World Politics

[rhubroma]

I figured it was something similar. He was walking a tight rope for quite some time with his controversial satire (and it's not just about Islam) and it just seems to have boiled over.
I'll try and put this as 'satirically' as possible. You can't fart on another man and say he smells. Read in real language as 'you can't bomb other countries and portray them as radicals.' Islam has too many fundamentalists but it's better to check one's backyard before criticizing another.

Let's distinguish, though, ramjambunath, between the bellicose agenda of the regime and what actual conquests in the realm of freedom of expression among the citizenry exist in our society.

There are plenty of satirists who have poked fun at Christ, or Moses, in the spirit of irony and to cause reflection, without the dreadful consequences. Then there are those who have repeatedly made fun of our political leaders for "farting", to use your metaphor, on the Middle East to say that it stinks just to justify their wars for oil. The whole issue of nuclear proliferation and Iran, for example, coming from America and the West, which has the largest military arsenal on the planet, at the rational level appears ludicrously hypocritical when one really thinks about it. At the same time, who wants to see an Islamic fundamentalist regime armed with such weapons?

In any case, the point here, which I have tried to drive home before: is one of tolerance. And, once again, the difference between the level of tolerance between the secular part of the Western World and the Islamic fundamentalists is an abyss; one into which civilization might well get launched if things intensify to the extreme. So that every act of ultra-Muslim violence, for example, provides another reason to find it unacceptable that a nation such as Iran gets the A-bomb, making the atrocious prospect of a war more and more likely.

And here one must decide upon a position. I'm as for cleaning up one's garden, before telling one's neighbor how to clean up his as the next guy. However, at least in this rare case, the West has tidied up its yard in the realm of freedom of expression and for the most part eliminated (with the exception of the rare, though noteworthy, cases) the more violent and reactionary gestures, to a degree that the Muslim world simply has not. Yet, today, many from the Muslim world have integrated into Western society, though expect to dictate what is acceptable and what is not in the realm of satire.

Hence as controversial and indecorous as the French daily's satirical gesture may have been, above all in a moment like this, I'd rather live in a society in which such acts, while understood as a provocation, don't result in attempted mass murder, than one in which they would find a legal justification, or alibi, in sacred writ and religious law.

In the 21st century such laws from sacred writ, be it the Bible or the Koran, have absolutely no place in a modern progressive and pluralistic democracy, because they are intolerance personified. As far as I'm concerned those among the Muslim faith (or any religion) in our society who don't vehemently denounce such acts as vile and inexcusable crimes, should ask themselves why they don't seek access to a theocracy such as Iran, where they would find an environment more congenial to their radical religious beliefs.

 

[ramjambunath]

Of course, I don't disagree with you on the fact that tolerance is lower in middle Eastern Islamic countries (especially). The comment I made was a bit in jest and my point was just about trying to reason why there may be lower tolerance on one side and it seemed to stare me right in the face, the history of the Middle east in the past 50 years and the powerful Western govts' meddling in many internal affairs of many countries that has led to a possible feeling of victimisation among the Islamic populace. There certainly is a small feeling of resentment among many Muslims (even the even minded ones), which is understandable.

Muslim society in the western world has to amalgamate into the population and learn to tolerate the idiosyncrasies of the West just as the Western population living in Arab nations have learnt to live within their own idiosyncratic systems. On that point, I totally agree with you. That also includes not trying to force Sharia law in other places.

 

[Captain_Cavman]

It's 6.16% now, a massive increase since Friday. I know you don't care but the eighth largest economy appears to be hurtling towards disaster.

An interesting article from AEP.

"...Are such changes to be decided by Italy’s elected parliament by proper process, or be pushed through by foreign dictate when the country is on its knees? “Political ownership” is of critical importance. The EU is crossing lines everywhere, forgetting that it remains no more than a treaty organization of sovereign states. Democratic accountability is breaking down..."

It sure is and not just in the EU.

6.61% now. There's an interesting take on why in the Telegraph

Franco Bechis, deputy editor-in-chief of Libero newspaper which has close ties to the Italian PM, has tweeted that Berlusconi is to resign tonight or tomorrow morning following a summit of the ruluing Il Popolo della Liberta party. He will announce his resignation by asking Parliament to approve a new financial stability law. He has asked Fedele Confalonieri, a television mogul and member of the Italian Confederation of Industry, to join the cabinet.

Conspiracy theories abound this morning, with speculation that the ECB is letting Italian yields soar to put pressure on Berlusconi to go.

