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Mar 11, 2009
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Medvedev remains quite popular in Russia from what I can tell. People either really like him, or think he's acceptable. Below is a list of his approval rating.

I wouldn't be surprised though if people in Russia are growing tired of Putin and think he's outlasting his welcome. This is Medvedev's third year in office, and I would think at some point here he could push forward and assert his leadership more.

As many negatives either could have, as others have noted, compared to the Yeltsin years, or the painful Gorby transitions...

Medvedev_Approval_Rating.PNG
 
Jul 4, 2011
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Just did a bit of scouring after seeing those ratings and I found this from the Levada center, an independent polling NGO.

sld002.gif


The rating of the Duma is the lowest and it seems to be reflected in the voting.

The Duma voting trends in August 2011
sld007.gif


Putin's rating seems comfortable at 60+% as well, just the Duma seemed to be ailing. Personally, I still want to see Medvedev run for a second term.

Turnout was pretty decent around 60%, it was 63% in 2007.
49.7% for URP in the latest figures. Communists 19%.
 
Jul 4, 2011
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Just did a bit of scouring after seeing those ratings and I found this from the Levada center, an independent polling NGO.

sld002.gif


The rating of the Duma is the lowest and it seems to be reflected in the voting.

The Duma voting trends in August 2011
sld007.gif


Putin's rating seems comfortable at 60+% as well, just the Duma seemed to be ailing. Personally, I still want to see Medvedev run for a second term.

Turnout was pretty decent around 60%, it was 63% in 2007.
49.7% for URP in the latest figures. Communists 19%.
 
Sep 25, 2009
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ramjambunath said:
Just did a bit of scouring after seeing those ratings....
it's all good and nice but... :)

in order to give a fair assessment of socio-political events like elections in a country - any country - one needs to look into the country’s history of governance and, in the particular case of russia, also into its geography and demography… don’t mean to say it’s unique to russia.

in terms of stages it evolved through, russia’s general history of governance is not much different from the rest of the world. the exception perhaps is only in the harshness and severity of its authoritarian past.

what most don’t appreciate (i dont mean you, ramjambunath) or know is how vast, diverse (even after it broke up) and yet ridiculously skewed the country and it’s population are.

here are some bare facts that should help with the assessment…

- while most europeans or americans live in 1,2,3 time zones, the russians live in 11 (!)
- most of the country is simply uninhabited (80% of it’s most productive and educated population is concentrated on 20% territory.
- 5 to 7 million live in the vast and empty far east as opposed to 200+ million chinese living on the other side of the same border.
- the country’s borders are so vast that they are insecure by definition…it’s surrounded by natural historical enemies.
-there lives rich, vibrant and endogenous muslim population in the very heart of european russia.
- with the exception of it’s muslims, the country’s population is essentially dying off
- despite always being the richest country in terms of mineral resources, its standard of living somehow always lagged behind the european.
- unlike in europe, the country’s powerful christian orthodox church has NEVER been independent of state.

…….

why do I dwell on this ?

because, even after allowing for the natural one-party tendencies of all ‘new democracies’, russia’s case is special - in order not to disintegrate or simply survive as a sovereign entity it MUST have a strong central government. thus russia will never be a democracy in the sense we use in the west.

as they say, election shlemelection…:)
 
In a recent interview from Berlin, Mikhail Gorbaciov said that Russia is terribly deficient in democracy, that Putin's popularity is still high and that there is a problem with its business oligarchy in terms of corruption.

I think what you mentioned, in regards to each of these accusations, accounts well for the historical causes that are at their root foundations. The Russians that we know today, were essentially forged in the crucible of orthodox hierarchy and socialist despotism: how then, is it possible for them not to live under a regime with its "czar"?

Ironically, though perhaps to be entirely expected, then, Russia is going through the same problems, today, with capitalism as it did under communism: the hierarchical nature of its "Byzantine" political order, the concentration of power into one faction with its irreducible leader firmly seated upon the throne and the corruption of its oligarchy. This means you can change brands, but the contents of the packaging substantially remains the same.

