Who else thinks the UK can handle a one day race now?

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rhubroma said:
Well that's just it, everything has to be "finacially viable."

It should be about the land. If the Tour or any other traditional race had thought about something else, they would have died prematurely, as has hapened with every other "designed" race since then.

I understand the necessity for marketing, but is this development? Thinking short term for profit (or at anyrate a type of profit), but not long term. Though that's what happens when modernity gets in the way.
I know it is early days, but the Strade Bianche race is going well.
 
Cult Classics said:
I got up at 6am. I'm fairweather like that.
Ok i did it at 5, but it was a risk, as i had just got home from a 16 hour bus train and plane journey a few hours before ;)

I probably live further from box hill than you :p

And certainly many will have had to get up at 4. Especially those who were already camped out on the hill with picnics an ting.
 
Dec 30, 2011
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The Cobra said:
Really, I'm not so sure. TDF in London was a special occasion as was the Olympics. Difficult to say if the massive crowds would come out year after year for a race they care little about. I think you'd get a decent crowd, definitely more than you'd get in China but much reduced compared to the weekend. Think Joe might be right on this one unfortunately, too much of a financial risk. Need someone who loves cycling and has money to burn to get this started.
I wont go into the details of it, but the Londoners go out to soak in the atmosphere even if the outcome does not matter all that much to them, they see it as a day out for them or their family, which is very accessible.

It is kind of like the London Marathon where no one cares about the result yet they go due to the atmosphere, of course another factor are all the other runners participating but a cycle before the stage can go some way to replicating that.

Especially after the euphoria coming off the Tour, the profile of cycling has gone Sky high and many people would consider it a treat to watch the event as if it was a football event just free, due to the respect which is now being given by the media.

Just look at the Nocturne or the TOB where the streets of London are lined with people though the profile of the race is immensely low. I can tell you that a lot of those spectators are not people who know much about cycling but people who see this as an opportunity to soak in the atmosphere and see the sights, this is why it would be difficult not to finish in Central London as that is what draws people as much as the cycling itself.

It will be very similar to the Olympics not in the euphoria but in terms of the fact that people will go there not because they care about the sport, even though many more people are in fact being exposed and are being attracted to the sport, but because they want to experience that atmosphere. Cycling in England has been provided with a huge boost through Wiggins' Tour win which has created a level of profile which means that many people now see it as a symbol of prestige even if they may not very well understand it themselves and in as much as I will go to the Volleyball, Hockey and Gymnastics even though I do not care about the sport or intend to ever follow it again, many people will attend the race due to how it is depicted to them.

And of course it is free which is a big bonus, I know many people who would immediately change their attitudes to such a race and attending because it is free, as they do not understand cycling and they are used to football, cricket, rugby etc where it is all paid and so for it to be free presents an ideal outing disregarding the levels of interest.
 
Mar 10, 2009
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B_Ugli said:
If you were to open it up to cycling clubs to devise a one day race route it would probably be fantastic (in an ideal world).

Take North West Kent as an example, so many little short steep hills scattering the north downs would make for a great classics route but its slap bang in the middle of one of the most populated areas in the country.

The problem is that living on a small island they have to take into account road closure, spectator viewing points, the wideness of the roads etc etc and this is why races are watered down from their original vision. The UK just doesnt have the expertise to organise a race of the size of say Tour of Flanders using roads the size of the Tour of Flanders - it would be carnage.

What is frustrating is that the UK is a bit stubborn when it comes to asking for outside help and instead tries to do a scaled down version themselves. What they should probably do is get ASO or the organisers of Flanders around a table and say "this is what we are thinking of doing, can you help us run this?"
Nail. Head. Hit. NW Kent = perfect terrain for a 'UK Classic'. Somebody in British Cycling should get in touch with flandersclassics asap.
 
Given the UK cycling history is so closely associated with time trialling rather than road racing maybe something like day 1 of the Criterium International with a half stage and a short ITT.
 


