Why Tenerife?

[sniper]

Then why is the same question still being asked years after the topic was created?

what same question?
what i see is a bunch of anonymous dudes trying to figure out why UCI didn't test on Tenerife this year.
quite harmless if you think about it.

I'm sorry, together with Echoes you are one of the two persons on this forum I can't take seriously on any level.

don't be sorry. this says much more about you than about anyone else.

 

[Arnout]

what same question?
what i see is a bunch of anonymous dudes trying to figure out why UCI didn't test on Tenerife this year.
quite harmless if you think about it.

The question whether cyclists go to Tenerife and the assertion they do it because the UCI can't easily go there. The question why the UCI doesn't seem to be testing there is a valid one and needs to be asked without doubt. I think the same questions and statements over and over again about the remoteness of Tenerife are distracting from the real issue.

don't be sorry. this says much more about you than about anyone else.

Fine with me.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

I'm sorry, together with Echoes you are one of the two persons on this forum I can't take seriously on any level.

You're not sorry. And until now I did not realise how bigoted you were. I hope I always continue to post and really ruin your Clinic viewing experience.

You're welcome.

 

[Arnout]

You're not sorry. And until now I did not realise how bigoted you were. I hope I always continue to post and really ruin your Clinic viewing experience.

You're welcome.

I am because in theory I like the clinic. I think your constant wild theories are a detriment to the real discussion on doping in cycling. Don't know what this has to do with bigotry but that's probably me.

Anyway there's always the ignore function so don't worry about it.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

As for the *** notion that it's easy to go get to Tenerife, I do have to wonder: if it's so easy to test there, why don't they?

I mean.

No testers live there.

Funding for tests is
* salary / time of test sample collector
* + any expenses, like air fares
* analysing the sample

And we know the reason so few OOC tests are done is ... lack of funds.

I am sure the wise and all knowing posters will enlighten us as to why the UCI do not do this easy thing.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

I am because in theory I like the clinic. I think your constant wild theories are a detriment to the real discussion on doping in cycling. Don't know what this has to do with bigotry but that's probably me.

Anyway there's always the ignore function so don't worry about it.

Yes because so many of my posts are wild theories.

Not.

You must be hard of reading.

Thanks for making it personal. Good job.

 

[Arnout]

Yes because so many of my posts are wild theories.

Not.

You must be hard of reading.

Thanks for making it personal. Good job.

You talking about me making it personal. Don't make me laugh.

When I post a topic about training data of a certain French rider the only, literally only thing you do is personally attack anyone who tries to discuss it in oneliners (despite me explicitly asking not to do that). That's all the annoying noise I'm talking about. This ain't the only example, just the most recent one.

 

[ebandit]

As for the *** notion that it's easy to go get to Tenerife, I do have to wonder: if it's so easy to test there, why don't they?

I mean.

No testers live there.

Funding for tests is
* salary / time of test sample collector
* + any expenses, like air fares
* analysing the sample

And we know the reason so few OOC tests are done is ... lack of funds.

I am sure the wise and all knowing posters will enlighten us as to why the UCI do not do this easy thing.

Funnily enough you aren't the first person to ask this question......... Froome got there first

I don't know where the testers live......all over the place presumably......but what I do know is that I've got time for a big lunch, a nap, a shower and I'd still be able to get from my house to Tenerife by late afternoon today

Why don't they test there?.......at a guess I'd say it is because they think it is unlikely they'd catch anybody and that would make it a poor allocation of scarce resources......of course that assumes the testing bodies want to catch cheats

Mark L

 

[Arnout]

Funnily enough you aren't the first person to ask this question......... Froome got there first

I don't know where the testers live......all over the place presumably......but what I do know is that I've got time for a big lunch, a nap, a shower and I'd still be able to get from my house to Tenerife by late afternoon today

Mark L

Right. If the UCI doesn't want to hire a tester who lives in Tenerife it's a problem. It's not the reason why riders want to go to Tenerife though, even though they might well be doping there.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

You talking about me making it personal. Don't make me laugh.