Analysts at Citi note that the collapse of the government in Rome would be viewed as a positive development in the sovereign debt crisis. They write:

"Whilst the political uncertainty is not welcomed by the markets, a Reuters’ survey of 10 fund managers showed that bond prices would recover and the yield spread over German bonds would fall by a full percentage point if Mr Berlusconi’s government should fall."

And getting rid of Silvio would certainly be cheaper for the ECB than buying up massive amounts of Italian debt.

 

[rhubroma]

Of course, I don't disagree with you on the fact that tolerance is lower in middle Eastern Islamic countries (especially). The comment I made was a bit in jest and my point was just about trying to reason why there may be lower tolerance on one side and it seemed to stare me right in the face, the history of the Middle east in the past 50 years and the powerful Western govts' meddling in many internal affairs of many countries that has led to a possible feeling of victimisation among the Islamic populace. There certainly is a small feeling of resentment among many Muslims (even the even minded ones), which is understandable.

Muslim society in the western world has to amalgamate into the population and learn to tolerate the idiosyncrasies of the West just as the Western population living in Arab nations have learnt to live within their own idiosyncratic systems. On that point, I totally agree with you. That also includes not trying to force Sharia law in other places.

Tolerance is an arduous path to walk. It takes time, serious introspection and, above all, doubt. This is why for the conservative mindset, and especially among the religious conservatives, tolerance goes contrary to nature.

And as nature is the hardest thing to overcome and change, the task becomes even more arduous and difficult.

 

[Bala Verde]

Anyone see this?

Working for Less;
A Hidden Toll as States Shift to Contract Workers on the use of contractors for government services:

Th state budgets under pressure, Michigan says it can no longer afford the relatively high wages of the public workers, which range from $15 to $20 an hour, along with health and retirement benefits. According to Salary.com, certified nursing assistants in private long-term care facilities in the area earn a median salary of just over $25,000 a year, or about $12.25 a hour.

People can't get by on that salary, so they sign up for food stamps...

Mr. Spallone, a 64-year-old Vietnam veteran who said he had served “12 months, eight days, four hours and 22 minutes” as an Army engineer, described the state’s caregivers as “like family.” He suggested the government “drop one less bomb overseas and pay these guys’ salaries.”

Economists and other academics who study outsourcing are divided about whether it usually saves a government money. Recent data from Arizona shows that privately operated prisons often cost more to operate than state-run facilities. A study by the Project on Government Oversight, a nonprofit Washington group, found that in 33 of 35 occupations, using contractors cost the federal government billions of dollars more than using government employees.

(not related to this article; also look at the Commission for Wartime Contracting;

The U.S. has committed $62 billion to rebuilding Iraq and $72 billion for the reconstruction of Afghanistan.

[...]

The independent Commission on Wartime Contracting estimated in August that at least $31 billion has been lost to waste and fraud in Iraq and Afghanistan, adding that the total could be as high as $60 billion. It studied not just reconstruction spending, but $206 billion for the logistical support of coalition forces and the performance of security functions.

The commission found that from 10 to 20 percent of the $206 billion in spending was wasted, while fraud accounted for the loss of another 5 to 9 percent.

 

[Bala Verde]

And also a good morning read which confirms once again why most investment firms sell bullcr@p advise:

Why Wall street can't handle the truth

Unfortunately, some are little more than cheerleaders—afraid of rocking the boat at their firms, afraid of alienating the companies they cover and drawing the wrath of their superiors. The proportion of sell ratings on Wall Street remains under 5%, even today, despite the fact that any first-year MBA student can tell you that 95% of the stocks cannot be winners

In decades past, the ratio of buy ratings to sell ratings had not been this lopsided, and in theory it should be roughly 50-50. That seems right, doesn't it? Some stocks go up, some go down, because of the overall market direction or competitive threats or issues specific to each company. In the late 1990s, though, the ratio was 100 buys or more for every sell. Merrill Lynch had buy ratings on 940 stocks and sell ratings on just 7. Salomon Smith Barney: 856 buy ratings, 4 sells. Morgan Stanley Dean Witter: 670 buys and exactly 0 sells.

Analysts almost never said to sell specific companies, because that would alienate those firms, which then might move business for bond offerings, equity deals, acquisitions, buybacks or other activity away from the analyst's brokerage firm. Say the word "sell" enough times, and you win a long, awkward elevator ride out of the building with your soon-to-be-former boss. And here I was, ready to go negative on the entire banking sector

 

[Anonymous]

Don't look now, here are two more groups of Americans to be pit against each other.