At a certain point, though, cracks begin to appear in the facade. Perhaps we are witnessing this in the decline of United Russia at the voter booths.
 
Jul 4, 2011
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python said:
it's all good and nice but... :)

in order to give a fair assessment of socio-political events like elections in a country - any country - one needs to look into the country’s history of governance and, in the particular case of russia, also into its geography and demography… don’t mean to say it’s unique to russia....
....because, even after allowing for the natural one-party tendencies of all ‘new democracies’, russia’s case is special - in order not to disintegrate or simply survive as a sovereign entity it MUST have a strong central government. thus russia will never be a democracy in the sense we use in the west.

as they say, election shlemelection…:)

Those statistics were just an opinion poll in August by a Russian NGO. I don't think it has much to do with the future of democracy/other type of government that Russia may have in the future.

There's no denying Russia's vastness geographically and more importantly demographically and it would be crazy to expect Sakhalin region and the Moscow region to be similar culturally. I can definitely appreciate this much as I've been in the east, south and west of India.

It's sadly true that natural resources have not been a gauge for development in recent history but just a measure of potential. It hasn't really materialised to development in many parts of the world (pretty much all of the Eastern hemisphere and the southern part of the Western Hemisphere as well).

As for Russian govt needing to be a not very strong democracy because of its ethnic diversity isn't an absolute in my opinion. India had existed as a nation only 3 or 4 times in its history. In all other periods of history it was a collection of Kingdoms. While geographically nowhere near as vast as Russia, the indigenous population here is as diverse as any country (China and Russia being the only other regions with as naturally diverse a population). At the moment though, it has a fully functioning democracy. It may take time and it may never be a democracy along the western lines but there's a reason to believe it can happen. But, there's a big 'but' here, the coercing of electoral institutions is not going to help in the development of any type of democracy.
 
ramjambunath said:
Those statistics were just an opinion poll in August by a Russian NGO. I don't think it has much to do with the future of democracy/other type of government that Russia may have in the future.

There's no denying Russia's vastness geographically and more importantly demographically and it would be crazy to expect Sakhalin region and the Moscow region to be similar culturally. I can definitely appreciate this much as I've been in the east, south and west of India.

It's sadly true that natural resources have not been a gauge for development in recent history but just a measure of potential. It hasn't really materialised to development in many parts of the world (pretty much all of the Eastern hemisphere and the southern part of the Western Hemisphere as well).

As for Russian govt needing to be a not very strong democracy because of its ethnic diversity isn't an absolute in my opinion. India had existed as a nation only 3 or 4 times in its history. In all other periods of history it was a collection of Kingdoms. While geographically nowhere near as vast as Russia, the indigenous population here is as diverse as any country (China and Russia being the only other regions with as naturally diverse a population). At the moment though, it has a fully functioning democracy. It may take time and it may never be a democracy along the western lines but there's a reason to believe it can happen. But, there's a big 'but' here, the coercing of electoral institutions is not going to help in the development of any type of democracy.

I don't think, however, you take into consideration the Western colonial forces that have brought those various kingdoms together as a means to reinforce a hegemonic imprint of democracy within the Indian political institutions, visa-a-vise the former's culture of so called enlightenment and so called reason at the level of the state. Whereas using democracy, self-determination and human rights as ideological weapons, finally overthrew British rule and led to independence, creating thus the political foundations and cultural substructure for a democracy. But even this wasn't without its problems, however, as with the creation of Pak!stan, or the effective persistence of the caste system despite the new legal code and judicial structure.

None of these powerful forces apply, though, to Russia; which, both geographically and demographically, has one foot in Europe and the other in Asia. Well it’s the European one which has given Moscow its heritage of an orthodox hierarchy and model for absolutist rule, without those principles of enlightenment and reason, however, upon which the Western democratic model was forged; which, as with former Prussia and Constantinople, finds natural the idea of a Caesar-Kaiser-Czar at the helm. Such does it seem to be the case in the Russian state's DNA, in a manner of speaking, for which I agree with those who claim that democracy as we know it in the West, which not incidentally was developed first in the places both freed of orthodoxy and absolutism (and in turn is less developed in places where such insitutions still exist - for instance in the power of the confessional Vatican State within Itlay's secular democracy), won't come to pass any time soon, if ever. The way Bolshevik communism developed in the former USSR also attests to this.