That's the profile of the 2005 Leeds-Sheffield stage. At 150km or so it's not long enough to be a classic, but add a run-in either as a Sheffield-Leeds-Sheffield, or going to Leeds from York or Manchester, and maybe a circuit or two at the end to make the final climbs a bit further from the finish (plus the finishing circuit would inevitably be bumpy).

There, you've got an interesting parcours, a few climbs but solid classics men will still be there at the finish (that stage was won by Luca Paolini, but Russell Downing was 3rd and a very young Geraint Thomas made the top 10). Extend it out with those options to 200-210km and you're linking big cities that mean you should be able to attract a pretty good crowd.

The minus side of course is that it decreases the likelihood of the popular home winner, which the prospective organisers of a British major one day race may cling to in order to establish itself with the British public (as opposed to the establishing itself with the cycling community - after all, one of the main ways to generate prestige is to make the fans AND the riders care about it).
 
Froome19 said:
It will be very similar to the Olympics not in the euphoria but in terms of the fact that people will go there not because they care about the sport, even though many more people are in fact being exposed and are being attracted to the sport, but because they want to experience that atmosphere. Cycling in England has been provided with a huge boost through Wiggins' Tour win which has created a level of profile which means that many people now see it as a symbol of prestige even if they may not very well understand it themselves and in as much as I will go to the Volleyball, Hockey and Gymnastics even though I do not care about the sport or intend to ever follow it again, many people will attend the race due to how it is depicted to them.

And of course it is free which is a big bonus, I know many people who would immediately change their attitudes to such a race and attending because it is free, as they do not understand cycling and they are used to football, cricket, rugby etc where it is all paid and so for it to be free presents an ideal outing disregarding the levels of interest.
The question is not about whether people would go if they organised it now. It is pretty clear that they would. It's about would they go in five, ten, fifteen years' time? After all, we know and the organisers know that they can't rely on crowds like the Olympics even in the best intentions with the best organised event with the best possible field. The Olympics bring something else entirely.

Remember - this time ten years ago, the calendar was crawling with German short stage races and classics. But the bottom fell out of German cycling and now we're left with the Bayern Rundfahrt, the U23/womens' Thüringen Rundfahrt and about four one-day races (Köln, Hamburg, Frankfurt and Berlin), of which only one is WT and only two are of any real importance (Frankfurt and to a lesser extent Hamburg).

However, while I think it's ludicrous to state that such an event will have the prestige of a Monument (it's nigh on impossible), they can reach the same kind of prestige as the other high ranking classics. But in order to achieve that, they need sustainability. It has to keep running for years, so that you have riders who come into the sport dreaming of winning this race. Right now, nobody in the péloton does that, simply because the race doesn't exist. It would be a "nice to have on the palmarès" event, especially for the British riders of course. But when you have the teenagers and espoirs who've been watching this race on the TV seeing the top pros doing it and thinking "I want to be that guy" when they see the winner, and those guys are turning pro - that's when the race truly has prestige.
 
Nov 14, 2011
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Tank Engine said:
With regard to the Olympics, the good people of Northern Ireland can opt to compete for either Team GB or for the Republic of Ireland.
Thats not technically true though admittedly its as good as. You need to have an irish passport to represent Ireland though everyone in NI is automatically allowed dual nationality and can therefore apply for both irish and GB passports. [as i reread my post i realise i'm being a pedantic ****!! The subject is a bug bear of mine]

Also it's not technically "Team GB" its "Team GB and NI" just not enough room on the bibs! I've never understood why it's not "Team UK" because Great Britain doesn't only passively exclude NI but also the Isle of Man and the channel islands [this paragraph also emphasises my pedantic tendencies!! Though it does bemuse me at times]

[Whan did t-w-a-t become a swear word and warrent being asterixed?]
 
Jul 19, 2011
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Libertine Seguros said:
The question is not about whether people would go if they organised it now. It is pretty clear that they would. It's about would they go in five, ten, fifteen years' time? After all, we know and the organisers know that they can't rely on crowds like the Olympics even in the best intentions with the best organised event with the best possible field. The Olympics bring something else entirely.

