Vuelta the New Tour?

[BroDeal]

I think Basso will improve his performance over what he showed at the Giro. He seemed to have a little let down in form early on but was strong during the last week. He came in 5th, not bad when he did some work for his teammate Pellizotti, who placed 3rd.

 

[Bala Verde]

all season i've been hoping mollema would start at the vuelta.

Mollema got Mononucleosis (as some other CT rabo members, if I remember correctly van Winden, Vermeltfoort - and upon fact checking I was correct; Isn't that an indication of overtraining??) at the start of the season, which basically killed his season, and even worse, halted his progression. He is currently training with the CT team in the Eiffel region. I doubt he will be fit enough to do the Vuelta, let alone be a factor of importance.

From his website:

De conditie is absoluut nog niet 100% (daar is nog wel even voor nodig), maar ik voel me al een tijd lang helemaal fit en ben ook niet meer vermoeid na trainingen. Vanaf volgende week zal ik de training serieus gaan uitbreiden. Ook doe ik op 4 augustus nog mee aan het profcriterium van Surhuisterveen. Wanneer ik mijn rentree zal maken in grotere wedstrijden weet ik nog niet, maar als ik deze stijgende lijn door zet moet ik in september/oktober nog wel enkele wedstrijden kunnen rijden.

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

Mollema got Mononucleosis (as some other CT rabo members, if I remember correctly van Winden, Vermeltfoort - and upon fact checking I was correct; Isn't that an indication of overtraining??) at the start of the season, which basically killed his season, and even worse, halted his progression. He is currently training with the CT team in the Eiffel region. I doubt he will be fit enough to do the Vuelta, let alone be a factor of importance.

From his website:

Oh i remember reading hoim having some trouble, didn't realise it was that bad. Pity had a promising start to the season, would have done well at the vuelta if he was fully fit too... pity.
thabks bala

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I've been waiting a while for the Vuelta. Some may remember my thread I started after a boring first few days of the Tour, and it's soap opera.

I still like Sanchez. He's focused his entire season on the Vuelta, and I think the course suits him.

I don't see Valverde surviving all the climbs the way I see Sammy doing it.

Basso has the talent, but if he's similar to his Giro form, he won't win here. He actually rode well in the first week of the Giro too BroDeal, remember him trying to ride everyone off his wheel in Stages 4 and 5? He doesn't have his acceleration on the climbs like he did in 2005 or so, but if can get any of that back, look out!

Perico says Contador won't ride it. He's too tired. Sastre won't ride it either. He says he is exhausted after the Giro and Tour.

This year's Worlds is in Switzerland, and reportedly a tough course that will favor someone who can climb. Take ridership in the Vuelta with that in mind.

It is a shame a lot of riders ride the Vuelta either to salvage their season (almost always failing), or prepare for the Worlds. Many of whom drop out right before the most difficult days in the middle. This is one of the reasons I like the idea of moving the Vuelta back to April-May. I realize the calendar is crowded at that time, but I think it belongs there and the calendar can be managed. We would still see some riders using it for preparation, but not like the way it is now. Spain is also more beautiful then. Everything is green, and there is snow on the passes. More scenic than brown grass fields and fog. Both Delgado and Olano say in about 2011 or 2012 will move back. I hope they're right.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Here's a link to Steephill's excellent site on the Vuelta. Take a look at some of the profiles of those stages - and this attached photo doesn't even include Stage 9's brute to Xorret de Cati.

People bored by the lack of mountains in the Tour? You want uphill finishes? We got lots of mountains and uphill finishes.

 

[BroDeal]

Basso has the talent, but if he's similar to his Giro form, he won't win here. He actually rode well in the first week of the Giro too BroDeal, remember him trying to ride everyone off his wheel in Stages 4 and 5? He doesn't have his acceleration on the climbs like he did in 2005 or so, but if can get any of that back, look out!

I was thinking that he started out okay, seemed to fade some in the middle, and then looked good during the last week. His time trialing was off what it used to be. I think it is likely he will be better than the Giro if he is motivated...but then again, when was the last time an Italian came to the Vuelta motivated?

I actually think the Vuelta's position on the calendar is beneficial for the race. Riders use is as a last chance at redemption after a disappointing Tour, but those riders would likely not ride it all if it were moved back to the Spring.

 

[issoisso]

I still like Sanchez. He's focused his entire season on the Vuelta, and I think the course suits him.

Depends on how technical the TTs are. Since he started being coached by Galdeano, he's become terrific at technical TTs, but when the TTs are about power, he's awful.

When the TTs are very technical, he can actually win them, as he's shown before.

