World Politics

[Alpe d'Huez]

Problem is most people like their own representative(s) and think it's all the other ones' fault and we end up with a 90% or whatever it is re-election rate for incumbents.

Actually, those numbers are at record levels as well. Record low that is.

 

[auscyclefan94]

The Australian Labor Party never ceases to amaze me on their continual 'flip-flopping' on issues.

Julia Gillard bends on offshore processing of asylum seekers at Nauru

 

[python]

US admits mistakes over killings of Pakistani troops

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-16302197

...conceded there had been a lack of proper co-ordination with Pakistani forces.

to remind, the pak--istanis claim they were pounded for over 2 hours whilst their pleas were entirely ignored.

 

[Ferminal]

The Australian Labor Party never ceases to amaze me on their continual 'flip-flopping' on issues.

Julia Gillard bends on offshore processing of asylum seekers at Nauru

Reasonable move though, paints Dr. No into a bit of a corner.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Reasonable move though, paints Dr. No into a bit of a corner.

Maybe, though it is a bit hard not be Dr. No when the Government is so bad. I personally think it paints Labor as total hypocrites.

 

[Ferminal]

Maybe, though it is a bit hard not be Dr. No when the Government is so bad. I personally think it paints Labor as total hypocrites.

97% of the lot of them agree on something yet they still can't manage to work effectively as a parliament and legislate the change. Do we elect MPs to legislate or to troll one another?

 

[auscyclefan94]

97% of the lot of them agree on something yet they still can't manage to work effectively as a parliament and legislate the change. Do we elect MPs to legislate or to troll one another?

Wanting both just seems plain moronic. Should be one or the other which I would prefer Nauru out of the two options on the table. I also don't see why we are sending so muc assistance over to the Indonesian Government considering that their soldiers were behind some of this mess, it happened on their waters and I highly doubt they would do anything to actually help us if something like that happened.

 

[ChrisE]

This pretty much sums it up. Glad Obama is there to carry on, errrr I mean clean up this type of behavior. I wonder if Rakoff will get a Whitehouse Xmas card?

http://www.rollingstone.com/politic...ps-the-sec-over-citigroup-settlement-20111129

And, along with the incestuous little tribe that runs the SEC, the industry that runs the SEC has used their $ to get individuals like this elected to protect the countries citizens:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/mon...republicans-financial-reform-wall-street.html

You see boys and girls this is what is really going on, as I have said many times. The right (and the left lol) movers in these parties just manipulate the rubes with emotional issues that mean little to the bottom line like gun ownership, religion, etc. What really matters is mass deregulation that has been done over the last 30 years by both parties, putting the govt. in so much debt with tax cuts and military/industrial complex (wingnut orgasmic "drowning govt in the bathtub") it cannot fund these agences like the article states, and infestation of govt. agencies by industry cronies (also see Obamas cabinet).

The rubes impacted most by this BS keep voting for the perpetuators of this blatantly obvious (to some) game. Hey, at least nobody is taking their guns away and now gays can kiss on the dock. Idiots.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Excellent links there Chris. Very telling and true. You're dead right in your post, only that you left out the obvious, that the money has so infested the government, the only barrier left are a few judges like Rakoff, who are in a position that is very difficult to buy off.

I was on an airplane last week and sat next to a businessman who co-owned an IT firm. Not a huge firm, but he did a mix of work for private and government agencies. He noted that as far as he can tell, from all of his interaction with government players over the last decade plus, the entire system is completely corrupted with money. He said there were perhaps 1 or 2 politicians he had come across whose principles were not completely influenced and compromised by money and lobbying. Both parties, all levels of government. And the influence wasn't just the politician, it bled all the way through their staff, and their actions and behavior.

 

[redtreviso]

and When does Tom DeLay(R) report to Federal Prison? Do you suppose Phil and Wendy Gramm(R)are having a nice Christmas at their chalet in Switzerland?

Yea Chris it really is the same..

 

[Captain_Cavman]

How has the reaction in the media been to Ed Miliband's performance? He seemed to be at his strongest (and much stronger than his brother) when the session was held to discuss the EU summit. I'll also agree with him in that the vote against the motion wasn't a real veto either as the resolution will be adopted in most other countries and won't be blocked.

He's doing just fine. Look, here's a chart!

50% of respondents said he had none of the following qualities: In touch, Honest, Principled, Decisive, Strong, Charismatic, A Natural leader or Good in a crisis. 22% of Labour supporters felt the same way. However almost 50% of Labour voters thought he was 'In touch', which is nice.

 

[ChrisE]

Excellent links there Chris. Very telling and true. You're dead right in your post, only that you left out the obvious, that the money has so infested the government, the only barrier left are a few judges like Rakoff, who are in a position that is very difficult to buy off.