When I post a topic about training data of a certain French rider the only, literally only thing you do is personally attack anyone who tries to discuss it in oneliners (despite me explicitly asking not to do that). That's all the annoying noise I'm talking about. This ain't the only example, just the most recent one.

Yeah right. You take what one person wrote and pretzelled it into

Yay to not wanting to recognize the benefit of academic study. Let's toast on the hope that everyone will dumb down in future.

and then have a go at me for doing what you expressly asked people not to do in derailing the thread.

You myopically hypocritical poster.

 

[ebandit]

In the past riders lived and trained around areas near to Fuentes/Ferrari/dope dealers.........but that was in an era of carefree and rampant doping......... is there a new doctor on Tenerife? Who knows

Mark L

 

[Arnout]

Yeah right. You take what one person wrote and pretzelled it into



and then have a go at me for doing what you expressly asked people not to do in derailing the thread.

You myopically hypocritical poster.

Yep, I admit that reaction(!) on an uninformed opinion was too harsh. It was a result of my frustration though. I posted the topic in order to see if some interesting discussion on released data (the lack of which is always number one reason clinic posters give when they are questioned about their opinions not backed by proof, a reason I'm sympathetic with) was possible. Yet nearly all five pages of that topic consist of clinic regulars discrediting anyone willing to discuss the data.

By the way you do realize it's you whose doing the namecalling again here, right? All I've said is that I don't take you seriously. Since I don't I don't care whether you call my a bigot or myopic hypocrite, but it's exactly my problem with you for longer than today or this month.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

You talking about me making it personal. Don't make me laugh.

When I post a topic about training data of a certain French rider the only, literally only thing you do is personally attack anyone who tries to discuss it in oneliners (despite me explicitly asking not to do that). That's all the annoying noise I'm talking about. This ain't the only example, just the most recent one.

Wow seriously. I go back through that thread and Parker is hanging sh!t on anyone who wants training or racing data - big long posts worth, belittling and denigrating and you dislike my input into that thread? Where all I am really reacting to is either the total lack of actual data unless you pay for it (since remedied) coz all we had to discuss was an abstract - that's a quick conversation - or Coggan's arrogance?

Or your twisting.

Fark me. The very first response is someone hanging sh!t on people who have asked for data.

 

[Arnout]

Wow seriously. I go back through that thread and Parker is hanging sh!t on anyone who wants training or racing data - big long posts worth, belittling and denigrating and you dislike my input into that thread? Where all I am really reacting to is either the total lack of actual data unless you pay for it (since remedied) coz all we had to discuss was an abstract - that's a quick conversation - or Coggan's arrogance?

Or your twisting.

Fark me. The very first response is someone hanging sh!t on people who have asked for data.

To be frank I disliked most of the topic but I especially dislike personal one-liner attacks instead of proper refutation.

In any case I'm outta here.

 

[thehog]

Right. If the UCI doesn't want to hire a tester who lives in Tenerife it's a problem. It's not the reason why riders want to go to Tenerife though, even though they might well be doping there.

The UCI? It's not the sole responbility of the UCI to test. The UKAD could test Froome if they wanted. But I'm sure they won't be testing Badzhilla boy...

Who can test?

The UCI’s Cycling Anti-Doping Foundation

The athlete’s National Anti-Doping Organisation based on their nationality

The athlete’s National Anti-Doping Organisation based on their racing license

A National Anti-Doping Organisation where athlete is staying, for example during a training camp

WADA, the IOC and “Major events organizers” like pre-Olympic tests

http://inrng.com/2014/03/where-are-you-adams-whereabouts/

 

[oldcrank]

Tenerife is easily accessible for testers, but what is the point of them going there? They can find passport irregularities in the riders, but there is no way they can do anything with them. If, for example, they find that a rider who has been staying in the Parador at 2,000m for a couple of weeks has much higher than normal hct, they have no way of knowing whether that is down to altitude or doping. It provides the perfect cover. There are nowhere near enough studies and research into the long and short term effects of altitude training for the testers to really go after a rider.

You are correct, my friend. That is why WADA, the UCI, the CADF
and all who care about drug-free sport applaud TeamSKY and the
University of Sheffield for their ground-breaking study with Sergio
Henao, an elite athlete and 'altitude native'.

