Who will better the other Contador vs Schleck in 2013!

[Siriuscat]

The Giro hardness is opponents and contention primarily and only then parcours. The contention was away. What's the use of parcours when they rode Fedaia and Finestre like a slightly intensive training?

Not necessarily. One can crush harshly and fly over the cobbles on the next day.

There are times Airstream where your naivety is glaringly apparent, you really don't have a clue, do you. There really is no point discussing this with you!

 

[airstream]

There are times Airstream where your naivety is glaringly apparent, you really don't have a clue, do you. There really is no point discussing this with you!

These words from anashamed contador fanboy only underline how i am right. God...

 

[airstream]

There are times Airstream where your naivety is glaringly apparent, you really don't have a clue, do you. There really is no point discussing this with you!

These words from anashamed contador fanboy only underline how i am right.

no clue? we can discuss this in details. I can be accused of many things but not in the fact i don't understand anything in the sport.

 

[LaFlorecita]

There are times Airstream where your naivety is glaringly apparent, you really don't have a clue, do you. There really is no point discussing this with you!

Indeed, so just give up

 

[airstream]

It is called blindness. I'm sorry for you. You see only one side in the sport.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Andy will rock!

 

[Afrank]

stage 3 of 2010 tour? You're going use that? Shows how desperate you are

stage 8 2010 tour? Schleck took 8 seconds?

stage 12 of tour 2012? injured knee, ride giro. Yeah cool story bro

Schleck never beat Contador in anything besides tour 2011. You've no evidence to support your claim whatsoever.

But reject common sense and use your imagination

I'm not desperate at all, just pointing out where Schleck gained time in the 2010 Tour. I wasn't using stage 12 of the 2011 (not 2012) Tour as proof that Schleck will win either, again just pointing out where Contador got dropped.

Just because Schleck hasn't beaten Contador in the past, doesn't mean that it is completely impossible to beat him, a lot can happen. It is not common sense that Contador will win everything no matter what, that is imagination on your part. Schleck at his best (from what we have seen) can climb as well as Contador, I don't think it is outside the realm of possibilities that we could see him climbing better than Contador.

 

[airstream]

Schleck at his best (from what we have seen) can climb as well as Contador, I don't think it is outside the realm of possibilities that we could see him climbing better than Contador.

Contador was obviously off-form, at about 4-5% from his perfect preparation. Is it so difficult to understand??! You have absolutely no clue.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Schleck at his best (from what we have seen) can climb as well as Contador, I don't think it is outside the realm of possibilities that we could see him climbing better than Contador.

I think it is

 

[Miburo]

I'm not desperate at all, just pointing out where Schleck gained time in the 2010 Tour. I wasn't using stage 12 of the 2011 (not 2012) Tour as proof that Schleck will win either, again just pointing out where Contador got dropped.

Just because Schleck hasn't beaten Contador in the past, doesn't mean that it is completely impossible to beat him, a lot can happen. It is not common sense that Contador will win everything no matter what, that is imagination on your part. Schleck at his best (from what we have seen) can climb as well as Contador, I don't think it is outside the realm of possibilities that we could see him climbing better than Contador.

Please enlighten me, when did we see Schleck doing anything on par against Contador at his best?

Ask the people in the forum who they think is the better climber. Btw also ask who is the better descender, TT,...

Btw you point out a cobblestone-stage where time-changes occured after a fall in the peloten so obviously you're desperate. And Contador btw had a flat tire at the end.

Until now Contador has beaten Schleck always. How am i using my imagination that it'll keep happen? Especially knowing Schleck will lack serious rythm (it won't hurt much but every detail counts)

What are your facts? "You never know?" Is that all you got?

Who is using their imagination here?

If you think Schleck will do better, you're just being a fanboy. Nothing wrong with it but don't deny it

 

[Siriuscat]

Originally Posted by airstream
The Giro hardness is opponents and contention primarily and only then parcours. The contention was away. What's the use of parcours when they rode Fedaia and Finestre like a slightly intensive training?

