Who is the 'luckiest' grand tour winner?

[CheckMyPecs]

Re:

Wiggins. If you want to bring subservience into the mix. Others could quite rightly argue that's teamwork....If I was Froome, that should have been 3 in the bag by now...

Froome would have put time into Wiggo, but not enough to overturn his deficit.

 

[ferryman]

Re:

People underestimate peak Wiggins. Not only did he absolutely crush the time trials, his climbing behind a strong mountain train was elite too. Froome is probably the only recent GT rider who would've been able to beat him in 2012.

Your usual trolling. I get it. If Froome wasn't called back it would have been game set and match. I've no doubt you agree about this but you can't help yourself trying to be smart again and have a dig. Give it a rest. You

 

[CheckMyPecs]

Re: Re:

People underestimate peak Wiggins. Not only did he absolutely crush the time trials, his climbing behind a strong mountain train was elite too. Froome is probably the only recent GT rider who would've been able to beat him in 2012.

Your usual trolling. I get it. If Froome wasn't called back it would have been game set and match. I've no doubt you agree about this but you can't help yourself trying to be smart again and have a dig. Give it a rest. You

Unwarranted claim.

 

[TMP402]

Re: Re:

Froome felt on the cobbles in 2014. Was that bad luck or poor bike handling ?

Neither since he never got to the cobbles.

 

[DBotero]

Re:

People underestimate peak Wiggins. Not only did he absolutely crush the time trials, his climbing behind a strong mountain train was elite too. Froome is probably the only recent GT rider who would've been able to beat him in 2012.

Unleashed Froome wouldn't have won the 2012 TDF. The deficit was too big and Wiggins 2012 was in the shape of his life.There is no reason to claim his win was a lucky one as some people try to suggest.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Wiggins. If you want to bring subservience into the mix. Others could quite rightly argue that's teamwork....If I was Froome, that should have been 3 in the bag by now...

Froome would have put time into Wiggo, but not enough to overturn his deficit.

Let's not forget how mentally weak Wiggins was at that time though. He almost quit, whilst wearing the MJ, just because Froome dropped him kind of accidently-deliberately a couple of times.

If Froome would have gone off into the distance a couple of times, Wiggins probably would have just given up.

 

[CheckMyPecs]

Re: Re:

Let's not forget how mentally weak Wiggins was at that time though. He almost quit, whilst wearing the MJ, just because Froome dropped him kind of accidently-deliberately a couple of times.

Source, please.

 

[ferryman]

Re: Re:

People underestimate peak Wiggins. Not only did he absolutely crush the time trials, his climbing behind a strong mountain train was elite too. Froome is probably the only recent GT rider who would've been able to beat him in 2012.

Your usual trolling. I get it. If Froome wasn't called back it would have been game set and match. I've no doubt you agree about this but you can't help yourself trying to be smart again and have a dig. Give it a rest. You

Unwarranted claim.

It's not a claim. It's a fact. You surf on he edge yourself. How's it feel to be really clever. Or so you may think.

 

[Climbing]

Re: Re:

Wiggins. If you want to bring subservience into the mix. Others could quite rightly argue that's teamwork....If I was Froome, that should have been 3 in the bag by now...

Froome would have put time into Wiggo, but not enough to overturn his deficit.

Let's not forget how mentally weak Wiggins was at that time though. He almost quit, whilst wearing the MJ, just because Froome dropped him kind of accidently-deliberately a couple of times.

If Froome would have gone off into the distance a couple of times, Wiggins probably would have just given up.

Maybe they would have ended up crashing each other out…
Guess who would have won then!

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

Wiggins. If you want to bring subservience into the mix. Others could quite rightly argue that's teamwork....If I was Froome, that should have been 3 in the bag by now...

however, if wiggins had won in 2011 (which i think he would have), would froome have gotten his shot in 2013 if wiggins was going for a hatrick?

Lol what makes you think Wiggins would have won it in 2011? xD

The fact that Cadel won, and Wiggins had just handed his ar$e to him in the Dauphine 2 weeks earlier?

Realistically I put them at 51/49 in Wiggins favour if he hadn't crashed out, mainly to the late time trial meaning he could just follow Cadel for 3 weeks, knowing he was stronger against the clock. With the strength of Sky i don't think that would have been to big a problem.

As I recall Evans just lost the final TT to Martin and would have won it if his team had given him time checks. Evans was in great form in 2011 winning Tirreno, Romandie and a few other races and his season was similar to Wiggins in 2012. It would have been interesting but I would not categorically say that Wiggins would have won. The following year's route was much better for him. The Dauphine is nowhere near as hard as a GT and Evans peaked later as his Tour ride demonstrated.

 

[Red Rick]

Wait, Wiggins winning in 2011? With no team, and Contador going mad on a wet descent. I wonder in what stage you could possible think he'd do better than Cadel Evans in that Tour?

