Will SKY make this ToF the most boring ever?

[maxmartin]

Its been more entertaining than some of the past years already (2009 springs to mind as having me reaching for the noose). It is an advert for why two such long ITTs must never, ever be permitted again. It makes victory a virtual impossibility for roughly 80% of the GC contenders because the time gaps are so huge between a good TT rider and a middling TT rider and equally big between a middling TT rider (e.g. Nibali) and a climber. The good thing is the climbers are all so far behind, surely one of them will roll the dice rather than settle for 8th or 9th... please?!

With a wild estimate I'd say you need about 3 MTFs for a climber to have any chance of making up what they lose in an ITT to a good TT rider (Evans, Wiggins) who can also climb. Plus, ITTs aren't much of a spectacle unless they are just before Paris.

i don't know what is the real definition of climber? In my opinion in the this tour so far the best 1 2 climber is F and W.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Yes .

 

[Thee_chisa]

Its been more entertaining than some of the past years already (2009 springs to mind as having me reaching for the noose). It is an advert for why two such long ITTs must never, ever be permitted again. It makes victory a virtual impossibility for roughly 80% of the GC contenders because the time gaps are so huge between a good TT rider and a middling TT rider and equally big between a middling TT rider (e.g. Nibali) and a climber.

if you wanna see that watch the giro. a tour climbers can win. the TDF is for the best climber, TTer, rouleur. not just a little jockey of a rider who can shoot off and gain 5 mins in mountains and then only have a 20km tt to defend it. most of the so-called GC contenders you talk about are actually climbers who can do a decent TT. they are not all-round proper GC riders

 

[kurtinsc]

Its been more entertaining than some of the past years already (2009 springs to mind as having me reaching for the noose). It is an advert for why two such long ITTs must never, ever be permitted again. It makes victory a virtual impossibility for roughly 80% of the GC contenders because the time gaps are so huge between a good TT rider and a middling TT rider and equally big between a middling TT rider (e.g. Nibali) and a climber. The good thing is the climbers are all so far behind, surely one of them will roll the dice rather than settle for 8th or 9th... please?!

With a wild estimate I'd say you need about 3 MTFs for a climber to have any chance of making up what they lose in an ITT to a good TT rider (Evans, Wiggins) who can also climb. Plus, ITTs aren't much of a spectacle unless they are just before Paris.

I personally like more TT km then we've had in the past few years, but they must vary the terrain.

I like one long (50km or so) flat ITT. I like a short all-uphill mountain ITT (say 15km). And I like a 20-25km ITT with a LOT of undulations.

 

[Cimber]

Yes (10 char)

 

[kurtinsc]

There's also a possibility here that people aren't looking at. We could get another Lemond/Hinault situation. What if Evans and a few others go and Wiggins can't follow but Froome can? THAT could be quite interesting... the team dynamics and all.

 

[FignonLeGrand]

Yes .

Is that just because ur fantastic Alberto is not there, or because theres too much TT? Afterall Alberto is rarher good in a TT

 

[maxmartin]

There's also a possibility here that people aren't looking at. We could get another Lemond/Hinault situation. What if Evans and a few others go and Wiggins can't follow but Froome can? THAT could be quite interesting... the team dynamics and all.

Italian paper has been talking this for a real long time, and they think that is probably the only way Nibali would have a chance to win the overall.

 

[H2OUUP2]

I personally like more TT km then we've had in the past few years, but they must vary the terrain.

I like one long (50km or so) flat ITT. I like a short all-uphill mountain ITT (say 15km). And I like a 20-25km ITT with a LOT of undulations.

I almost agree. One long (40-50km) ITT, One 15km all-uphill mountain ITT, and I would throw in a Team TT instead of the short ITT.

 

[Thee_chisa]

nibali needs to attack on the penultimate climb near the top, hammer it down, hope he get 1min+ then kill himself on the last climb and again hammer it down the descent. and he needs to do this on more than 1 day

 

[Thee_chisa]

I almost agree. One long (40-50km) ITT, One 15km all-uphill mountain ITT, and I would throw in a Team TT instead of the short ITT.

40-50K is not a long tt

 

[H2OUUP2]

40-50K is not a long tt

It is for me.

 

[Fergoose]

i don't know what is the real definition of climber? In my opinion in the this tour so far the best 1 2 climber is F and W.

We haven't hit the mountains yet, only foothills and 1st category climbs - I doubt the same will be true over the next 10 days. I'd consider the definition of a top climber as someone who, by themselves, are capable of an acceleration on an ascent that breaks them away from the leading group of riders. Or more simply, the riders who if you had an ITT solely up the side of a mountain, would be the fastest = top climbers.