Not necessarily. One can crush harshly and fly over the cobbles on the next day.

Have you ever tackled any of these climbs? Have you ever tackled any of the climbs the GT's call Hors Category?? Do you have any concept of what it takes to get up some these climbs, whether you are a top rider or not?? To suggest that these riders rode them at a training pace is simply naive.

Do you understand what it takes to hit the cobbles in Paris Roubaix at upwards of 50KPH, do you understand what it takes for us mere mortals to ride the cobbles at 20kph???

These words from anashamed contador fanboy only underline how i am right.

no clue? we can discuss this in details. I can be accused of many things but not in the fact i don't understand anything in the sport.

Yes I am a bit of a fanboy, of Contador yes, of cycling absolutely and for many many years. If you feel that your knowledge of this sport is complete then why spout off some of the gibberish you do??

If you believe what you have written your naivety is staggering.

Go and ride in the Alps or the Dolimiti or Belguim or North East France or the Ardennes, then come back and tell us how you can soft tap up Passo Fedaia or the Colle delle Finestre (they have earned their full names) in a GT and still win!

 

[peloton]

roundabout opened the poll in the summer. 80% forum members voted that the knee was made up in order to justify a probable failure. How could you comment this?

Pffff, Schleck made Contador take a risk and make fatal mistake in 2010. About what are we talking. The victory in all respects.

Heh, so you are saying that the knee injury was a faked one because of a poll on this forum said so? Hilarious.

Did you actually see the pics of his knee? Of course you didn't.

Anyhow, I hope Andy has fully healed and we see him back in top form next year, that will make the season better for all cycling fans.

 

[airstream]

Have you ever tackled any of these climbs? Have you ever tackled any of the climbs the GT's call Hors Category?? Do you have any concept of what it takes to get up some these climbs, whether you are a top rider or not?? To suggest that these riders rode them at a training pace is simply naive.

You are busily overacting. I didn't say the Giro had no affect. I'm just saying the difference between cyclists going full blast and cyclists riding relatively speaking 1500 w/h [without any lead-out, without any attacking initiative and no one is going to solve racing tasks and attack] is colossal. The second is like I don't know.. the Giro 2010 Terminillo stage when 10 riders could easily ride faster but no one wanted. They are super elite riders. Continuous 9% sector fatigue them, but when it is passed in a steady sparing tempo it is not a big problem. Yeah, sadly, when the entire top-5 of a GT are satisfied with their current GC places we are doomed to see sort of combative training. It is real nowadays. Demoralized opponents and strong competitive opponents. Do you grasp the difference? Many kilometers anchored his legs partially, but it was kilometers of easy carefree leadership so to try entirely to explain by the Giro the things we saw in the Tour is a bit thick.
I'm sure if the injury was a bit serious at least, it would of been a collapse in the Pyrenees. But it didn't happen, so it was just a slight bruise. In general the Pyrenees turned out to be one big present for Contador.

 

[Dutchsmurf]

I'm sure if the injury was a bit serious at least, it would of been a collapse in the Pyrenees. But it didn't happen, so it was just a slight bruise. In general the Pyrenees turned out to be one big present for Contador.

It would have been collapse in the Pyrenees if anyone would have bothered to make a move.

 

[Afrank]

Please enlighten me, when did we see Schleck doing anything on par against Contador at his best?

2010 Tour I would say was where he pretty much matched Contador in the mountains.

Ask the people in the forum who they think is the better climber. Btw also ask who is the better descender, TT,...

I don't need to ask anyone about that, Contador is the better descender and TTer, but I would still rate a on form Schleck (2010 or 2011 Galibier) as pretty much equal to Contador on climbing.

Btw you point out a cobblestone-stage where time-changes occured after a fall in the peloten so obviously you're desperate. And Contador btw had a flat tire at the end.