 

[phanatic]

Re: Re:

Wiggins. If you want to bring subservience into the mix. Others could quite rightly argue that's teamwork....If I was Froome, that should have been 3 in the bag by now...

however, if wiggins had won in 2011 (which i think he would have), would froome have gotten his shot in 2013 if wiggins was going for a hatrick?

Lol what makes you think Wiggins would have won it in 2011? xD

Seriously, Horner would have won that race easily.

 

[saunaking]

God i hate these threads/discussions...

Nibz not lucky.

If he didn't attack over the top and instead sat on the pink jersey does anyone really think SK would have fallen?

 

[the delgados]

Re:

Oscar Perreiro

Ha! I just saw this thread now and was about to say the same.
Nice one.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Re: Re:

Wiggins. If you want to bring subservience into the mix. Others could quite rightly argue that's teamwork....If I was Froome, that should have been 3 in the bag by now...

Froome would have put time into Wiggo, but not enough to overturn his deficit.

Let's not forget how mentally weak Wiggins was at that time though. He almost quit, whilst wearing the MJ, just because Froome dropped him kind of accidently-deliberately a couple of times.

If Froome would have gone off into the distance a couple of times, Wiggins probably would have just given up.

Lol what? I've never heard this before. Link?

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Wiggins. If you want to bring subservience into the mix. Others could quite rightly argue that's teamwork....If I was Froome, that should have been 3 in the bag by now...

Froome would have put time into Wiggo, but not enough to overturn his deficit.

Let's not forget how mentally weak Wiggins was at that time though. He almost quit, whilst wearing the MJ, just because Froome dropped him kind of accidently-deliberately a couple of times.

If Froome would have gone off into the distance a couple of times, Wiggins probably would have just given up.

Lol what? I've never heard this before. Link?

It was from Sean Yates' book. Here's a bit more detail:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/ot...elt-Chris-Froome-stabbed-him-in-the-back.html

 

[WildspokeJoe]

Bernard Hinault in 1985. LeMond actual trusted his team to be truthful.

 

[Cance > TheRest]

Re:

Wait, Wiggins winning in 2011? With no team, and Contador going mad on a wet descent. I wonder in what stage you could possible think he'd do better than Cadel Evans in that Tour?

Exactly. Maybe Wiggins could have been 'up there' until they hit the alps because they were riding the Pyrenees-climbs so defensively. But there is no way Wiggins could have followed the best on the Galbier and Alpe d'huez stage. Add to that he certainly would not have gained anything on Evans in the time trial the penultimate day. Have to say that Wiggins crashing out wasn't a big loss for the race in any way. Quite the contrary, as a consequence of the abandon we got to see EBH at his absolute best that Tour.

 

[Krokro]

Re: Re:

Froome felt on the cobbles in 2014. Was that bad luck or poor bike handling ?

Neither since he never got to the cobbles.

Wasn't it the cobbled stage with lot of rain ? You might be right that he did not even reach the cobbled section itself but you know what I meant by this.

 

[hrotha]

In light of what had happened in the first half of the 2011 season, and of the 2011 Vuelta, and of what would come from 2012 onwards, I wouldn't underestimate 2011 Wiggins.

 

[Netserk]

Re:

In light of what had happened in the first half of the 2011 season, and of the 2011 Vuelta, and of what would come from 2012 onwards, I wouldn't underestimate 2011 Wiggins.

On what stages do you think he could have gained time on Cadel?

 

[Isaak-Gabriel]

Perico Delgado Tour 1988
Bjarne Riis Tour 1996
Danilo Di Luca Giro 2007

 

[IndianCyclist]

I think in most of the GTs you will find element of luck somewhere or the other. Avoided crashes lucky, opponent crashed out lucky, Nobody chased lucky.
Take 2015 Giro - Contador was lucky that he didn't break anything in his first crash, He was lucky Tosatto was available with his bike for his 2nd crash. He was lucky Aru was on a bad day on Motirolo. He was lucky Landa was not allowed to go for victory. He was lucky Aru/Landa are not TTers.

 

[jmdirt]

HMM, while I believe in gravity, and the earth being round, I don't believe that luck is what determines the winner of a GT.

 

[Nick C.]

Re: Re:

People underestimate peak Wiggins. Not only did he absolutely crush the time trials, his climbing behind a strong mountain train was elite too. Froome is probably the only recent GT rider who would've been able to beat him in 2012.

Unleashed Froome wouldn't have won the 2012 TDF. The deficit was too big and Wiggins 2012 was in the shape of his life.There is no reason to claim his win was a lucky one as some people try to suggest.

Wasn't about a minute of Froome's time deficit from the early stages when he flatted or was otherwise left behind by the team to cruise in?