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Jul 4, 2009
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Scott SoCal said:
Would it surprise you to know the Tea Party began with an emails exchange between a Hispanic American woman and an Asian American woman? Imagine that. Minority women starting the Tea Party.
...and a bunch of big money that definitely was from the white and privileged side of the tracks...

...btw would be interesting to see how the Tea Party is doing with the Asian and Hispanic American communities...so if you have any solid numbers to back up the contention your statement implies that would be nice ...otherwise it would make you look like you are just blowing smoke......

Cheers

blutto
 
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Anonymous

Guest
blutto said:
...and a bunch of big money that definitely was from the white and privileged side of the tracks...

...btw would be interesting to see how the Tea Party is doing with the Asian and Hispanic American communities...so if you have any solid numbers to back up the contention your statement implies that would be nice ...otherwise it would make you look like you are just blowing smoke......

Cheers

blutto
B, my statements only implication is that the Tea Party was started with some emails exchanged between two women of ethnic backgrounds. That is a fact.

And BTW, there was an error earlier. One of the women is actually Philippine American.

My mistake for which I apologize profusely because it's incredibly important for me, Scott SoCal, not to be viewed by you as a smoke blower.
 
Jun 22, 2009
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Such a shame that you have to trivialize OWT with a poster and a hair cut, Scott. Here is something written by a Jew on Al-Jazeera and very worth reading (imho) -

For three long years since the financial crisis began, American politics has been dominated by the politics of projection, displacement and denial - three basic subconscious ego defence mechanisms that are tremendously powerful in defending the indefensible. On the personal level, such defence mechanisms - analysed by Anna Freud in her 1937 book, The Ego and the Mechanisms of Defence - protect the ego from conflicts that seemingly threaten its destruction, or at the very least weaken its foundations. They are, in a sense, helpful and adaptive at an early stage, since ego survival is a precondition for everything else. But they can take on a life of their own, “protecting” the ego from things that must be dealt with in order to grow as it should. The same is true when these mechanisms function socially, “defending” large groups of people - even whole civilisations - against facing up to their most important challenges, and preventing them from resolving conflicts that threaten to destroy them.

Such has been the establishment's response to the financial crash of 2008 and its ongoing repercussions until now. In one short month, Occupy Wall Street has begun to change all that. While Occupy Wall Street is purportedly raucous, incoherent, and lacking in clarity, it has done more than anything else in the past three years to begin stripping away the dangerously irrational nonsense protected by and embodied in those three social defence mechanisms. In the wake of its global coming out day on October 15, it is a good idea to take stock of this remarkable accomplishment.

remainder of the article here - http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth/opinion/2011/10/201110208525806842.html
 
Sep 10, 2009
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Scott SoCal said:
And you. Your words;
um, no. I said "tea baggers". You extrapolated that to "conservatives".
What party does he run?
The Republican Party.

Would it surprise you to know the Tea Party began with an emails exchange between a Hispanic American woman and an Asian American woman? Imagine that. Minority women starting the Tea Party.
I would be very surprised, considering that it's untrue.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_protests

btw notice the timing:

"The founder of market-ticker.org, Karl Denninger (stock trader and former CEO),[44] published his own write-up on the proposed protest, titled "Tea Party February 1st?, which was posted in direct response to President Obama's inauguration occurring on the same day..."

EDIT: ah you're referring to Michelle Malkin. No, sorry, she was late to the party.
 
Dec 7, 2010
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redtreviso said:
"""
The oil services giant did a lot of business in Libya -- before, during, and after whatever passed for sanctions over the decades.