Where did I use that stage as proof that Schleck is better? Up the Road said he didn't recall Schleck taking time out of Contador in 2010, so I was informing him that Schleck took time out of him on stage 3 and 8.

Until now Contador has beaten Schleck always. How am i using my imagination that it'll keep happen? Especially knowing Schleck will lack serious rythm (it won't hurt much but every detail counts)

What are your facts? "You never know?" Is that all you got?

Who is using their imagination here?

You talk about Contador winning the Tour as if it is just common sense. I call that imagination. I don't believe that it is common sense that Contador will win, simply because of the unpredictability of cycling.
Here's why I think Schleck will win, Schleck at his very best (from what we have seen) is just as strong as Contador in the mountains. In the 2011 tour he showed great strength in his solo attack. He had a bad year in 2012, so I think this has given him motivation for 2013. He wants to come back strong and show that he can still win race. I think motivation has been one of the main things he has been missing in past years, and now I think he has it (of course he will need more than motivation to get back to his best, but it will help him get back to that level or above it hopefully). And of course another part of the reason I think he can win is because he is one of my favorite riders.

If you think Schleck will do better, you're just being a fanboy. Nothing wrong with it but don't deny it

I never denied being a fanboy of Schleck. But I don't believe thinking Schleck will win is just being a fanboy of him.

 

[Siriuscat]

Hate to say this chaps but using 2010 as a comparison for anything is a waste of time for a number of reasons...

1 The Ardennes Stage - Cancellara nullified that stage at a time where it would have been easy for the peloton to take a couple of minutes out of the Schlecky boys when they fell off (supreme handling skills again). They did it because it suited them - Contador et al should have ridden, let CSC chase back as any other team would have had to do.

2 The Cobble Stage - CSC drove hard on the cobbles to put time into everybody, the target being Contador of course, despite attacking the Yellow Jersey on the back of Chavanel who was caught behind Frankies sacrifice oops crash. No-one EVER talks about that attack on the yellow.

In those two stages CSC changed the face of the race and they did it to suit themselves the same as the complaining over chaingate and everything else. Had they not been hypocritical over their tactics then the race would have been much different.

However teams use whatever tactics they see fit and who can blame them for that but we compare 2010 forgetting the way CSC changed the race in the first few of days so when we talk about 2010 remember those two days and how the race was manilpulated to suit.

 

[movingtarget]

Heh, so you are saying that the knee injury was a faked one because of a poll on this forum said so? Hilarious.

Did you actually see the pics of his knee? Of course you didn't.

Anyhow, I hope Andy has fully healed and we see him back in top form next year, that will make the season better for all cycling fans.

I don't believe the injury was fake but it seems there are more excuses from many of his fans, for Contador when he is beaten. Sanchez, Schleck, Evans, Gesink, Basso etc...... never get the same level of sympathy. Many Contador fans see every race that Contador enters as an expected victory. All riders get sick or injured sometimes and that is sport. Not sure why some riders get the sympathy vote to a greater degree. Just fans being fans I suppose.

 

[airstream]

omg, there are 2 guys who dont see the difference between the cobbles and chaingate on the forum - hitch and sirius cat - and both are absolutely impartial in this respect.

Sirius Cat, it is not important. Suited / off-suited. Cycling is Cycling. The TdF was at stake and no one was disgusted because of the chaingate too much. That wasn't just very nice from ethical point of view and nothing more. BUT the arguments about Contador who allegedly was out of form and not at his best in the 2010 Tour is just for feeble people and fanboys. He was usual, but other guys neutralized his climibing edge completely.


Listen up, dear Miburo. It is really hard for me often to distinguish whether you serious or facetious. I admit you often joke too. But for what the hell are threads created if based on the previous experience the only man can win the 2013 Tour — Contador? Let's close the forum, if you offer to go by this criteria only. Previous experience is not the only thing we can base on. It is the forum. Anything works up to 'I feel like something to happen like that' on here.