I was on an airplane last week and sat next to a businessman who co-owned an IT firm. Not a huge firm, but he did a mix of work for private and government agencies. He noted that as far as he can tell, from all of his interaction with government players over the last decade plus, the entire system is completely corrupted with money. He said there were perhaps 1 or 2 politicians he had come across whose principles were not completely influenced and compromised by money and lobbying. Both parties, all levels of government. And the influence wasn't just the politician, it bled all the way through their staff, and their actions and behavior.

Your conversation reminds me the article awhile back of that republican staffer that went rogue and quit the party, with his tell all article about the sole drive of that party: protecting the rich and monied interests, at the expense of society as a whole.

The only problem with this philosophy is that eventually it will crash; the rich make up such a little portion of the population that the buying power of the vast majority will not be able to function and sustain it. I would think eventually a sane backlash will emerge, unlike the bigotted makeup of the tea party blaming others for their plight instead of the politicians their bigotted azzes got duped into voting for. Or, the OWS who are occupying the wrong thing; wall street plays within the rules it is given, and those rules were given to them by both parties, and enforced by neither party. OWS should put forth their effort into electing or starting a 3rd party that corrects these problems instead of a "movement" easily ridiculed by the corporate media, showing people shytting in parks. The change of media ownership in this country is another thing that has contributed to this, but I really blame people for not seeing thru the BS on that issue. You and I can do it, why can't anybody else?

BTW, guess which president signed into law media deregulation? I bet red has selective memory loss on that one.

Until $ is removed from the political process none of this will change. The supreme court just ruled corps are "people" I believe. The infestation of the court system is another thing I forgot to mention that has helped create the result we are now seeing. You allude that there are thankfully still some that are independent enough to object.

This took a long time coming, and it will not easily be undone because the types of things we are discussing here are lost on the ignorant (willfully, IMO) masses. These issues are like Calculus 3 to the redneck down the street, or the party blind left wing whackjobs like red.

When stupid people believe the mortgage issue is caused by the govt making these companies give loans to minorities (Limbaugh talk), then there is a problem. When people like red are so quick to blame Delay, etc. (yes, they are to blame, but not completely), while ignoring the people that helped perpetrate this whole mess that are on this president's economic staff, then we have a problem. It is much easier to hate and be a useful idiot than stepping back and analyzing/understanding the situation and the causes behind it.

Wash, rinse, repeat when people like this have a vote that can cancel out a vote of a sane person. There are alot more of these people than there are sane people, and even when these idiots are getting kicked in the gutter they are still slow to understand the reason. Like I say, eventually I think change may come but we are dealing with very large quantities of dumbazzes in this country. Remember the old saying: "Beware of idiots in large volumes". This will take time, unless "we" elect some religious nut to cause WWIII in the name of their cloud buddy. Then, it won't matter.

 

[ChrisE]

and When does Tom DeLay(R) report to Federal Prison? Do you suppose Phil and Wendy Gramm(R)are having a nice Christmas at their chalet in Switzerland?

Yea Chris it really is the same..

It is OK red we all make mistakes. You got duped into voting for a trojan horse. Hopefully you can get some help, and you can eventually scrape that Obama sticker off your car. It makes you look stupid.

 

[redtreviso]

It is OK red we all make mistakes. You got duped into voting for a trojan horse. Hopefully you can get some help, and you can eventually scrape that Obama sticker off your car. It makes you look stupid.

Well McCain would have died in office already and where would we be? Where's your demand of remorse for this? You are just a go along get along I bet.

 

[blutto]

It is OK red we all make mistakes. You got duped into voting for a trojan horse. Hopefully you can get some help, and you can eventually scrape that Obama sticker off your car. It makes you look stupid.

...sorry to be a grinch here but the smugness doesn't become you...that bandwidth could have dedicated to promoting world peace or something...what a tragic shame of epic proportions...

...and by the way, best of the season to you and and all yours and all here...and may your curmudgeonly ways flourish and flower in the new year...

Cheers

blutto

 

[ChrisE]

Well McCain would have died in office already and where would we be? Where's your demand of remorse for this? You are just a go along get along I bet.

We would be in a bind of course, but how much worse than now? No real wall street reform, like we have now? Check. Cronies in govt? Check. Continuation of the military/industrial complex? Check. Continuation and expansion of Bush interrogation and "justice" techniques? Check. Israel running our foreign policy? Check.

So, what the fark do we have that is different? Some BS watered down health reform? Whatever. Gays kissing on a dock? Yippee.

The problem I have with Obama is that he talks a good game like he is all for fixing the problems, then when you peal away the BS you basically get wingnut light without the whacky outer shell.

I see you are trying out the "vote for the least worse" candidate card on me. That would normally work and it is the philosophy I used for most of the years I have voted, but Obama's blatant lies and squandering the unique chance he had in 2009 to correct this mess has cured me of that affliction.