Basso has the talent, but if he's similar to his Giro form, he won't win here. He actually rode well in the first week of the Giro too BroDeal, remember him trying to ride everyone off his wheel in Stages 4 and 5? He doesn't have his acceleration on the climbs like he did in 2005 or so, but if can get any of that back, look out!

He's never had the acceleration. Think back to his pre-suspension rides. He never attacked even once. He just rode people off his wheel.

It is a shame a lot of riders ride the Vuelta either to salvage their season (almost always failing), or prepare for the Worlds. Many of whom drop out right before the most difficult days in the middle. This is one of the reasons I like the idea of moving the Vuelta back to April-May. I realize the calendar is crowded at that time, but I think it belongs there and the calendar can be managed. We would still see some riders using it for preparation, but not like the way it is now. Spain is also more beautiful then. Everything is green, and there is snow on the passes. More scenic than brown grass fields and fog. Both Delgado and Olano say in about 2011 or 2012 will move back. I hope they're right.

Also, it'll be separated enough from the Tour that riders will be able to aim for both.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

He's never had the acceleration. Think back to his pre-suspension rides. He never attacked even once. He just rode people off his wheel.

I do remember him attacking in the 2005 and 2006 Giros. But now that I think about it, he definitely wasn't sprinting ahead the way Contador does. He just had more ability to jump than Levi, or Evans for example. And this year he didn't seem to be able to do that at all, or answer many attacks in the Giro by others.

As to moving the Vuelta:

Also, it'll be separated enough from the Tour that riders will be able to aim for both.

That's what I'm thinking, instead of just riding it with the mindset that "well, I blew my chance in the Tour, maybe I can do something in the Vuelta" that some riders seem to take. Making the Vuelta an afterthought, or as we said, just training ground for the World's.

The only thing you won't see much of are riders going for Vuelta-Giro doubles. But that's almost a non-issue to me.

Some other problems with the move are that they'd need to move the Giro up a week. This means the Vuelta would start mid-April, right after LBL. It would also run over the Tour de Romandie and Four Days of Dunkirk. Pais Vasco could possibly be moved to make some room in Spain as well.

This all leaves a void for September. I propose bringing the Coors' Classic back, and holding it the last two weeks in August/Sept up until Labor Day.

 

[issoisso]

I do remember him attacking in the 2005 and 2006 Giros.

Eh? Maybe in Zoldo Alto or Colle di Tenda in 2005, but not the rest of the 2005 Giro, as I remember the rest of it well. I also remember every stage of the 2006 Giro quite vividly. He didn't attack there either. Just a strong rhythm. Monte Bondone, Maieletta, Mortirolo, etc etc.

But if you disagree, please mention the stage.
I know I've got the DVDs stashed away somewhere, I can always check

But now that I think about it, he definitely wasn't sprinting ahead the way Contador does. He just had more ability to jump than Levi, or Evans for example. And this year he didn't seem to be able to do that at all, or answer many attacks in the Giro by others.

I don't agree at all, sorry
Evans and Leipheimer have been seen to attack (however rarely in Leipheimer's case). Basso this year actually tried an attack or two. Before the suspension he literally never did it, as far as I can remember. Just a high pace that no one could follow. He never even got out of the saddle

As to moving the Vuelta:

That's what I'm thinking, instead of just riding it with the mindset that "well, I blew my chance in the Tour, maybe I can do something in the Vuelta" that some riders seem to take. Making the Vuelta an afterthought, or as we said, just training ground for the World's.

The only thing you won't see much of are riders going for Vuelta-Giro doubles. But that's almost a non-issue to me.

Some other problems with the move are that they'd need to move the Giro up a week. This means the Vuelta would start mid-April, right after LBL. It would also run over the Tour de Romandie and Four Days of Dunkirk. Pais Vasco could possibly be moved to make some room in Spain as well.

This all leaves a void for September. I propose bringing the Coors' Classic back, and holding it the last two weeks in August/Sept up until Labor Day.

Yes, september would be.....bare. However, it's a space where new races could emerge.

 

[laurentiu46]

They could move up the Tour of Portugal to PT status.
Two weeks of racing in August should fill the calendar pretty well.
Besides,the Portuguese have that monster climb Alto da Torre,over 1900m high,and also other hilltop finishes and punchy finales.

 

[craig1985]

I do remember him attacking in the 2005 and 2006 Giros. But now that I think about it, he definitely wasn't sprinting ahead the way Contador does. He just had more ability to jump than Levi, or Evans for example. And this year he didn't seem to be able to do that at all, or answer many attacks in the Giro by others.

As to moving the Vuelta:

That's what I'm thinking, instead of just riding it with the mindset that "well, I blew my chance in the Tour, maybe I can do something in the Vuelta" that some riders seem to take. Making the Vuelta an afterthought, or as we said, just training ground for the World's.

