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Wattage for a 40km/h TT??

Jun 1, 2010
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Just wondering if anyone has real life power data from a 40 KK TT which was done in less than an hour? (on the road not the track).
There are plenty of calculators around to estimate the required wattage but then you need to know rolling resistance and aerodynamic resistance etc. I'd be interested to know from anyone's actual data, if they have riden 40K in under hour, the following info:
- Normalised Power,
- Weight,
- Bike setup; and
- General comments about the course.
Thanks.
 
Mar 12, 2009
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NP: 288, Avg spd 41.6kph
Weight: 74.5 (Bodyfat 12.5% from dexascan)
Bike: BMCTT02, Zipp disc and 404, 3T Mistral (weight 8.7kgs), position is excellent

Course: almost pancake flat, 3 corners, 4 laps.
 
Jun 1, 2010
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Tapeworm said:
NP: 288, Avg spd 41.6kph
Weight: 74.5 (Bodyfat 12.5% from dexascan)
Bike: BMCTT02, Zipp disc and 404, 3T Mistral (weight 8.7kgs), position is excellent

Course: almost pancake flat, 3 corners, 4 laps.

Good ride. Thanks - I appreciate that info. My best is about 15 W less but my avg speed is much slower. My position needs a lot of work but I also probably need a better bike setup.
 
Also, check out this test done by German Tour Magazine.

They tested Uwe Peschel with all the different aero bits, and you can see how much drag was cut when each change was made. Once again, I think it's on an indoor velodrome

Required output to maintain 45 kph on a:

Standard road bike, hands on hoods = 465 Watts
Same bike, hands down on the drops = 406 watts
Same bike with aero bars = 369 Watts
Same bike, triathlon position (5.5 cm lower bar, saddle forwards)= 360 Watts
Same bike, as above, with 2 tri spoke wheels = 345 Watts

Cervelo TT bike with 2 tri spoke wheels = 328 Watts
Cervelo TT bike with tri spoke front & disk rear = 320 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, tri spoke front & disk rear + aero helmet = 317 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, same as above + skin suit = 307 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, same as above, with saddle pushed back 3cm = 293 Watts

From 465 to 293 watts!! That's obviously a reduction of 172 Watts just from aero stuff,

There's a pdf version of the full article on the net somewhere, but it's in German
 

oldborn

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May 14, 2010
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Tapeworm said:
NP: 288, Avg spd 41.6kph
Weight: 74.5 (Bodyfat 12.5% from dexascan)
Bike: BMCTT02, Zipp disc and 404, 3T Mistral (weight 8.7kgs), position is excellent

Course: almost pancake flat, 3 corners, 4 laps.

Sure, how old are you Tapeworm?
 

oldborn

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May 14, 2010
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Captain Serious said:
Also, check out this test done by German Tour Magazine.

They tested Uwe Peschel with all the different aero bits, and you can see how much drag was cut when each change was made. Once again, I think it's on an indoor velodrome

Required output to maintain 45 kph on a:

Standard road bike, hands on hoods = 465 Watts
Same bike, hands down on the drops = 406 watts
Same bike with aero bars = 369 Watts
Same bike, triathlon position (5.5 cm lower bar, saddle forwards)= 360 Watts
Same bike, as above, with 2 tri spoke wheels = 345 Watts

Cervelo TT bike with 2 tri spoke wheels = 328 Watts
Cervelo TT bike with tri spoke front & disk rear = 320 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, tri spoke front & disk rear + aero helmet = 317 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, same as above + skin suit = 307 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, same as above, with saddle pushed back 3cm = 293 Watts

From 465 to 293 watts!! That's obviously a reduction of 172 Watts just from aero stuff,

There's a pdf version of the full article on the net somewhere, but it's in German

Are those numbers for 1h avg.spd of 45km/h?
I mean 172 w just from aero stuff, it is a huge number.
It is a big difference when we are talking about anaerobic power of 30s and 40km TT test, wright.
 
Dec 21, 2010
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NP: 324W, Avg speed 46.7km/h
Weight: 77kg, too fat....
Bike: Teschner AeroFX TT, Xtreme rear disc, Xtreme Deep V front, Trigon AB118 areo-bars, position is very good/excellent.
Course was flat with two rises (over canals), no wind & humid, very smooth asphalt with roundabout turns each end - 15km x 3 laps
 

oldborn

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Captain Serious said:
Hmm, I don't know the duration, but I don't remember reading anything about an hour

I am prety sceptical of riders testing, like Christopher Sauser (2008 world champion) test of Epic 29er vs.26 inch MTB, so he claimed (on his blog) that he was faster for 11 seconds with 29 er on 5km hill.