We clearly need to tax old people. Wealth distribution is good for all of us, so says the prez.

WASHINGTON (AP) — The wealth gap between younger and older Americans has stretched to the widest on record, worsened by a prolonged economic downturn that has wiped out job opportunities for young adults and saddled them with housing and college debt.

The typical U.S. household headed by a person age 65 or older has a net worth 47 times greater than a household headed by someone under 35, according to an analysis of census data released Monday.

While people typically accumulate assets as they age, this wealth gap is now more than double what it was in 2005 and nearly five times the 10-to-1 disparity a quarter-century ago, after adjusting for inflation.

The 47-to-1 wealth gap between old and young is believed by demographers to be the highest ever, even predating government records.

In all, 37 percent of younger-age households have a net worth of zero or less, nearly double the share in 1984.

"Over time, even under a revised poverty measure, the elderly have done better,"

http://news.yahoo.com/us-wealth-gap-between-young-old-widest-ever-050259922.html


I guess "tax the rich'" really means "tax the old".

 

[blutto]

...as long as we are throwing stuff out there, here is the Coles Notes version of the The Big Lie that is a major underlying cause of the economic malaise that is now sweeping the land...

...and as an added bonus the article identifies the medical issue that is currently plaguing SoCal...apparently its called cognitive dissonance...which on the one hand is fortunately not fatal but on the other hand is really annoying...my heart goes out to SoCal ( being so afflicted must produce a very lonely life so we should go out of our way to engage the poor man in conversation no matter how inane his comments are )...

...all in all a great article and after you read it I'm sure you guys will most likely agree...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...2011/10/31/gIQAXlSOqM_story.html?sub=AR1.html

Cheers

blutto

 

[redtreviso]

Don't look now, here are two more groups of Americans to be pit against each other.

We clearly need to tax old people. Wealth distribution is good for all of us, so says the prez.


http://news.yahoo.com/us-wealth-gap-between-young-old-widest-ever-050259922.html


I guess "tax the rich'" really means "tax the old".

Funny how someone would put out that article as if that stated age disparity was at issue.. I'm sure Rush and Fox will run with it..

 

[Anonymous]

Funny how someone would put out that article as if that stated age disparity was at issue.. I'm sure Rush and Fox will run with it..

Gee, I thought it was an income disparity issue.

Your own party is comin' for you Red. Better hide yer money.

 

[blutto]

Funny how someone would put out that article as if that stated age disparity was at issue.. I'm sure Rush and Fox will run with it..

...certainly a very sneaky/slimy and darn effective framing of the issue...but given where that framing comes from and who is currently pushing it no real surprise....

Cheers

blutto

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Don't look now, here are two more groups of Americans to be pit against each other.

We clearly need to tax old people. Wealth distribution is good for all of us, so says the prez.







http://news.yahoo.com/us-wealth-gap-between-young-old-widest-ever-050259922.html


I guess "tax the rich'" really means "tax the old".

I also saw this on my twitter this morning.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/storie...ME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2011-11-07-11-25-44

 

[Anonymous]

...as long as we are throwing stuff out there, here is the Coles Notes version of the The Big Lie that is a major underlying cause of the economic malaise that is now sweeping the land...

...and as an added bonus the article identifies the medical issue that is currently plaguing SoCal...apparently its called cognitive dissonance...which on the one hand is fortunately not fatal but on the other hand is really annoying...my heart goes out to SoCal ( being so afflicted must produce a very lonely life so we should go out of our way to engage the poor man in conversation no matter how inane his comments are )...

...all in all a great article and after you read it I'm sure you guys will most likely agree...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...2011/10/31/gIQAXlSOqM_story.html?sub=AR1.html

Cheers

blutto

I gather you stopped reading at 'cognitive dissonance' so you could run over here and insult me.

My reading of the article is that;

To be clear, no single issue was the cause. Our economy is a complex and intricate system.

 

[Anonymous]

...certainly a very sneaky/slimy and darn effective framing of the issue...but given where that framing comes from and who is currently pushing it no real surprise....

Cheers

blutto

It was an AP article, genius.

Had you read it you would know that these numbers have been tracked for some time.

 

[Anonymous]

I also saw this on my twitter this morning.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/storie...ME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2011-11-07-11-25-44

Yes, I'm confident this will not be a campaign issue

 

[redtreviso]

It was an AP article, genius.

