Teams & Riders Vincenzo Nibali discussion thread

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So, in a few hours we will finally see if two years of sandbagging to achieve the underdog status in the Olympics will pay off.
I noticed in these two years that whenever he is not wearing the Trek jersey he tends to perform better so... The Shark of Messina, Master of Voodoo, Lord of the Bags, your time has come to silence the doubters, drop 'em all and get that gold medal.
 
Turns out it was a harakiri move.

Any comments from after the race?
"We missed the final result but we raced really well, we played our cards right. We tried to anticipate several times, I came out at the right time with Evenepoel: we tried but they didn't give us space and at that point we made the pace to let Bettiol and Moscon take the climb in the first positions. Also because those who tried actions, like me and Remco, paid later. Alberto's cramp?  In such hot and humid days it can happen."

Everyone always expects great things from Nibali, what do you think?

And the answer is laconic, accompanied by a smile: "Maybe I have accustomed you too well...".
 
Here's more:

"For me it was a very difficult Olympics, a bit of a difficult year, we tried to race as a team but it wasn't enough".

"The heat was there for everyone, it was not easy to manage. It's hard to try to set important goals, sometimes the body is not super for special appointments and cramps can also arrive. We filed this day away, now I have to breathe and then I'll think about the end of the season. Sometimes you have to see the glass half full. Yes, considering the athletes on the podium it was definitely needed the best Nibali".
 
Here's more:

"For me it was a very difficult Olympics, a bit of a difficult year, we tried to race as a team but it wasn't enough".

"The heat was there for everyone, it was not easy to manage. It's hard to try to set important goals, sometimes the body is not super for special appointments and cramps can also arrive. We filed this day away, now I have to breathe and then I'll think about the end of the season. Sometimes you have to see the glass half full. Yes, considering the athletes on the podium it was definitely needed the best Nibali".
Tbh it's not like I'm expecting the best Nibali at Astana either (and would we really want to see that? maybe a topic for the clinic) as he's not getting any younger but the Trek seasons have been kind of a disaster for him. Maybe a change of air is what is needed to have a shot at one last bite.
 
"We missed the final result but we raced really well, we played our cards right. We tried to anticipate several times, I came out at the right time with Evenepoel: we tried but they didn't give us space and at that point we made the pace to let Bettiol and Moscon take the climb in the first positions. Also because those who tried actions, like me and Remco, paid later. Alberto's cramp?  In such hot and humid days it can happen."

Everyone always expects great things from Nibali, what do you think?

And the answer is laconic, accompanied by a smile: "Maybe I have accustomed you too well...".
He didn't expect great things. But he set the target, he came to Tokyo with a job to do and he played the role in the function of his team.
 
He didn't expect great things. But he set the target, he came to Tokyo with a job to do and he played the role in the function of his team.
That move with Remco needed a few more guys and a better terrain. Bettiol was the protected rider, best climber (sounds weird), best shape in the team, if the final selection comes on Mikuni. Italy played it to their possibilities, Ciccone first to thin the peloton, then Caruso with an attempt (both far from their best). By the time Nibali went the group should have been much smaller. I think he and the team knew that he can't climb with the best on Mikuni.
 
That move with Remco needed a few more guys and a better terrain. Bettiol was the protected rider, best climber (sounds weird), best shape in the team, if the final selection comes on Mikuni. Italy played it to their possibilities, Ciccone first to thin the peloton, then Caruso with an attempt (both far from their best). By the time Nibali went the group should have been much smaller. I think he and the team knew that he can't climb with the best on Mikuni.
In all honestly I had expected the group to be smaller going over Fuji and for that chaotic racing to be happen the entire section between the big climbs. It was basically too late when the Nibali/Evenepoel move happened unless it was someone who would've made the final selection anyway.

But yeah, realistic expectations. I don't really think there's much to be had from the leftovers of the season now.
 
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Here's more:

"For me it was a very difficult Olympics, a bit of a difficult year, we tried to race as a team but it wasn't enough".