So why we do not ride 29er instead of 26 inch MTB on uphill?.
It was commercial for Specialized Epic 29 er.
That is why i am sceptical about this "From 465 to 293watts"

There is one study „Effects of training in an aero position on anerobic power output“ ; Quote" group of trained cyclist, who was never train on aerobars, and second group trained triathletes who train only on aerobars.

So it was hypothesized that the change in angle between the two positions would impact anerobic power production in a direction that would be specific to training position.

After 30s Wingate test (which has flaws) group who never trains on aero, upright position Peak power was significantly higher in the UP position then in aero. Furthermore this group has higher mean power in the upright position when compared to the aero position

In triathlete group PP was found to be higher in the aero position then in upright. There was no significant difference found in mean power between aero and upright position in this group.

So from these results it is recommended that cyclist train in the position in which they race.

Off course this is a 30 sec test and not a 1hour TT, and this study in difference of others (irelevant data, useless facts, way how it is presented) show us something.

Another study (i love studies) "Influence of different racing positions on metabolic cost in elite cyclists"

Show us this:

In this study, 14 elite male bicycle racers were tested for oxygen consumption (VO2) and heart rate (HR) at 70% of their individual VO2max in three different riding positions during a single test run.

The subjects rode their racing bicycles on a wind braked roller;
1) upright cycling (UP), cadence 90 rpm;

2) hands on drops (DP), 90 rpm; and

3) hands on clip-on aero-handlebars (AP), 90 rpm.

VO2 and HR values in AP were significantly higher compared with UP.
We concluded that riding a bicycle in an extreme aero-position increases the metabolic cost of cycling when wind resistance is not taken into account.
However, when the mechanical power losses of 9 W (estimated by the VO2 increase) are compared with the expected aerodynamic power savings of approximately 100 W, it appears that aerodynamic advantages by far outweight their metabolic cost.
 

oldborn

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GreasyMonkey said:
NP: 324W, Avg speed 46.7km/h
Weight: 77kg, too fat....
Bike: Teschner AeroFX TT, Xtreme rear disc, Xtreme Deep V front, Trigon AB118 areo-bars, position is very good/excellent.
Course was flat with two rises (over canals), no wind & humid, very smooth asphalt with roundabout turns each end - 15km x 3 laps

Sure, there is a Wiggins waiting for you to do some work up front in team TT:D
 

oldborn

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May 14, 2010
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Tapeworm said:
Are you questioning the results Oldborn?

FYI I was 30 when I posted the result on the previous page.

And FYI means what exactly?
Not any more, after 46,7 km/h GreasyMonkey speed:eek: everything is possible.
It can be done for sure.
 
Aug 4, 2009
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too many factors to compare but I am 66yo 6"2"and rode a 1.05 and my average watts was 285 from memory I started off slowly but picked up the watts after 10 mins to somewhere 320 but didnt spend all the ride looking at the computer .
My days of sub 1 hour are long gone.
 
Dec 21, 2010
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oldborn said:
Sure, there is a Wiggins waiting for you to do some work up front in team TT:D

Oldborn, since you are so hot at questioning others' reported results, what are yours?

Some of us are TT specialists, not skinny-a&%ed little climbers, so we CAN put out reasonable power over time.

And yes, I spend a lot of time on the front in TTT's, as most of my team are lighter Asian riders, so I am the power-house rider.
Also usually do 20-30km of the latter part of a roadrace before the final climb keeping the bunch closed up for my team's climber(s).

Look at the values reported in the post regards the German rider on the track - huge gains to be made with aero kit (disc, helmet, skin-suit, shoe-covers, etc), so it is not so unusual to see speeds of 45km/h and above by even the average TT specialist when set up and positioned correctly, adapted to the position (aero Vs upright) and reasonably fit.
 
Jun 1, 2010
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GreasyMonkey said:
NP: 324W, Avg speed 46.7km/h
Weight: 77kg, too fat....
Bike: Teschner AeroFX TT, Xtreme rear disc, Xtreme Deep V front, Trigon AB118 areo-bars, position is very good/excellent.
Course was flat with two rises (over canals), no wind & humid, very smooth asphalt with roundabout turns each end - 15km x 3 laps

That's very impressive speed. Not sure about a TTT with you though - I'd get spat out the back pretty early on I think.
 