The only thing you won't see much of are riders going for Vuelta-Giro doubles. But that's almost a non-issue to me.

Some other problems with the move are that they'd need to move the Giro up a week. This means the Vuelta would start mid-April, right after LBL. It would also run over the Tour de Romandie and Four Days of Dunkirk. Pais Vasco could possibly be moved to make some room in Spain as well.

This all leaves a void for September. I propose bringing the Coors' Classic back, and holding it the last two weeks in August/Sept up until Labor Day.

Wouldn't that make it harder then trying to do the Giro-Tour double?

 

[craig1985]

They could move up the Tour of Portugal to PT status.
Two weeks of racing in August should fill the calendar pretty well.
Besides,the Portuguese have that monster climb Alto da Torre,over 1900m high,and also other hilltop finishes and punchy finales.

Actually the ToP used to be 3 weeks long and have one or two rest days.

 

[thehog]

Good lineup:

Andy Schleck (Saxo Bank), Ivan Basso (Liquigas), Alejandro Valverde and Oscar Pereiro (Caisse d’Epargne), Samuel Sánchez and Igor Anton (Euskaltel-Euskadi), Chris Horner (Astana) Cadel Evans (Silence-Lotto), Tom Danielson and Daniel Martin (Garmin-Slipstream) and Robert Gesink (Rabobank).

 

[auscyclefan94]

I do remember him attacking in the 2005 and 2006 Giros. But now that I think about it, he definitely wasn't sprinting ahead the way Contador does. He just had more ability to jump than Levi, or Evans for example. And this year he didn't seem to be able to do that at all, or answer many attacks in the Giro by others.

As to moving the Vuelta:

That's what I'm thinking, instead of just riding it with the mindset that "well, I blew my chance in the Tour, maybe I can do something in the Vuelta" that some riders seem to take. Making the Vuelta an afterthought, or as we said, just training ground for the World's.

The only thing you won't see much of are riders going for Vuelta-Giro doubles. But that's almost a non-issue to me.

Some other problems with the move are that they'd need to move the Giro up a week. This means the Vuelta would start mid-April, right after LBL. It would also run over the Tour de Romandie and Four Days of Dunkirk. Pais Vasco could possibly be moved to make some room in Spain as well.

This all leaves a void for September. I propose bringing the Coors' Classic back, and holding it the last two weeks in August/Sept up until Labor Day.

You are putting the vuelta over many important races and only 1 or two weeks before the giro. Totally inrealistic.Leave it the way it is.

 

[issoisso]

You are putting the vuelta over many important races and only 1 or two weeks before the giro. Totally inrealistic.Leave it the way it is.

Not unrealistic at all. It's how it was before 1995, and it's how it's going to go back to being. It's going to happen, have no doubt about it. The only question is if Olano and co. can push it up to 2010, or if it's only going ahead in 2011 as planned.

Don't think the Vuelta will overlap the classics. It won't. The classics will be slightly pushed "back" (earlier) to cover that gap between the Milano - San Remo and the Tour of Flanders that has no big races in it except the Critérium International.

As soon as Liége ends, a few days later the Vuelta starts, and the week after the Vuelta finishes, the Giro starts. The Giro goes a bit further into June and after it we have the Dauphiné, Tour de Suisse, Nationals and then the Tour.

Check a pre-1995 calendar if you can find one, and you'll understand what it'll look like

 

[auscyclefan94]

Not unrealistic at all. It's how it was before 1995, and it's how it's going to go back to being. It's going to happen, have no doubt about it. The only question is if Olano and co. can push it up to 2010, or if it's only going ahead in 2011 as planned.

Don't think the Vuelta will overlap the classics. It won't. The classics will be slightly pushed "back" (earlier) to cover that gap between the Milano - San Remo and the Tour of Flanders that has no big races in it except the Critérium International.

As soon as Liége ends, a few days later the Vuelta starts, and the week after the Vuelta finishes, the Giro starts. The Giro goes a bit further into June and after it we have the Dauphiné, Tour de Suisse, Nationals and then the Tour.

Check a pre-1995 calendar if you can find one, and you'll understand what it'll look like

Too cluttered at the start of the season and not enough races after the tour. I personally don't think it will happen. You will basically have a 6 month gap between the 2010 Vuelta and 2011 vuelta. It would seem very weird.

 

[issoisso]

Too cluttered at the start of the season and not enough races after the tour. I personally don't think it will happen. You will basically have a 6 month gap between the 2010 Vuelta and 2011 vuelta. It would seem very weird.

