VdP is more likely to have the better career in the future but let's say they if both retire tomorrow I would take rainbows over Amstel or anything else VdP won this year
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Actually the answer to that question is no. He was asked that question in 2015 and he said no without hesitating. He said the reason is because those podiums show his consistency.
I was wondering if it was a trick question. Of course the WCRR beats a Tour stage, a Paris Nice stage, a TDU stage and Andalucia.
Like every rider ever who says he is so happy with his new team and he's the happiest he ever been.
Riders lie to the media even your god bala there's a reason why he cried last year collecting his rainbows and not after his consistent podiums
Correct, he cried when he finally got the rainbow jersey as it's something he's wanted since he was a child. However, and this is big. He has said many times that his Worlds podium record means a great deal to him because it's a reflection of the consistency of his career. Those Worlds medals do mean a great deal to him because the Worlds not the Tour is what he always talked about wanting as a child. (Yes his 2015 Tour podium also meant a great deal to him. His crying on the top of Alp d'Huez showed that. He said after that podium he finally believed he belonged at that level.)
So the 1 race he has wanted most since childhood isn't worth swapping for this:
Vuelta podium (2nd) + 2 stages + points classification, TDf stage, Worlds podium (3rd), PN stage (3rd overall), TDU stage (2nd overall) , Andalucia overall + stage
It is not important what he wants, or what do you think he wants to be precise! That was not a question. The question was who had a better season, Valverde or Gilbert in 2012? There's no need to argue what would someone of them wanted to win more. Gilbert, for example, would trade good part of his results for San Remo win now. But that's not the part of our conversation here. We need to look objective who had the better season. For me it is Valverde, without a doubt, Same as I think Van Der Poel had a better season then Mads Pedersen last year. I value consistency, I value wins throughout the year, I value high placings. For me you need to show high level in number of occasions to claim you had a good year. For me it is not enough to win one day (no matter where and when that was, whether Worlds, Roubaix, Ronde, Lombardia, etc.) and claim you had excellent year. No, you had just one excellent day! That doesn't make it a year. Or is Bettiol one of the top performers of the year? Matthew Hayman? Oliver Zaugg? For me, just no!
For him the answer is no. What you are missing is that he values his podium places. He values his Vuelta and Worlds podiums. This year's Vuelta podium was a record setting podium for la Vuelta and it's something he wanted. It's a big reason why he kept saying he wanted another and another shot at la Vuelta even though this year he was 39. He wanted that podium record. He values it. He values his Worlds podium record. He also values having over 100 overall wins as a non sprinter. He values these things because he values his consistency not only throughout the season, but also throughout his career. He's also said since winning the Worlds in 2018 that by having had to wait so long to win it he appreciates it more than if he had won it sooner.
Oh so you are looking objectivly and picking Valverde what a suprise. What year are you being "objective" and not picking Valverde.
"We need to look objective who had the better season. For me it is Valverde, without a doubt"
That is not being objective its quite the opposite
I'm picking Valverde over Gilbert every season from 2012-2019 as I said before. I'm not picking him over everyone...
Oh, and I'm "being objective" and not picking Valverde as a rider of the year in 2012, 2013, 2014, 2016, 2017 and 2019.
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I wouldn't.
I explained my criteria before. And it is not because of Valverde, I could find around 10 riders who had a better year then Gilbert. One great win doesn't make it a great year, as I said (although Phil Gil had a very good Vuelta, but still...). Oh, and btw, Gilbert had a better season then Mads Pedersen.
One great win, can make the season great. Especially in this sport. Where few are lucky to win many races at all. Over a career.
Some races has more prestige and are harder to win, and will be held in a higher regard.
I think most would trade a few wins in smaller races for a big one.
Some races has more prestige and are harder to win, and will be held in a higher regard.
I think most would trade a few wins in smaller races for a big one.
I don't know, maybe you're right. But the way I see it, one great win can make the season great for not really great riders, like Pedersen, Hyman, Zaugg, Carapaz, Demare, Ciolek, Bettiol... (some of them could prove me wrong in time), but if we're talking about absolute best, a riders of the year, then for me it is not enough. Gilbert had a great season, yes, but they were not 2012 and 2019, but 2010, 2011 and 2017. Former were good seasons, but not great imo. Same as Nibali, he won Milan-San Remo in 2018, an outstanding win, in spectacular manner, while not being even close to a top favorite before the race. But for me it doesn't make his season great. Very good, yes, but great no. I don't know, maybe I'm the one who is wrong on all this, but I just see things that way.
I’d say winning a monument. Would count for a good/great season in someones career. Other results can only make it better. Since a monument is so hard to win, it is automatically a great season if you win one. No matter who you are. In this case, your examples are both legends in this sport. Since they have won so much. Which very few does.
Just because it wasnt their best season, when you compare their whole career, it shouldnt diminish what they acheived that separate year.
It is unfair to say otherwhise, at least I think so.
Had we even heard of Froome at that age.
Really exited to see how Dunbar goes over the next few years
Pretty good indicator that Dunbar has shown more talent at the same age; we've heard about him!
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One great win saves a season, it doesn't make a great season. My opinion obviously.
But by saving it... doesnt that make it a good/great one then?
Or are you saying it was an average season, but at least he won a monument?
This depends on what expectactions we as fans put on the rider and the expectations the rider puts on himself or his team.
Objevtively speaking, no matter who the rider is. A monument win during the year, would be considered it was a great year.
GVFTA
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In someone's mind a win in a monument would make a career, not just a season. This could be said of both fans and riders. It is easy for us to project our (fans) expectations into this debate, but they are mostly meaningless without knowing the expectations of the rider or his or her team.
And things rarely go exactly how we want.
Sometimes we gotta be greatful for what we achieved. Form, injuries, support, personal life and a lot of other stuff can affect the performance. So getting one major win, not getting it, or getting many don’t have to be defining. And certainely not the points on PCS.
Only in rider of the year debates. To crown a champion.
But not if a rider had a great year or not. Because that can be subjective to each case.
Winning a Monument is big, or WC, I won't deny that. It makes a career for some riders, and many good riders never achieve that. But I was trying to make another point. Results throughout the whole season matters too. You can have a good season even if you didn't had that big win (although I notice little obsession with those around here, as if that is the only thing that matters in cycling).
Gilbert 2019 - very good season
Riders who had a better year - Roglic, Alaphilippe, Bernal, Fuglsang, Valverde, Pogacar, Van Der Poel.
Nibali 2018 - Also a very good season
Riders who had a better year - Valverde, Sagan, Simon Yates, Viviani, Alaphilippe, Geraint Thomas, Dumoulin, Pinot, Froome.
Pogacar had a great season for such a young man but Gilbert won Roubaix FFS. As for Valverde I suppose your now gonna tell us that winning Route D'Occitanie is better than a monument
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