The house must be burned down before it can be fixed. You criticize me for deciding not to vote for the near future, but it is basically all the same. You are wasting your time, I decide not to waste my time, but the result is all the same.

The movers in your party don't give a rats azz about your outrage, red, because you are a dependable tool that will obediently go vote for them. Why should they do what you want when you don't hold them accountable? You keep pretending different if it makes you feel better.

 

[ChrisE]

...sorry to be a grinch here but the smugness doesn't become you...that bandwidth could have dedicated to promoting world peace or something...what a tragic shame of epic proportions...

...and by the way, best of the season to you and and all yours and all here...and may your curmudgeonly ways flourish and flower in the new year...

Cheers

blutto

Sorry to disappoint you blutto, but you mistake my opinions on these subjects with my demeanor in general. If pointing out how people are being used and manipulated in the US political process makes me something less than you thought of me, then that is unfortunate.

You have a merry Xmas as well. I just finished my last bit of shopping......I really hate this time of year.

 

[BroDeal]

We would be in a bind of course, but how much worse than now? No real wall street reform, like we have now? Check. Cronies in govt? Check. Continuation of the military/industrial complex? Check. Continuation and expansion of Bush interrogation and "justice" techniques? Check. Israel running our foreign policy? Check.

So, what the fark do we have that is different? Some BS watered down health reform? Whatever. Gays kissing on a dock? Yippee.

The problem I have with Obama is that he talks a good game like he is all for fixing the problems, then when you peal away the BS you basically get wingnut light without the whacky outer shell.

A lot of truth here.

 

[blutto]

Sorry to disappoint you blutto, but you mistake my opinions on these subjects with my demeanor in general. If pointing out how people are being used and manipulated in the US political process makes me something less than you thought of me, then that is unfortunate.

You have a merry Xmas as well. I just finished my last bit of shopping......I really hate this time of year.

...no worries or disappointments, I was trying to fun you a bit and ended up being silly...my oooops...that being said, I do agree with you on almost all your points here...

btw...loved your line about the petty war on nuance....you are in good form these days ....Xmas must really pi$$ you off...

Cheers

blutto

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I see you are trying out the "vote for the least worse" candidate card on me. That would normally work and it is the philosophy I used for most of the years I have voted, but Obama's blatant lies and squandering the unique chance he had in 2009 to correct this mess has cured me of that affliction.

This.

All the talk of hope and change, and what we really got was a candidate who slipped right into the existing system. Was he better than McCain would have been? Maybe a little bit, maybe not. But did he take any real steps to repair the horrific disaster the political system has become? Next to none that I have seen.

 

[Amsterhammer]

This.

All the talk of hope and change, and what we really got was a candidate who slipped right into the existing system. Was he better than McCain would have been? Maybe a little bit, maybe not. But did he take any real steps to repair the horrific disaster the political system has become? Next to none that I have seen.

It's a painful conclusion to come to, but I cannot help agreeing with this.

The house must be burned down before it can be fixed.

And with this.

Bah humbug, one and all.

 

[blutto]

....here a skill testing question...how does Germany build twice as many cars as America and pay its workers twice as much ?...

..some good background here...

http://www.remappingdebate.org/article/tale-two-systems

Cheers

blutto

 

[Hugh Januss]

....here a skill testing question...how does Germany build twice as many cars as America and pay its workers twice as much ?...

..some good background here...

http://www.remappingdebate.org/article/tale-two-systems

Cheers

blutto

Does it have anything to do with the fact that American business culture believes that the smartest person should make all the money, and that CEOs are clearly the smartest people in any company?

 

[Cobblestoned]

....here a skill testing question...how does Germany build twice as many cars as America and pay its workers twice as much ?...

..some good background here...

http://www.remappingdebate.org/article/tale-two-systems

Cheers

blutto

48.97 Euros per hour is just a BIG joke. Even when you include a 13th, night shifts and weekend work.
Take 50% of it, and you'll be close to fine. So we are even I guess.

Or were they only watching at high level engineers ?
But I think even those would be happy with around 50 €/h.

 

[redtreviso]

48.97 Euros per hour is just a BIG joke. Even when you include a 13th, night shifts and weekend work.
Take 50% of it, and you'll be close to fine. So we are even I guess.

Or were they only watching at high level engineers ?
But I think even those would be happy with around 50 €/h.

Those plus benefits hourly wages are always a LIE.. No one else gets their compensation presented like that.. Here they always say UAW workers make 70 dollars an hour including benefits..Those benefit programs are most often unfunded,,, so it is just an arbitrary number to throw out there to say they make 70 dollars an hour. Same with Germany.. This is about as distasteful as saying "oh your wife had cancer last year so you made 250 dollars an hour, we don't really want to talk about giving you a raise."