Heh, so you are saying that the knee injury was a faked one because of a poll on this forum said so? Hilarious

No, but it directly points on rider's credibility.

 

[LaFlorecita]

2010 Tour I would say was where he pretty much matched Contador in the mountains.

And Alberto was at his best in 2010?

 

[The Hitch]

I don't believe the injury was fake but it seems there are more excuses from many of his fans, for Contador when he is beaten. Sanchez, Schleck, Evans, Gesink, Basso etc...... never get the same level of sympathy. Many Contador fans see every race that Contador enters as an expected victory. All riders get sick or injured sometimes and that is sport. Not sure why some riders get the sympathy vote to a greater degree. Just fans being fans I suppose.

We've been over this and its just your imagination. Evans fans think he could have won the 2010 tdf even with the giro in his legs. Gesink gets more excuses than contador from the army of.dutchies ( and like with contador they are mostly justified) i myself have been far more ridiculous ( though facetious) in my opinions of what samu could have done without the mont allesoutes screwjob than contador fans are.

And where are all these excuses for contador anyway? Pn 09- for which i dont even hear any excuses. Tour 2011 - which is common sense. Tour 2010- which he won anyway.

Im not seeing all these "excuses" you are.

 

[Pentacycle]

And Alberto was at his best in 2010?

He was at his best possible form, how much better could he have been than what we saw on the Tourmalet? He surely had to have some form to keep up with Schleck's huge accellerations.

If Contador has his 2010 form next year Schleck has a better chance of winning imo, he's got a great team too. The TTT might even put Schleck in yellow after the first real mountain stage.

Still I'd rather not make any conclusions about this, Tirreno will be a good indicator.

 

[LaFlorecita]

He was at his best possible form, how much better could he have been than what we saw on the Tourmalet? He surely had to have some form to keep up with Schleck's huge accellerations.

I'm sorry but I rather trust Alberto's opinion than yours.

If Contador has his 2010 form next year Schleck has a better chance of winning imo, he's got a great team too. The TTT might even put Schleck in yellow after the first real mountain stage.

What about Alberto's team? Kreuziger, Roche, Rogers are great additions to the team and for the TTT Saxo could have Kreuziger, Rogers, Morkov, Paulinho and Alberto. I can see Saxo beating Radioshack in the TT especially because Shack will have to drag Andy with them while Alberto is second best and maybe even the best on his team.

 

[airstream]

The main problem is some people look into Contador as supreme being and others as guys who are doomed to be weaker. In order to underline this, the 2009 Tour and the 2011 Giro are memorized numerous times. Fans are eager to represent these 2 GT's like a natural objective relation of forces and any other results — like plaguy contigency, like ridiculous preposterousness which gave opponents chances. However the 2009 Tour is not the rule. It is just an unitary example. And that relation of forces is impossible to copy, reconstruct or replay. It was and it ended. Things never be the same again in details at least. So, if Contador loses or the fact that he can lose, it is not out of the system, even if it enrages you. It is a striking delusion. GT's are not monopolized. Deal with it and love cycling otherwise you will have to choke-bore within a year or a bit later.

 

[LaFlorecita]

The main problem is some people look into Contador as supreme being and others as guys who are doomed to be weaker. In order to underline this, the 2009 Tour and the 2011 Giro are memorized numerous times. Fans are eager to represent these 2 GT's like a natural objective relation of forces and any other results — like plaguy contigency, like ridiculous preposterousness which gave opponents chances. However the 2009 Tour is not the rule. It is just an unitary example. And that relation of forces is impossible to copy, reconstruct or replay. It was and it ended. Things never be the same again in details at least. So, if Contador loses or the fact that he can lose, it is not out of the system, even if it enrages you. It is a striking delusion. GT's are not monopolized. Deal with it and love cycling otherwise you will have to choke-bore within a year or a bit later.

I have no idea what you just said

 

[airstream]

I have no idea what you just said

However I am convinced other guys understand me.