Jun 1, 2010
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brianf7 said:
too many factors to compare but I am 66yo 6"2"and rode a 1.05 and my average watts was 285 from memory I started off slowly but picked up the watts after 10 mins to somewhere 320 but didnt spend all the ride looking at the computer .
My days of sub 1 hour are long gone.

If I can ride 1.05 at 66 I'll be ecstatic. Surely that's a very competitive time for your age group?
 

Yeahright

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Captain Serious said:
Also, check out this test done by German Tour Magazine.

They tested Uwe Peschel with all the different aero bits, and you can see how much drag was cut when each change was made. Once again, I think it's on an indoor velodrome

Required output to maintain 45 kph on a:

Standard road bike, hands on hoods = 465 Watts
Same bike, hands down on the drops = 406 watts
Same bike with aero bars = 369 Watts
Same bike, triathlon position (5.5 cm lower bar, saddle forwards)= 360 Watts
Same bike, as above, with 2 tri spoke wheels = 345 Watts

Cervelo TT bike with 2 tri spoke wheels = 328 Watts
Cervelo TT bike with tri spoke front & disk rear = 320 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, tri spoke front & disk rear + aero helmet = 317 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, same as above + skin suit = 307 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, same as above, with saddle pushed back 3cm = 293 Watts

From 465 to 293 watts!! That's obviously a reduction of 172 Watts just from aero stuff,

There's a pdf version of the full article on the net somewhere, but it's in German

Thats really interesting, if the figures are correct and I have no reason to suppose they are not. From a road racing perspective I was surprised to see a 60w difference between riding on the hoods compared to the drops, pretty significant.
 

oldborn

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GreasyMonkey said:
Oldborn, since you are so hot at questioning others' reported results, what are yours?
I am not questioning others results, just do not beleive in yours.
Ma last Triathlon cycling leg 40km avg. spd was 36km/h.

GreasyMonkey said:
Some of us are TT specialists, not skinny-a&%ed little climbers, so we CAN put out reasonable power over time.
And yes, I spend a lot of time on the front in TTT's, as most of my team are lighter Asian riders, so I am the power-house rider.
Also usually do 20-30km of the latter part of a roadrace before the final climb keeping the bunch closed up for my team's climber(s).
Thanks for sharing it with me. So Sky Blue Bus is waiting for you;)

GreasyMonkey said:
Look at the values reported in the post regards the German rider on the track - huge gains to be made with aero kit (disc, helmet, skin-suit, shoe-covers, etc), so it is not so unusual to see speeds of 45km/h and above by even the average TT specialist when set up and positioned correctly, adapted to the position (aero Vs upright) and reasonably fit.

As i said that German rider test i do not beleive, look at the fact that he saved 10w just with skin suit;)
I know about aero advantages, but those figures are huge.
 
Jul 23, 2009
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Captain Serious said:
Also, check out this test done by German Tour Magazine.

They tested Uwe Peschel with all the different aero bits, and you can see how much drag was cut when each change was made. Once again, I think it's on an indoor velodrome

Required output to maintain 45 kph on a:

Standard road bike, hands on hoods = 465 Watts
Same bike, hands down on the drops = 406 watts
Same bike with aero bars = 369 Watts
Same bike, triathlon position (5.5 cm lower bar, saddle forwards)= 360 Watts
Same bike, as above, with 2 tri spoke wheels = 345 Watts

Cervelo TT bike with 2 tri spoke wheels = 328 Watts
Cervelo TT bike with tri spoke front & disk rear = 320 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, tri spoke front & disk rear + aero helmet = 317 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, same as above + skin suit = 307 Watts
Cervelo TT bike, same as above, with saddle pushed back 3cm = 293 Watts

From 465 to 293 watts!! That's obviously a reduction of 172 Watts just from aero stuff,

There's a pdf version of the full article on the net somewhere, but it's in German

What is very interesting there is the aero helmet only worth 3 watts. I have often heard it said the helmet is the best bang for buck around (that may still be true) and in watts nearly as good as a aero wheel. This shows a skinsuit getting 3 times the gain of a helmet.
The power required also suggests that having a high seat angle may be counter productive towards getting the best aero. Pushing the seat back and lowering the effective seat angle was a big gain.
 
Jun 19, 2009
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Wattage: unknown, pre meter circa 1992
46.1/kmh
140lbs.
Really low frontal position
26" front wheel
Rear disk
Round, steel tube frame
Flat course, windy day with tailwind out, headwind back

Current day on Felt DA within 1 minute of that speed on 700cm wheels. Position is everything.
 

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