I don't think I've expressed myself clearly, so I'll try again: It'll happen. I'm not guessing, it's a fact

Simply Unipublic are trying to convince the UCI to allow it to be in 2010 instead of 2011, but so far the UCI are having none of it.

 

[josekaubeda]

Unipublic wants to move the Vuelta a España to spring because of the audiences and sponsors on TV. Unipublic belongs to Antena3, a private media corporation, but the Vuelta a España is broadcast on Televisión Española (TVE), the state's public media. As you can imagine, the relations between both TV channels aren't very good.

If Unipublic gets UCI changes la Vuelta's schedule, everybody in Spain will think that TVE isn't keen on cyclism. TVE wants the Vuelta in september for being able to broadcast the spring races on his sport channel, Teledeporte.

I think you can follow the Vuelta a España in Teledeporte website.

Greetings from Spain.

 

[Timmy-loves-Rabo]

Too cluttered at the start of the season and not enough races after the tour. I personally don't think it will happen. You will basically have a 6 month gap between the 2010 Vuelta and 2011 vuelta. It would seem very weird.

na it would be good. Not like the riders have to ride every race
would make the vuelta rly interesting imo. Riders could ride the vuelta and recover enough to compete at the tour. There would need to be some adjustments for sure, but that doesn't matter. It wouldn't be good news for the ToC tho, aren't they moving it too may??

Agree september would seem bare, but it allows for new races to emerge (tour of america maybe?) i like the idea of the tour of port. becoming a PT too.

Good lineup:

Andy Schleck (Saxo Bank), Ivan Basso (Liquigas), Alejandro Valverde and Oscar Pereiro (Caisse d’Epargne), Samuel Sánchez and Igor Anton (Euskaltel-Euskadi), Chris Horner (Astana) Cadel Evans (Silence-Lotto), Tom Danielson and Daniel Martin (Garmin-Slipstream) and Robert Gesink (Rabobank).

are you delusional

EDIT: I just realised i had DM bolded i meant for TD to be

 

[laurentiu46]

Good lineup:

Andy Schleck (Saxo Bank), Ivan Basso (Liquigas), Alejandro Valverde and Oscar Pereiro (Caisse d’Epargne), Samuel Sánchez and Igor Anton (Euskaltel-Euskadi), Chris Horner (Astana) Cadel Evans (Silence-Lotto), Tom Danielson and Daniel Martin (Garmin-Slipstream) and Robert Gesink (Rabobank).

Yeah,Garmin's TD and DM are a little overrated.

Add "Zeke" Mosquera,Kloden and Zubeldia,Vladimir Efimkin,Joaquin Rodriguez,Cunego and two dark horses who might have a shot at GC:Jakob Fuglsang and Xavier Tondo.

 

[Chramko]

Also Roman Kreuziger will ride the Vuelta, though only in a domestique role and as a preparation to worlds.

 

[jilbiker]

Which is quite sad.

Give him a break. The tourDF was physically and mentally exhausting for him. Plus he doesn't really have a team at the moment (forget Astana)

 

[auscyclefan94]

you will get even less riders riding the vuelta if you have it in april instead of september. I bet on it.

 

[auscyclefan94]

A month out from the start of La Vuelta... what are your predictions/expectations of the race you are going to watch.
Whose going to be on the podium?
Who will flop? Who will suprise and fly high?

 

[Roninho]

re: Contador and the Vuelta.

He has won it and further wins won't contribute to his legacy the way Le Tour would.

Absolutely don't agree that it wouldn't contribute to his legacy. Scoring a podium in the Vuelta or have succes in the combi Worlds-Lombardia would make him so much more diverse. That's why people still talk about Merckx, not because he won 5 TDF's, but because he won them and still was able to win worlds, giro's, all the classics and the vuelta. Or how Pantani won the tour and giro in 1 year.

To win the tour, you need to prepare specifically for it. It is a fact in razor-thin competitive environment cycling has evolved into.

Agreed that he wouldn't want to run the Giro or do the classics (LBL, gold race, etc.) prior to the Tour, since that could/would harm his preparation. (If he would ever win both in 1 year that would really make him one of the best ever)

But the Tour has finished and running the Vuelta in september doesn't hurt his chances in 2010's TDF at all. In the past decade Roberto Heras, Joseba Beloki, Oscar Sevilla, Francisco Mancebo, Roberto Heras, Allejandro Valverde and Cadel Evans all showed that it is possible to run good GC in both Tour and Vuelta.

If AC still is physically and mentally fit i would very much like to see him do the Vuelta or run the Worlds Road-Worlds TT-Lombardia combi. It is doable and imo very good for his reputation/legacy as well as great for cycling in general.