ABOUT HALLIBURTON

Libya

"We hope Iraq will be the first domino and that Libya and Iran will follow. We don't like being kept out of markets because it gives our competitors an unfair advantage," John Gibson, chief executive of Halliburton's Energy Service Group, told International Oil Daily in an interview in May of 2003.1

Some of the most significant sanctions against doing business with Libya were put in place by President Reagan in 1986, in response to the country's use and support of terrorism against the United States and other countries. The sanctions banned most sales of goods, technology and services to Libya. They provided for criminal penalties of up to 10 years in prison and $500,000 in corporate and $250,000 in individual fines.2

Despite these sanctions, Halliburton subsidiary Brown & Root had worked in Libya ever since the 1980s. The company helped construct a system of underground pipes and wells that purportedly are intended to carry water. But according to Congressman Waxman, "some experts believe that the pipes have a military purpose. The pipes are large enough to accommodate military vehicles and appear to be more elaborate than is needed for holding water. The company began working on the project in 1984 and transferred the work to its British office after the 1986 sanctions were enacted in the United States.3

In 1995, Halliburton was fined $3.8 million for re-exporting U.S. goods through a foreign subsidiary to Libya in violation of U.S. sanctions.4 The company reportedly peddled oil drilling tools (pulse neutron generators) that critics say can be used to trigger nuclear bombs.5 So, while the Bush administration triumphs over Libya's recent surrender of weapons of mass destruction programs to U.S. authorities, it was Halliburton which contributed to their creation in the first place. ""
Hey I worked for Brown and Root ....hmmmm
 
Dec 7, 2010
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redtreviso said:
here's more your kind...Impressive!!!!! go scotty







I like that white flag with the AR on it. Nice weapon that AR15

Hey I am not the only person calling President Obama a Socialist???? who knew.

Timothy McVeigh was only 6foot2? I thought he was more like 6foot5???
 
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Anonymous

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VeloCity said:
um, no. I said "tea baggers". You extrapolated that to "conservatives".
The Republican Party.

I would be very surprised, considering that it's untrue.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tea_Party_protests

btw notice the timing:

"The founder of market-ticker.org, Karl Denninger (stock trader and former CEO),[44] published his own write-up on the proposed protest, titled "Tea Party February 1st?, which was posted in direct response to President Obama's inauguration occurring on the same day..."

EDIT: ah you're referring to Michelle Malkin. No, sorry, she was late to the party.
New York Times reporter Kate Zernike has found the original seed of the Tea Party movement — and she isn't anything like the old, white Christian conservatives that polls and photos from rallies might suggest.

She's a half-Mexican math teacher with a nose piercing who enjoys doing improv theater on weekends. Her name is Keli Carender
Zernike tells NPR's David Greene that Carender's frustration with the stimulus package, bank bailouts and the collapse of the economy drove her to take after the anti-war protesters of her native Seattle and organize a protest.

"She calls up a conservative radio host and she e-mails Michelle Malkin, the conservative blogger, and they both give her a plug for her protest and she gets about 200 people there," Zernike says.
"She really is the germ of this movement. And about a week and a half later is when what everybody calls 'The Rant' happens."

"The Rant," delivered from the floor of the Chicago Board of Trade, is CNBC reporter Rick Santelli's critique of President Obama's proposal to help homeowners who can no longer afford their mortgages. In it, Santelli proposes the idea of having a tea party in Chicago, and that, Zernike says, is what sparked some major organizing.

"A bunch of young conservatives who were all on Twitter start tweeting about ['The Rant'] and they agree that they're going to have a conference call that night to plan tea parties," she says. "There are about 50 of them on a conference call that night. They have a conference call every night that week and a week later there are tea parties in somewhere between 30 and 50 cities across the country."

Between the libertarians, the social conservatives and the suburban moms, Zernike says it became clear that even those original conference call organizers weren't all coming from the same place.

"It's really hard to put a label, or put a face on the Tea Party," Zernike says.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=129865403

And there you have it.
 
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Anonymous

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Amsterhammer said:
Such a shame that you have to trivialize OWT with a poster and a hair cut, Scott.
Am I in some sort of alternate universe??

You know, you're right. The only 'movement' with any merit are one's you empathize with. All others (Tea Party) can be trivialized, marginalized, ostracized until the cows come home with nary a peep from you.

BTW, when's the last time you used the term 'tea bagger'? Trivialized? I'd think so but then what do I know?
 