Had you read it you would know that these numbers have been tracked for some time.

I read it in the paper this morning.. It accredited "demographers" but it came from the PEW "think tank"...It was still a smoke screen article trying to cast asparagus on OWS and anyone else who complains about the 1%..They then let "your kind" run with the "redistribution" angle.

 

[blutto]

I gather you stopped reading at 'cognitive dissonance' so you could run over here and insult me.

My reading of the article is that;

To be clear, no single issue was the cause. Our economy is a complex and intricate system.

...the fact that you see that as your reading of the issue is a most wonderful surprise...certainly a nice change from your usual ranting about the gubermint and those darn librrrllls....so those prayers I offered this weekend in hopes of saving your soul have not gone unanswered...wow, you are not a total lost cause there is hope for you after all....

Cheers

blutto

 

[blutto]

It was an AP article, genius.

Had you read it you would know that these numbers have been tracked for some time.

...I'm guessing the implication is that AP is at some level a reliably neutral disseminator of news....in point of fact it is just a facsimile of of the old USSR period Pravada, though with better ad copy... so thanks for helping me to prove my point, you are such a pal....

Cheers

blutto

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I also saw this on my twitter this morning:
US poverty at new high: 16 percent, or 49.1M

Not surprised at all. Regardless of which candidate gets elected, I expect this slide to continue. I see no policies by Obama or any Republican that will change this hardly at all. They will continue to represent the Immelt's, Koch's, etc. as a priority above all else.

 

[Anonymous]

...the fact that you see that as your reading of the issue is a most wonderful surprise...certainly a nice change from your usual ranting about the gubermint and those darn librrrllls....so those prayers I offered this weekend in hopes of saving your soul have not gone unanswered...wow, you are not a total lost cause there is hope for you after all....

Cheers

blutto

the fact that you see that as your reading of the issue is a most wonderful surprise...certainly a nice change from your usual ranting about the gubermint and those darn librrrllls

Well, since you have no idea what I'm about I'll give you a hint;

Corruption is the biggest problem we have. Not the left, not the right, not the rich.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

...as long as we are throwing stuff out there, here is the Coles Notes version of the The Big Lie that is a major underlying cause of the economic malaise that is now sweeping the land...

...and as an added bonus the article identifies the medical issue that is currently plaguing SoCal...apparently its called cognitive dissonance...which on the one hand is fortunately not fatal but on the other hand is really annoying...my heart goes out to SoCal ( being so afflicted must produce a very lonely life so we should go out of our way to engage the poor man in conversation no matter how inane his comments are )......all in all a great article and after you read it I'm sure you guys will most likely agree...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...2011/10/31/gIQAXlSOqM_story.html?sub=AR1.html

Cheers

blutto

Not really as there is a very large number of people who with the exact same beliefs as Scott's.
Not so hard to understand really when someone has a different opinion and is passionate about it than that is what commonly referred to as a “different opinion from a different political party”.
That is the exact reason why we vote.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

...I'm guessing the implication is that AP is at some level a reliably neutral disseminator of news....in point of fact it is just a facsimile of of the old USSR period Pravada, though with better ad copy... so thanks for helping me to prove my point, you are such a pal....

Cheers

blutto

Wow I am happy your prayers were answered partnah. We had a guvnuh who tried prayer on the drought here in Tejas but sad to say it is still a no go on the rain. Maybe if he stops his campaigning and get back to work here in Tejas we can get a prayer circle going for some rain. One can only hope he will shut down the massive waste of money called his presidential campaign.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Not surprised at all. Regardless of which candidate gets elected, I expect this slide to continue. I see no policies by Obama or any Republican that will change this hardly at all. They will continue to represent the Immelt's, Koch's, etc. as a priority above all else.

Totally agree. What a mess it is.

 

[Anonymous]

...I'm guessing the implication is that AP is at some level a reliably neutral disseminator of news....in point of fact it is just a facsimile of of the old USSR period Pravada, though with better ad copy... so thanks for helping me to prove my point, you are such a pal....

Cheers

blutto

Wrong again. AP leans left which leads me to believe this may be the new target.

I'm so very glad we are friends.

 

[rhubroma]

6.61% now. There's an interesting take on why in the Telegraph

The Italian gov. says they're still ok till 8% and Berlusconi is hanging on.

I'll let you know tomorow, though, if he is still in power. But, of course, you'll find out for youself. The guy at the supermercato thinks he's doomed.