't getting the message because in the US, the mainstream sports media really doesn't care about cycling very much. Should this go to arbitration, I'd expect some stuff to hit the front pages, but most of these bigger articles we've been getting lately haven't so much as scratched the front page of ESPN's website.

 

[Weapons of @ss Destruction]

The panel is independent and 1/3 of his choosing.

It's actually 1/2 by his choosing, since 1/2 of one of the other 1/3s is a shared selection. In other words, Team LA and USADA participate exactly equally in the selection of arbiters.

 

[Benotti69]

Oldman I go with Dad. Lance is the greatest racer of our generation. I am amused that our paths crossed at Ocean Beach bike shop,wed rides, Zigguratt and other informal rides . He is no guru. The guy was good when he raced Kenny Souza at his start. He trained with Tinley,Molina and Scott to start.

The guy is was extraordinary from his beginning

If he upended bike racing fine. But doping? No dope in the NHL,NBA,FIFA teams?
This is the UCI and it's smallness. Dopers are all over.from drisage to world leaders trying to look viral to the voter..leave my sport alone..give everyone Rubios and this is done.

You weren't spewing this stuff a few years ago! He was clean then and the greatest. Now he is dirty and still the greatest. Cant be both!

Dopers are cheats. Nothing great about them only to sad people who live the life of lies themselves.

 

[thehog]

As to the "employee" question, that would depend on his contract. In Europe, most pro cyclists are most certainly not employees, but are free-lancers who contract to provide a service.

Obviously I do not know whether this applies to Amstrong, but it is just as possible as the application of US labour laws. Especially since his last few teams were not US based.

Susan

Read: Bosman ruling: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosman_ruling

In EU - restraint of trade.

 

[the big ring]

It's actually 1/2 by his choosing, since 1/2 of one of the other 1/3s is a shared selection. In other words, Team LA and USADA participate exactly equally in the selection of arbiters.

I didn't consider 1/2 of a person as a valid construct, but agreed, he does have a say in the third person, but directly chooses the first one.

Either way, it's fair.

 

[Benotti69]

Bill 'BS' Strickland interviews Betsy

http://www.bicycling.com/news/pro-cycling/5-questions-betsy-andreu

great line Betsy

This is arguably the biggest fraud in the history of sport. Bernie Madoff would be proud. Maybe even jealous

Chapeau

 

[Epicycle]

Yups. After USADA arbitration. After CAS. After a Swiss appeal.

Thus, not much of a dream.

It's important to note that it's rare for the Swiss Federal Tribunal to actually hear an appeal of a CAS verdict. It's happened fewer than 10 times in CAS history.