I think what I find most fascinating about the TP is that when they first formed it was mostly out of frustration regarding the bank bailouts. Now, they don't care about that, or any other type of neoconservative collusion between the banks and government. Their primary focus seems to be on eliminating government oversight on social issues, while turning a blind eye to any form of corporate socialism. Fascinating.
 
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Anonymous

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Alpe d'Huez said:
I think what I find most fascinating about the TP is that when they first formed it was mostly out of frustration regarding the bank bailouts. Now, they don't care about that, or any other type of neoconservative collusion between the banks and government. Their primary focus seems to be on eliminating government oversight on social issues, while turning a blind eye to any form of corporate socialism. Fascinating.
Okay, do you think the OWS will look the same 2 years from now?

I'm guessing it will look very different...
 
May 23, 2010
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""The "Fox and Friends" hosts, who Olbermann described as "the B-team to the weekday dingbats" and as "astoundingly bad," harshly criticized Hessler for associating her decision to temporarily leave her family and participate in Occupy Wall Street with military personnel who have to leave their families to serve. They called it "disgusting" and Camerota said that Hessler "must be having a midlife crisis of some sort to leave [her] kids."

"So she's disgusting, she's having a midlife crisis, she is denying her husband sex and is an unfit mother because she decided to get involved in something political that she believes in?" Olbermann wondered.""

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/25/keith-olbermann-fox-news_n_1030169.html

She should stay home and submit like Republican women do..
 
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Anonymous

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redtreviso said:
""The "Fox and Friends" hosts, who Olbermann described as "the B-team to the weekday dingbats" and as "astoundingly bad," harshly criticized Hessler for associating her decision to temporarily leave her family and participate in Occupy Wall Street with military personnel who have to leave their families to serve. They called it "disgusting" and Camerota said that Hessler "must be having a midlife crisis of some sort to leave [her] kids."

"So she's disgusting, she's having a midlife crisis, she is denying her husband sex and is an unfit mother because she decided to get involved in something political that she believes in?" Olbermann wondered.""

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/25/keith-olbermann-fox-news_n_1030169.html

She should stay home and submit like Republican women do..

Alisyn is hot.

 
May 23, 2010
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1. Occupy Wall Street is a grassroots movement, funded by people around the world, without corporate sponsorship.
The Tea Party is an AstroTurf movement, receiving most of its funding from corporate sponsorship, and Fox News and its supporters.

2. Occupy Wall Street wants less corporate influence over our Government.
The Tea Party wants less Governmental influence over corporations.

3. Occupy Wall Street didn’t receive mainstream media coverage until several weeks after it began.
The Tea Party held rallies across the country sponsored by Fox News, and even small rallies with minimal turnout received attention from other media outlets.

4. Occupy Wall Street protesters are unarmed.
The Tea Party protesters openly carried a large variety of guns, including assault rifles.

5. Over 1,000 Occupy Wall Street Protesters have been arrested.
Zero Tea Party Protesters have been arrested.

6. Occupy Wall Street doesn’t endorse either political party.
The Tea Party actively endorsed the Republican Party.

7. Occupy Wall Street protests have sparked similar protests around the world.
The Tea Party protests were ridiculed around the world.


8. Occupy Wall Street protests have more than 50% approval from the general public.
The Tea Party protests peaked at 18% approval from the general public.

9. Occupy Wall Street protesters represent the poor, the disenfranchised, and the people who don’t feel like they have a voice in our Government.
The Tea Party protesters represented the wealthy, the elite, and the corporations who already have too much influence in our Government.

10. Occupy Wall Street doesn’t want politicians to co-opt their movement.
The Tea Party protests regularly featured speeches from conservative political figures like Sarah Palin and Glenn Beck.

11. Occupy Wall Street protesters signs are spelled correctly.
Many Tea Party protest signs featured glaring spelling and grammatical errors.

12. Occupy Wall Street is supported by the youth in this country.
A majority of the Tea Party’s support came from middle-age citizens and people 65 and up.

