Vuelta a España Vuelta a España 2023, stage 1: Barcelona - Barcelona (14.8k / TTT)

[Mcgrave]

According De Gendt they needed to drive 6 km in city traffic to get on the team bus..

 

[Riek s]

a) The weather made it darker than it otherwise would've been b) streetlights exist (has no-one here been out at night?) c) The teams, riders, fans, etc have known for months that they'd be finishing in the dark. No-one cared. Do you know why? because its not actually a problem!

regarding b). There were many streets without any streetlights (i think even the finish part was one of them).

The biggest issue was that there wasn't any accomodation to give enough light. The complaints were they didn't see anything, streets with no lights and only car lights that made things worse due to reflection. as light source. If they did like they typically do in dark races is to have adequate lights on the parcour and especially the corners.

 

[Red Rick]

Only watched the highlights but I cannot see how you can come away from this thinking anything other than this was a massive fail by the organizers. Even if you think this was perfectly save (which I don't) the visibility so obviously made this an unfair competition that never should have been allowed.

And regarding Remco, I cannot believe him complaining about the obvious safety issue despite gaining time on his most dangerous opponents can be seen as anything but a positive character trait. But I suppose certain people want to make sure controversial characters remain controversial, no matter what.

1. Visibility being unfair alone doesn't mean it should never be allowed as you can then also just apply that to any TT affected by weather. It simply got dangerous.

2. Evenepoel gaining time had nothing to do with the visibility. So I don't know how Vingegaard flatting makes Evenepoels complaints a more positive thing.

 

[roundabout]

With opening stage/prologue ITT's the teams at least can choose the order of their riders.

Those can be obviously affected by the weather too, but at least there is more flexibility.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

DSM won't win, that's for sure.

aged well,
says me in the clear light of day.

 

[Jagartrott]

According De Gendt they needed to drive 6 km in city traffic to get on the team bus..

Amazing organisation

https://twitter.com/x/status/1695532979278225623

View: https://twitter.com/DeGendtThomas/status/1695532979278225623

 

[samhocking]

You must be trolling. There is nothing to debate here, it's simply a question of lightness versus darkness. And all teams should have the same lighting conditions. It's simply unacceptable that you have some teams racing in daylight, others in darkness. Weather conditions are out of everybody's control, when to start a race program no. This was simply the complete failure of the Vuelta organization to recognize a fundamental problem or, worse, underdtood the dynamics, but refused to make a correction.

I think the organisers probably set everything up for the perfect summers evening TTT and podium in the sunset etc and it would have looked amazing in that softening light for TV, but TV is king and so when it was obvious the light wasn't going to be in the streets for the last few offs not much could be changed.

Sounds like CPA will be calling for todays stage to be GC neutral if it's similar conditions again so hopefully the orgiansiers make the right call this time.

 

[Red Rick]

Amazing organisation

https://twitter.com/x/status/1695532979278225623

View: https://twitter.com/DeGendtThomas/status/1695532979278225623

"without lights"

If only there were things like lights to put on a bicycle.

But this is just this case where "Organisers did like 2 things wrong so now we get to flame them for 500 things again"

 

[Red Rick]

I think the organisers probably set everything up for the perfect summers evening TTT and podium in the sunset etc and it would have looked amazing in that softening light for TV, but TV is king and so when it was obvious the light wasn't going to be in the streets for the last few offs not much could be changed.

Sounds like CPA will be calling for todays stage to be GC neutral if it's similar conditions again so hopefully the orgiansiers make the right call this time.

If CPA wants today stage to be neutral they should just diaf tbh.

Nothing wrong with today. Just rain.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Of course Adam Hansen has to make a dumbass remark about being fined and setting a bad example etc. I couldn't give a rats ass about that, but we might as well sit here today with Remco and Roglic having crashed out.

 

[Extinction]

I think the organisers probably set everything up for the perfect summers evening TTT and podium in the sunset etc and it would have looked amazing in that softening light for TV, but TV is king and so when it was obvious the light wasn't going to be in the streets for the last few offs not much could be changed.

Sounds like CPA will be calling for todays stage to be GC neutral if it's similar conditions again so hopefully the orgiansiers make the right call this time.

It's Spanish culture to do things later and I really think this clouded their judgment. They would not start an opening TTT that late in France or Italy (unless it was a nightime TTT for everybody, not just the last teams). It's a thrill to enjoy the Barcelona movida after dark, not so much negotiating treacherous curves in the dark on a bicycle in rank and file at speed. This simply should have been accounted for, but wasn't.

 

[Jagartrott]

"without lights"

If only there were things like lights to put on a bicycle.

But this is just this case where "Organisers did like 2 things wrong so now we get to flame them for 500 things again"

Riders should not have to navigate 6 km through evening city traffic to get back to their busses. It's on the organisers to either make sure the busses are close-by, or there is some kind of traffic-free route to busses further away. You want to organize an evening race in a major city - then also deal with the difficulties, and don't shift responsibility to teams (cf. 'just install lights on your (TT) bikes').