Froome is able to perform like a top climber and could probably live with the on form Schlecks - but I treat Froome as an anomaly. Wiggins isn't and couldn't as he showed at the Vuelta.

If folk like a tour when only two riders are remotely considered as possibilities for victory and the remainder are 20/1+ outsiders simply because of the inclusion of two relatively flat ITTs then fair enough. Each to their own but I think there is masses of middle ground between that and a Giro/Vuelta route skewed in the favour of climbers. Even with just one ITT the TdF is traditionally heavily in favour of non-climbing specialists.

 

[DavidW78]

Hate hate hate... If you don't like it turn over the TV and watch fcking Eastenders.

No it's not '89 but... IT's THE TOUR DE FRANCE!! If you genuinely don't enjoy it then why why are you posting about it on an internet forum.

Drainers.

 

[maxmartin]

nibali needs to attack on the penultimate climb near the top, hammer it down, hope he get 1min+ then kill himself on the last climb and again hammer it down the descent. and he needs to do this on more than 1 day

I can't see anybody drop W and F in the uphill finish in this tour, Nibali can attack in stage 10, 16 downhill hopefully a wet mountain, but he also have to take huge risk in that sort of situation

 

[Thee_chisa]

It is for me.

in context it isn't

 

[jens_attacks]

it's up to the other teams
we'll see after the rest day
on grand colombier they should attack all over the place if they want to come back

until now
tour>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>giro

 

[maxmartin]

We haven't hit the mountains yet, only foothills and 1st category climbs - I doubt the same will be true over the next 10 days. I'd consider the definition of a top climber as someone who, by themselves, are capable of an acceleration on an ascent that breaks them away from the leading group of riders. Or more simply, the riders who if you had an ITT solely up the side of a mountain, would be the fastest = top climbers.

Froome is able to perform like a top climber and could probably live with the on form Schlecks - but I treat Froome as an anomaly. Wiggins isn't and couldn't as he showed at the Vuelta.

If folk like a tour when only two riders are remotely considered as possibilities for victory and the remainder are 20/1+ outsiders simply because of the inclusion of two relatively flat ITTs then fair enough. Each to their own but I think there is masses of middle ground between that and a Giro/Vuelta route skewed in the favour of climbers. Even with just one ITT the TdF is traditionally heavily in favour of non-climbing specialists.

I seriously doubt the tour percentage climb can break W, i actually thought W and F just simply will ride people off their wheels, On well let's see what happens in the next week. And that's also the reason I create this poll.

 

[cycladianpirate]

Hate hate hate... If you don't like it turn over the TV and watch fcking Eastenders.

No it's not '89 but... IT's THE TOUR DE FRANCE!! If you genuinely don't enjoy it then why why are you posting about it on an internet forum.

Drainers.

If that's how people get their jollies, then leave them to it....

Actually, it's better than that, it's bloody funny - enjoy

 

[H2OUUP2]

in context it isn't

True. But I was going off of what I'd like to see. I guess I could say THE long ITT would be 40-50km.

 

[Fergoose]

I seriously doubt the tour percentage climb can break W, i actually thought W and F just simply will ride people off their wheels, On well let's see what happens in the next week. And that's also the reason I create this poll.

Yes. Being dragged around by the mighty Froome will keep Wiggins highly competitive in the climbs and he won't lose much if anything to anyone in GC contention - but for me that doesn't make him a top climber. Remove Froome from the equation and I honestly think Wiggins would be lost at sea and extremely vulnerable to being picked off by his opponents' changes of pace. That is what cost him a podium in 2009, one acceleration after another and nobody to pace him put him into the red.

 

[maxmartin]

Yes. Being dragged around by the mighty Froome will keep Wiggins highly competitive in the climbs and he won't lose much if anything to anyone in GC contention - but for me that doesn't make him a top climber. Remove Froome from the equation and I honestly think Wiggins would be lost at sea and extremely vulnerable to being picked off by his opponents' changes of pace. That is what cost him a podium in 2009, one acceleration after another and nobody to pace him put him into the red.

that is the reason he left Garmin

 

[Potomac]

It isn't over yet, and BMC and Liquigas could make it interesting if they ride for the win instead of riding for a respectable placing.

 

[maxmartin]

since the poll started it has been 50 50, glad SKY spits our opinions evenly

 

[maxmartin]

It isn't over yet, and BMC and Liquigas could make it interesting if they ride for the win instead of riding for a respectable placing.

they definitely will ride for the win in the second week, but if it does not work and the race goes on, they have to fight for their place too, especially Nibali never podiumed before