13. Occupy Wall Street represents the 99% of Americans who aren’t millionaires and billionaires, and who don’t have a voice in our Government.
The Tea Party represents the wealthiest Americans, and wants the Government to stop trying to tax them.

14. Occupy Wall Street protesters are setting up camps across the country, to get attention from the media and to show that they’re serious.
The Tea Party went home as soon as their corporately sponsored rallies were over.

15. Occupy Wall Street has received endless criticism from the right-wing.
The Tea Party received endless and unconditional praise from the right-wing.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2011/10/25/15-major-differences-between-occupy-wall-street-and-the-tea-party-protests/
 
Sep 10, 2009
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Scott SoCal said:
OK, let's go with that story.

Michelle Malkin:
Racist? Check (not to mention psychotic but that's another story)
Hates Obama? Check

And the main one:
Tea Party only outraged and organized after Obama's election? Check

Hell, even TP leaders acknowledge that: "Tea Party leaders say they know their complaints about shredded constitutional principles and excessive spending ring hollow to some, given their relative passivity through the Bush years." No ****.

Also, failing to see how any of this changes the fact that many TP'ers are racist and that the movement is largely motivated by a hatred for Obama.
 
Sep 10, 2009
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Scott SoCal said:
Okay, do you think the OWS will look the same 2 years from now?

I'm guessing it will look very different...
OWS is no different than the TP - a bunch of ****ed off people who aren't quite sure what they're ****ed off about, but they sure know who to blame for the country's woes - Obama for the TP'ers, Wall St for the OWS'ers. They're both looking for simplistic answers to convoluted issues and quick fixes to complex problems and a convenient enemy to blame - let's just say that, imo, neither group is composed of particularly deep thinkers. Problem is, for both sides, outrage largely for the sake of outrage can only be sustained for so long. I don't see any sort of depth with either the TP or OWS that would suggest either are going to last very long. The TP is already starting to wane and I'd be surprised if the OWS lasted any longer.

That's not to say that I don't pick sides - obviously I'm more sympathetic to the OWS cause than I am to the TP, and the more attention OWS can bring to some of these issues the better. I just don't think "movements" like this have enough gravitas to be sustained and because of that, ultimately they're kind of pointless.
 
May 23, 2010
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VeloCity said:
OWS is no different than the TP - a bunch of ****ed off people who aren't quite sure what they're ****ed off about, but they sure know who to blame for the country's woes - Obama for the TP'ers, Wall St for the OWS'ers. They're both looking for simplistic answers to convoluted issues and quick fixes to complex problems and a convenient enemy to blame - let's just say that, imo, neither group is composed of particularly deep thinkers. Problem is, for both sides, outrage largely for the sake of outrage can only be sustained for so long. I don't see any sort of depth with either the TP or OWS that would suggest either are going to last very long. The TP is already starting to wane and I'd be surprised if the OWS lasted any longer.
Ever heard any TBrs rue about Gramm Leach Bliley? or call for Glass Steagle to be reinstated?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVqb73f8Vmg



 
"let's just say that, imo, neither group is composed of particularly deep thinkers."

So you don't think this guy is a particularly deep thinker; or is at least representative of some class of deep thinkers?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Graeber

How many people like him, or trained similarly to him would need to be involved for you to credit the activity with at least attracting deep thinkers? And would they need to be giving interviews with mainstream media organs for you to believe that they exist?

Or is this going back to the same root objection that's been leveled at the movement from the beginning: that it's inchoate, there's no coherent statement, there are no professionals (other than professional anarchists) represented within the movement?
 
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Anonymous

Guest
VeloCity said:
OK, let's go with that story.

Michelle Malkin:
Racist? Check (not to mention psychotic but that's another story)
Hates Obama? Check

And the main one:
Tea Party only outraged and organized after Obama's election? Check

Hell, even TP leaders acknowledge that: "Tea Party leaders say they know their complaints about shredded constitutional principles and excessive spending ring hollow to some, given their relative passivity through the Bush years." No ****.