"The heat was there for everyone, it was not easy to manage. It's hard to try to set important goals, sometimes the body is not super for special appointments and cramps can also arrive. We filed this day away, now I have to breathe and then I'll think about the end of the season. Sometimes you have to see the glass half full. Yes, considering the athletes on the podium it was definitely needed the best Nibali".
Nominally weaker climbers Bettiol and Moscon who did not have the luxury of doing the Tour made it over Mikuni within 30 seconds of the best, but it needed the best Nibali.

Yeah, sure.
 
Nominally weaker climbers Bettiol and Moscon who did not have the luxury of doing the Tour made it over Mikuni within 30 seconds of the best, but it needed the best Nibali.

Yeah, sure.
Tbh I think the lead group did Mikuni in 23'30 so still really slow, so it seems like the heat and attrition, instead of increasing gaps just dulls any edge the intrinsically better climbers have.
 
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Nominally weaker climbers Bettiol and Moscon who did not have the luxury of doing the Tour made it over Mikuni within 30 seconds of the best, but it needed the best Nibali.

Yeah, sure.
Wasn't Pogacar and a few others with nominally weaker Bettiol when he made it over Mikuni? In training a few days before Bettiol did the climb with 6 W/kg, in race I think he was with Woods and I saw posted here that he did 5.7. There wasn't a wattsfest obviously, heat, humidity, 200 km but it's even debatable if 2007 Lombardia Nibali could have been able to drop all on this climb in these conditions. Nevertheless that Nibali could have had a chance to win, maybe even last year if there's a normal season. He was on track for a spring Giro.
 
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Wasn't Pogacar and a few others with nominally weaker Bettiol when he made it over Mikuni? In training a few days before Bettiol did the climb with 6 W/kg, in race I think he was with Woods and I saw posted here that he did 5.7. There wasn't a wattsfest obviously, heat, humidity, 200 km but it's even debatable if 2007 Lombardia Nibali could have been able to drop all on this climb in these conditions. Nevertheless that Nibali could have had a chance to win, maybe even last year if there's a normal season. He was on track for a spring Giro.
One way it's weirdly different is on Mikuni they were trying to not only get a gap but also extend it on the climb cause of the distance left, so it was raced quite like a GT climb. Civiglio would be raced much more akin a classic climb, just get the gap. Also, because it was so far from the finish, the true climbing ability there was somewhat hidden by not treating it like a MTF.

But it's also like nobody really had an ideal prep for this race. Tour was too short by, without Tour there wasn't really a solid prep, and nobody had really raced in these conditions before.
 
Wasn't Pogacar and a few others with nominally weaker Bettiol when he made it over Mikuni? In training a few days before Bettiol did the climb with 6 W/kg, in race I think he was with Woods and I saw posted here that he did 5.7. There wasn't a wattsfest obviously, heat, humidity, 200 km but it's even debatable if 2007 Lombardia Nibali could have been able to drop all on this climb in these conditions. Nevertheless that Nibali could have had a chance to win, maybe even last year if there's a normal season. He was on track for a spring Giro.
That's the crux of the problem, why was Bettiol's level not attainable for Nibali despite his more than decent 1-day record (so he knows how to be good an a particular day), climbing ability and better preparation.

I don't believe that Nibali is intrinsically a worse rider than Bettiol on this parcours even at the current age for both.
 
That's the crux of the problem, why was Bettiol's level not attainable for Nibali despite his more than decent 1-day record (so he knows how to be good an a particular day), climbing ability and better preparation.

I don't believe that Nibali is intrinsically a worse rider than Bettiol on this parcours even at the current age for both.
I'd consider six Monument podiums including three wins as an exceptional 1-day record, hopefully it's not his age but rather a bad overall year.
 
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I’m disappointed with his result. Is this why he left the Tour so early? just one small attack like this and it’s over?
the italians can’t be happy with this result. They took control of the race with 5 guys and 5 min later it was over.
Had expected another role for Caruso also.
 

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