 

[roundabout]

It is kind of funny (and also sad) that Grand Saint Bernard got proactively nerfed in the Giro while here everyone is being reactive (they are still right to react, but that contrast is a bit too much).

It's obviously up to the riders to decide, but maybe (just maybe) the people running the CPA are not suited for their roles.

 

[Rackham]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1695695178986574124

View: https://twitter.com/Laura_Meseguer/status/1695695178986574124?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1695695178986574124%7Ctwgr%5Ea91f0881aa58271dd7e92bd4fe471f60e0effb9d%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Flegruppetto.fr%2Fforum%2Fviewtopic.php%3Ff%3D12t%3D19235start%3D540

 

[Wyndbrook]

It's Spanish culture to do things later and I really think this clouded their judgment. They would not start an opening TTT that late in France or Italy. It's a thrill to enjoy the Barcelona movida after dark, not so much negotiating treacherous curves in the dark on a bicycle in rank and file at speed. This simply should have been accounted for, but wasn't.

Totally agree, it all comes down the constant failure to have proper risk assessments reviewing all the possible situations.
What if it rains and it's dark, not difficult to envisage.

 

[Red Rick]

Riders should not have to navigate 6 km through evening city traffic to get back to their busses. It's on the organisers to either make sure the busses are close-by, or there is some kind of traffic-free route to busses further away. You want to organize an evening race in a major city - then also deal with the difficulties, and don't shift responsibility to teams (cf. 'just install lights on your (TT) bikes').

Riders have to navigate from the finish to the bus or hotel all the time. It's super standard. If it rains on Angliru riders will have to go down amidst rain, other riders still climbing, and fans.

And once again, everyone knew about this beforehand but nobody complains until after the fact.

 

[search]

Riders should not have to navigate 6 km through evening city traffic to get back to their busses. It's on the organisers to either make sure the busses are close-by, or there is some kind of traffic-free route to busses further away.

According to the roadbook, there was a parking area for teams (white P on red ground) at the start as well as at the finish. On street view, both look spacious enough to park the bus.

So either things changed, or some teams decided to just use the one at the start (5k away from the finish)

 

[Gigs_98]

1. Visibility being unfair alone doesn't mean it should never be allowed as you can then also just apply that to any TT affected by weather. It simply got dangerous.

2. Evenepoel gaining time had nothing to do with the visibility. So I don't know how Vingegaard flatting makes Evenepoels complaints a more positive thing.

1. You can't plan the weather. You can plan the starting time. I guess you are entitled to your own opinion, I'm just really surprised someone thinks about it like that.

2. Because the result will always have a lot to do with the mood of a rider after the race, no matter what made the result look like it does. Remco was angry despite being one of the big winners of the day. I just think it's nice to see his complaints really did come entirely from concerns independent of his gc ambitions.

 

[Wyndbrook]

Riders have to navigate from the finish to the bus or hotel all the time. It's super standard. If it rains on Angliru riders will have to go down amidst rain, other riders still climbing, and fans.

And once again, everyone knew about this beforehand but nobody complains until after the fact.

Afraid for once I disagree with you, your comparisons are not the same.
Riding in a major city in traffic with no lights is just not acceptable, not by the organisers , or by the kid on his bike who I almost hit last night.

 

[tobydawq]

I think the organisers probably set everything up for the perfect summers evening TTT and podium in the sunset etc and it would have looked amazing in that softening light for TV, but TV is king and so when it was obvious the light wasn't going to be in the streets for the last few offs not much could be changed.

Sounds like CPA will be calling for todays stage to be GC neutral if it's similar conditions again so hopefully the orgiansiers make the right call this time.

They're gonna make a stage with a murito in the final 3 kms GC neutral? Good luck with that.

 

[Red Rick]

They're gonna make a stage with a murito in the final 3 kms GC neutral? Good luck with that.

Everyone flats and claims 3km rule?

 

[roundabout]

Take the times at 10k to go or something like that if they want to go down that route

 

[Valv.Piti]

Nah man, its rain come on now.

 

[stekelegel]

It's just the combination of an inner city route with rain and darkness combined. The race wasnt fair and conditions were really dangerous. Riders who trained for months for this race are elimanted in the first few km.
As an organiser you cant control the weather, you can choose the starting hour but everybody here can see that they wanted to be an the commercially most interesting time. If you take that risk, the choose an easier route, with just straight roads and make sure the few corners are easy navigable. Better for the riders, better for your race, just imagine Vingeard not puncturing but falling like de plus....

 

[roundabout]

Nah man, its rain come on now.

I can imagine some concessions as a way to make up for the fail that was the yesterdays TTT