Who would you trust to run a clean cycling team?

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May 26, 2009
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armchairclimber said:
He has. This year. You just don't believe it...which is fine. You're entitled to be ignorant. Time will show me to be right though.
Yes indeed, just as ignorant as we were on Armstrong.

How is it working for you when every claim made here on either Armstrong, Yates, Rogers, Leinders and Brailsford is being 100% on the mark? It obviously doesn't make you go "Hmmm these guys have been right every time, perhaps I should pay more attention".

Instead you go full on "faith" modus :D

You know what happened to the Lance fanboys, so why are you putting yourself in so much hurt again?
 
Franklin said:
Yes indeed, just as ignorant as we were on Armstrong.

How is it working for you when every claim made here on either Armstrong, Yates, Rogers, Leinders and Brailsford is being 100% on the mark? It obviously doesn't make you go "Hmmm these guys have been right every time, perhaps I should pay more attention".

Instead you go full on "faith" modus :D

You know what happened to the Lance fanboys, so why are you putting yourself in so much hurt again?
Well you might have had faith in Armstrong...don't speak for me. Just because you (amongst far more well informed commentators) were on the mark with Armstrong it does not follow that you are automatically right about Wiggins or Sky.

Personally, I'll stick with what I know (ie, don't need to have faith in) as well as paying attention to the likes of the SoS boys, Vaughters, Millar etc.
 
May 26, 2009
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armchairclimber said:
Well you might have had faith in Armstrong...don't speak for me. Just because you (amongst far more well informed commentators) were on the mark with Armstrong it does not follow that you are automatically right about Wiggins or Sky.

Personally, I'll stick with what I know (ie, don't need to have faith in) as well as paying attention to the likes of the SoS boys, Vaughters, Millar etc.
Actually we were right on the money on lance :) It's the thing that we have been right so many times and so far you have been in sandbag/retreat modus.

You might have noticed I always post facts, something you have been retreating from quite often (Like an old fashioned faithful):) Rememeber how I dismantled your faith on Leinders by posting the judicial facts (nasty that, public domain, judicial papers from 2008... unspinnable)? Now we have solid evidence that Rogers is dodgy and we know that Yates is now in full liar modus (no, he didn't just drive the car, he was managing DS).

So I was right on:

Leinders. => The facts of the whereabouts fraud. And now it's developing as expected a bit more than that.
Yates => Not a DS of a team with a dodgy Champion. He was a DS of a team with a fulblown dope structure. And now he lies about it. Add the nice fact of his chumminess wih the Motoman for laughs and giggles.
Rogers => Once again shown to be involved with Ferrari, long after Ferrari was pinpointed as a dope doc.
Brailsford => The above three are undeniable proof he's a liar. He should know and he undoubtedly did know as he isn't dumb. In fact he's going full liar mode right now.

You on the other hand only have your faith. You have no facts to backup your stance: hence it's founded on faith.

Sorry man, facts are nasty... try not to stand in their way.

You are a carbon copy of the old Lance fans and just like then it are the undeniable facts that hurt so much. Let it go.
 
Franklin said:
Actually we were right on the money on lance :) It's the thing that we have been right so many times and so far you have been in sandbag/retreat modus.

You might have noticed I always post facts, something you have been retreating from quite often (Like an old fashioned faithful):) Rememeber how I dismantled your faith on Leinders by posting the judicial facts (nasty that, public domain, judicial papers from 2008... unspinnable)? Now we have solid evidence that Rogers is dodgy and we know that Yates is now in full liar modus (no, he didn't just drive the car, he was managing DS).

So I was right on:

Leinders. => The facts of the whereabouts fraud. And now it's developing as expected a bit more than that.
Yates => Not a DS of a team with a dodgy Champion. He was a DS of a team with a fulblown dope structure. And now he lies about it. Add the nice fact of his chumminess wih the Motoman for laughs and giggles.
Rogers => Once again shown to be involved with Ferrari, long after Ferrari was pinpointed as a dope doc.
Brailsford => The above three are undeniable proof he's a liar. He should know and he undoubtedly did know as he isn't dumb. In fact he's going full liar mode right now.

You on the other hand only have your faith. You have no facts to backup your stance: hence it's founded on faith.

Sorry man, facts are nasty... try not to stand in their way.

You are a carbon copy of the old Lance fans and just like then it are the undeniable facts that hurt so much. Let it go.
You're confusing me with someone else. I have never said I had faith in Leinders for one. What I didn't do is jump to the conclusions that you have.
So there are staffers with a doping past? I don't give a crap about that...team Garmin is full of ex-dopers, it doesn't mean they are doping now.

Armstrong hasn't been brought to book because of a few keyboard warriors in a niche forum....sorry. It had jack to do with the clinic. It had a lot to do with some dogged and persistent journalists and investigators.
 
May 26, 2009
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armchairclimber said:
So there are staffers with a doping past? I don't give a crap about that...team Garmin is full of ex-dopers, it doesn't mean they are doping now.
It's really sad that you do not understand and see the difference.

Garmin: "These people screwed up, but we will make sure they don't do it again."

Sky: "We will never hire anyone dodgy. Don't dare to doubt us."

Just write down the fatcs. Take a deep breath. Say what you know but don't dare to utter as it shows you were wrong all along. Dave Brailsford is lieing all this time. Accept this undeniable fact.

Then do the neccesary thing and acknowledge that if he lies about these important things everything what Sky says holds no value unless thoroughly researched.

The stance: "I know they are clean" is quite frankly insulting and is exactly the one that brought cycling in this mess.

You are part of the problem: The fan who knows better but adheres to a religion simply because he wants it to be true.
 
May 26, 2010
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Franklin said:
It's really sad that you do not understand and see the difference.

Garmin: "These people screwed up, but we will make sure they don't do it again."

Sky: "We will never hire anyone dodgy. Don't dare to doubt us."

Just write down the fatcs. Take a deep breath. Say what you know but don't dare to utter as it shows you were wrong all along. Dave Brailsford is lieing all this time. Accept this undeniable fact.

Then do the neccesary thing and acknowledge that if he lies about these important things everything what Sky says holds no value unless thoroughly researched.

The stance: "I know they are clean" is quite frankly insulting and is exactly the one that brought cycling in this mess.

You are part of the problem: The fan who knows better but adheres to a religion simply because he wants it to be true.
Why is anyone surprised about Braislford lying? He did it before when David Millar got busted. Read Kimmage's interview with him for The Sunday Times.
 
May 26, 2009
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Benotti69 said:
Why is anyone surprised about Braislford lying?
Intense denial?

At the TdF this stupidity was annoying, but after this story you would expect people to backpedal and start being a bit more circumspect about their religious faith in a cycling team.
 
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