Remember - this time ten years ago, the calendar was crawling with German short stage races and classics. But the bottom fell out of German cycling and now we're left with the Bayern Rundfahrt, the U23/womens' Thüringen Rundfahrt and about four one-day races (Köln, Hamburg, Frankfurt and Berlin), of which only one is WT and only two are of any real importance (Frankfurt and to a lesser extent Hamburg).

However, while I think it's ludicrous to state that such an event will have the prestige of a Monument (it's nigh on impossible), they can reach the same kind of prestige as the other high ranking classics. But in order to achieve that, they need sustainability. It has to keep running for years, so that you have riders who come into the sport dreaming of winning this race. Right now, nobody in the péloton does that, simply because the race doesn't exist. It would be a "nice to have on the palmarès" event, especially for the British riders of course. But when you have the teenagers and espoirs who've been watching this race on the TV seeing the top pros doing it and thinking "I want to be that guy" when they see the winner, and those guys are turning pro - that's when the race truly has prestige.
The Germans got really mad about you know what. I mean really mad. Like threatening to pull the plug on their Tour de France coverage mid-race mad. That's what hampered their races. Especially since most of their riders of a particular generation seemed to be embroiled in it, not to mention both German teams. Brits could well react the same way, but the big difference is the team most British riders are now involved with has a message at the heart of it, something you certainly didn't have at T-Mobile or Gerolsteiner. Germany 2000 and Britain 2012 are very different places - no point killing the idea of the race in the UK before it's started just because cycling in Germany now isn't what it was a decade ago.
 
Cult Classics said:
The Germans got really mad about doping. I mean really mad. Like threatening to pull the plug on their Tour de France coverage mid-race mad. Especially since most of their riders of a particular generation seemed to be embroiled in it, not to mention both German teams. Brits could well react the same way, but the big difference is the team most British riders are now involved with has a clear anti-doping message at the heart of it, something you certainly didn't have at T-Mobile or Gerolsteiner. Germany 2000 and Britain 2012 are very different places.
But the clear anti-doping message (how clear? It's been discussed at length in the Clinic how Sky's talking and walking do not map onto one another perfectly) only heightens the sense of a let-down if there were to be a positive, therefore it may well take less to bring the whole house of cards crumbling down than it did in Germany. And remember Germany also had a much stronger calendar of pro races to lose - you had the Hessen Rundfahrt/3-Länder Tour, the Regio Tour, the Sachsentour, the Niedersachsen Rundfahrt, all long gone. It took 15 years for the German cycling boom and bust. Germany 2000 was already four years after Telekom first won the Tour and three years after they got the German winner.
 
Jul 19, 2011
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Libertine Seguros said:
But the clear anti-doping message (how clear? It's been discussed at length in the Clinic how Sky's talking and walking do not map onto one another perfectly) only heightens the sense of a let-down if there were to be a positive, therefore it may well take less to bring the whole house of cards crumbling down than it did in Germany. And remember Germany also had a much stronger calendar of pro races to lose - you had the Hessen Rundfahrt/3-Länder Tour, the Regio Tour, the Sachsentour, the Niedersachsen Rundfahrt, all long gone. It took 15 years for the German cycling boom and bust. Germany 2000 was already four years after Telekom first won the Tour and three years after they got the German winner.
That still doesn't justify not putting a race on in the UK.
 
Oct 29, 2009
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CobbleStoner said:
a one-day race in Britain will be fine, sure, as long as no one tweets, or uses their smartphone that day...lol http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/ioc-blames-social-media-overload-for-lack-of-broadcast-information-during-road-races
they really did a bad job with logistics, race support vehicles, and tv coverage, pretty important details when putting on a world class race, I think they failed
Agree entirely. We would definitely need the Belgians or the French to be involved to show us how its done. If you're going to do it, do it right.
 
Feb 23, 2011
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The Cobra said:
Agree entirely. We would definitely need the Belgians or the French to be involved to show us how its done. If you're going to do it, do it right.
I made this point earlier in this thread - i think they are too proud to ask for outside help though.