Also, failing to see how any of this changes the fact that many TP'ers are racist and that the movement is largely motivated by a hatred for Obama.
Malkin's a racist now? Phillipino Power?

I don't think you actually know what being racist means.

Also, failing to see how any of this changes the fact that many TP'ers are racist and that the movement is largely motivated by a hatred for Obama
Is it possible the 'movement' is motivated by a hatred of Obama policies and not of the man himself, or are you capable of seeing the difference?
 
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Anonymous

Guest
VeloCity said:
OWS is no different than the TP - a bunch of ****ed off people who aren't quite sure what they're ****ed off about, but they sure know who to blame for the country's woes - Obama for the TP'ers, Wall St for the OWS'ers. They're both looking for simplistic answers to convoluted issues and quick fixes to complex problems and a convenient enemy to blame - let's just say that, imo, neither group is composed of particularly deep thinkers. Problem is, for both sides, outrage largely for the sake of outrage can only be sustained for so long. I don't see any sort of depth with either the TP or OWS that would suggest either are going to last very long. The TP is already starting to wane and I'd be surprised if the OWS lasted any longer.

That's not to say that I don't pick sides - obviously I'm more sympathetic to the OWS cause than I am to the TP, and the more attention OWS can bring to some of these issues the better. I just don't think "movements" like this have enough gravitas to be sustained and because of that, ultimately they're kind of pointless.
Unbelievably, we largely agree on something. More or less.
 
Jun 22, 2009
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Scott SoCal said:
Is it possible the 'movement' is motivated by a hatred of Obama policies and not of the man himself, or are you capable of seeing the difference?
I'm pretty sure that all of us on 'this' side of the fence know what a racist is, and recognize one when we see/hear them.

Again, I really did expect a bit more honesty from you. You are clearly not a fool and, as far as I can tell, not a Teabagger either. So why do you keep trying to defend the indefensible? You know perfectly well that the unprecedented Republican Hun wing animosity towards Obama was based on one thing first and foremost - that he is an articulate and intelligent black man. I have no doubt that in addition, 'they' despise all his policies (as has been demonstrated time and again by the Huns in Congress,) but gut racism undoubtedly lies at the root of 'their' hatred.
 
Jun 22, 2009
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Non-profit US newscaster gives a voice to grassroot activists

The Occupy Wall Street campaign has found a champion in a US newscaster that is dedicated to giving a voice to grassroots activists.

Democracy Now! is a 15-year-old independent TV and radio programme that gives a voice to those usually excluded from the television screen.

Operated as a non-profit organisation and distributed through a patchwork of stations, channels and websites, the programme appeals to people who are sceptical of "big media". And it doesn't carry commercials.

The New York Times points out that although it has long had a loyal audience, Democracy Now! has suddenly gained more attention because of its coverage of two news events — the execution of Troy Davis and Occupy Wall Street (OWS).

The programme's reporters were the first media outfit to take the Manhattan occupation seriously.

Senior news producer Mike Burke, said: "At the time, we had no idea if the protest would even last the night, but we recognised it as potentially an important story. It took NPR more than a week to air its first story on the movement."

One of its main hosts, Amy Goodman, believes media can be "the greatest force for peace on earth". But the views of a majority of Americans have been "silenced by the corporate media."

I've mentioned it several times over the past couple of years (examples: here, here and here) because it carries material the networks ignore.

Last week there was a classic example. No US network covered the filing of a lawsuit in Canada by four men who claim that they were tortured during the Bush administration and who are seeking the former president's arrest and prosecution.

One of the men, Murat Kurnaz, a former prisoner at Guantánamo Bay, was interviewed at length by Goodman and her co-host, Juan Gonzalez.

The programme relies on public donations and also relies on volunteers to transcribe segments and, occasionally, to translate foreign-language interviews.

Source: New York Times

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/greenslade/2011/oct/26/occupy-wall-street-tv-news
 
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