 

[Benotti69]

You are correct, my friend. That is why WADA, the UCI, the CADF
and all who care about drug-free sport applaud TeamSKY and the
University of Sheffield for their ground-breaking study with Sergio
Henao, an elite athlete and 'altitude native'.

When teams test their own athletes the results are not credible.

Testing one athlete is also not enough.

 

[veganrob]

You are correct, my friend. That is why WADA, the UCI, the CADF
and all who care about drug-free sport applaud TeamSKY and the
University of Sheffield for their ground-breaking study with Sergio
Henao, an elite athlete and 'altitude native'.

Can you tell us the results of this "ground breaking study"?

 

[sniper]

When teams test their own athletes the results are not credible.

Testing one athlete is also not enough.

if such a report really is forthcoming, it can only mean Sheffield University sold out. The only honest research is independent research.
This is like FIFA funding research into corruption at FIFA.

anyway, it smells to me like Henao's passport was all over the place.
UCI and Sky then put their heads together and thought about ways to draw benefit from a nasty situation.

 

[pastronef]

training camps in Tenerife are announced by the teams, on their website or by the riders during interviews about their programs.
So anti doping agencies could plan and send some people to make controls, since we know in advance when the teams will be in Tenerife
Or just let UCI announce a 2 weeks stay by their testers before Dauphiné and see which riders decide to attend the Tenerife training camp.

I don't want to seem naive, actually I have no faith in doping controls and understand it's a crooked system.

 

[mewmewmew13]

https://twitter.com/flightradar24/status/536272686797029376


‏@flightradar24
"Air Berlin #AB2646 departed Dusseldorf for Funchal 10 hours ago. Diverted first to Teneriffe, later Porto Santo."

 

[neineinei]

Right. If the UCI doesn't want to hire a tester who lives in Tenerife it's a problem. It's not the reason why riders want to go to Tenerife though, even though they might well be doping there.

UCI buys out of competition testing from firms like Clearidium, PWC and IDTM, they don't have their own testers on Tenerife etc. etc.

A rider is submitted to an out-of-competition control. This type of control is delegated by the CADF to one of its partners (sampling agencies IDTM, PWC, GOS or Clearidium). The following stages are similar to that described for in-competition controls: recording the control in ADAMS, dispatch of an anonymous sample to a WADA-accredited laboratory for analysis, results of this analysis made known to CADF via ADAMS, examination of any potential breach by CADF and forwarding the dossier to the Legal Anti-Doping Service if necessary.

(Anyone know what GOS is?)

http://www.uci.ch/clean-sport/anti-doping/

 

[DirtyWorks]

training camps in Tenerife are announced by the teams, on their website or by the riders during interviews about their programs.
So anti doping agencies could plan and send some people to make controls, since we know in advance when the teams will be in Tenerife
Or just let UCI announce a 2 weeks stay by their testers before Dauphiné and see which riders decide to attend the Tenerife training camp.

I don't want to seem naive, actually I have no faith in doping controls and understand it's a crooked system.

UCI has access to the athlete's location system. (ADAMS) It's relatively easy for them to sort testing out.

If the UCI were actually interested in discouraging doping, the technical system is good. The UCI is only interested in keeping the doping controversy quiet.

The current system is so good Bach wants to spend USD$10m to replace it with something **more** scientific.

 

[the sceptic]

Schwarzer tells prosecutors doping of the gathering of the Teide, the Canary Islands, in 2010. Here are his words: "One day Ferrari, before leaving, he received me in the room to measure myself the weight. I remember that at that time there was a sheet written in pen by Ferrari on which were the names of Garzelli, Francesco Masciarelli, Bertagnolli and mine, standing next to the respective weight. i saw personally Garzelli, Francesco Masciarelli and Bertagnolli at the hotel in those days.

Doping on Tenerife? I thought that didn't happen anymore.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

How many Ferrari powered cyclists do we see here:
http://www.cyclingarchives.com/ritfiche.php?ritid=153285

Teide, where champions are born.