Unfortunately the IOC chap typifies the kind of response that people in the UK are now weary of receiving from those in "the establishment". Why the guy cant just man up, put his hands up and say they messed up the Olympic RR coverage rather than doing the whole blame thing is beyond me!
 
Jul 19, 2011
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willbick said:
any chance of the uk getting the world champs anytime soon??
Not for the next few years at least - they've decided the venues up til 2015 already. But I'd like to think it should get a shot as the last time was 1982. That said by 2016 (the next available slot) even mainstream cycling nations like France and Belgium won't have hosted it for 16 and 14 years respectively (Italy and Spain having held it three times and twice respectively in the meantime).
 
Jul 30, 2009
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B_Ugli said:
I made this point earlier in this thread - i think they are too proud to ask for outside help though.

Unfortunately the IOC chap typifies the kind of response that people in the UK are now weary of receiving from those in "the establishment". Why the guy cant just man up, put his hands up and say they messed up the Olympic RR coverage rather than doing the whole blame thing is beyond me!
As mentioned numerous times, yes, the coverage was crap, but this had nothing to do with the host organisation.

OBS, the IOC's broadcast services are incharge of ALL coverage of the games. For the road race, they sub contracted the coverage to a Dutch company, NOS.

As far as I know, the timing failed due to a **** up by Omega who provide all of the timing equipment. Obviously the IOC would rather not bad mouth one of their key sponsors. Interesting to see the Omega starting device fail in last night's swimming too!
 
Feb 23, 2011
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Andy99 said:
As mentioned numerous times, yes, the coverage was crap, but this had nothing to do with the host organisation.

OBS, the IOC's broadcast services are incharge of ALL coverage of the games. For the road race, they sub contracted the coverage to a Dutch company, NOS.

As far as I know, the timing failed due to a **** up by Omega who provide all of the timing equipment. Obviously the IOC would rather not bad mouth one of their key sponsors. Interesting to see the Omega starting device fail in last night's swimming too!
The IOC guy seems to think its their responsibility. In any event whoever is responsible - buck passing based on mobile networks allegedly being busy is pretty lame. They have had years to sort this before Saturday and they havent......that is the bottom line.
 
Jul 25, 2010
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Cult Classics said:
Not for the next few years at least - they've decided the venues up til 2015 already. But I'd like to think it should get a shot as the last time was 1982. That said by 2016 (the next available slot) even mainstream cycling nations like France and Belgium won't have hosted it for 16 and 14 years respectively (Italy and Spain having held it three times and twice respectively in the meantime).
What they should do is hold the WC after we've had the TDF depart - providing we get it of course in 2016/17. Hopefully we'll have produced a classics rider by then.
 
Dec 30, 2011
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Izzy eviel said:
What they should do is hold the WC after we've had the TDF depart - providing we get it of course in 2016/17. Hopefully we'll have produced a classics rider by then.
We currently have two very talented classics riders.
 
Jul 30, 2009
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B_Ugli said:
The IOC guy seems to think its their responsibility. In any event whoever is responsible - buck passing based on mobile networks allegedly being busy is pretty lame. They have had years to sort this before Saturday and they havent......that is the bottom line.
Exactly. there is NO valid excuse.

On TV last night they were blaming GPS issues....
 
Jul 19, 2011
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Izzy eviel said:
What they should do is hold the WC after we've had the TDF depart - providing we get it of course in 2016/17. Hopefully we'll have produced a classics rider by then.
There's that Scottish kid who's just moved to Omega Pharma, I forget his name now, but bronze in the U23 ITT last year and won the junior Paris-Roubaix a few years ago too.
 
Dec 30, 2011
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Cult Classics said:
There's that Scottish kid who's just moved to Omega Pharma, I forget his name now, but bronze in the U23 ITT last year and won the junior Paris-Roubaix a few years ago too.
Not the ITT, but the RR.

Fenn looked strong early season winning 2 races in Mallorca.
 
Jul 30, 2009
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Ha ha. From Gerard Vroomen Twitter;

'OBS claims network overload disrupted cycling time checks. Dutch TV commentators said OBS never allowed regular time checks'

Clearly its the Spanish company's fault ;)
 

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