There are, however, a number of noted Russian intellectuals who have taken a timid stand against the concentration of power and corruption that reigns over Russia today. It does not seem, though, that such criticism will result in any paradigmatic change in the psychology and form of the Russian state anytime in the near future.

http://shlapentokh.wordpress.com/20...russians-in-contempt-not-ready-for-democracy/
 
Jun 22, 2009
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Meanwhile, western Europe has very different issues to deal with this week than Russia. Everything I have read is thoroughly depressing. Exhibit one below. Apologies for the slightly long-ish quote, but I thought it was worth it.

Welcome to the living dead economy

A eurozone that somehow stays afloat but can't be reformed, banks awash with cash that don't lend, and incoherent economic policy. We've only found a sticking-plaster solution to our crisis

The longer the economic crisis goes on, the less credible sticking plaster solutions become. Four years in, Europe is heading into a nasty recession, China is flirting with a hard landing, the governor of the Bank of England is warning of a systemic banking crisis and George Osborne has announced spending cuts that will continue for the next six years. The United States is the one part of the world where the news has been better recently, with signs of life returning to the housing market and a welcome fall in unemployment.

What's happening in America – where the Federal Reserve has used two rounds of quantitative easing (QE) to boost the money supply and announced its intention to keep interest rates low – has encouraged the belief that recovery will eventually come, provided the policy response is big enough for long enough.

It remains to be seen whether this is indeed the case, since there have been false dawns galore since the financial system froze in 2007. The real strength of the US economy will be revealed early next year, when tax breaks supporting consumption and investment are removed and when the world's biggest economy starts to feel the impact of the slowdown on this side of the Atlantic.
Deadly limbo

An alternative way of looking at the crisis goes like this. We now inhabit a world of the living dead: a eurozone that will not collapse but cannot be reformed; banks that are kept alive by gigantic quantities of electronically generated cash but do not lend; homeowners who are sitting in homes worth more than they paid for them but are able to stay put because interest rates are so low and lenders have no desire to crystallise losses, and policy that is neither one thing nor the other.

There is a story, almost certainly apocryphal, that John Maynard Keynes and Friedrich Hayek used to discuss the state of the world while sharing on air raid warden duties on the roof of King's College Chapel in Cambridge during the second world war. Were they alive today, the great economists would – from their different perspectives – no doubt have harsh things to say about the way the global economy is currently being managed.

Hayek would say that the zombie-like state of affairs has been due to the refusal to allow banks that lent irresponsibly to go bust. His analysis of the crisis would be that too much easy money led to too much unproductive investment. While not cavilling at the suggestion that spending should be maintained during a slump, Hayek would argue that the aim of policymakers should be to return to a situation where production was sustainable and profitable. If that meant letting banks go under, then so be it. If nature's cure took time, then so be it.

Since the crisis began, policymakers in the west have prided themselves on avoiding the mistakes made by Japan in the 1990s. Hayek would say that western leaders have repeated the big policy error made by the Japanese – allowing over-leveraged banks crippled by non-performing loans to stay in business – with the same baleful results.

The US did allow one bank to go bust, when it failed to save Lehman Brothers in September 2008. Market mayhem ensued, amid fears that other banks would go under as well, and there was a complete change of approach. Banks were recapitalised courtesy of the taxpayer and provided with unlimited quantities of cheap money to keep them afloat. Hayek would say that this was merely a sticking-plaster solution, albeit the biggest and most expensive piece of sticking plaster the world has ever seen, and would point out that last week – more than three years after the Lehman bankruptcy – the only thing that had changed was that the centre of the problem was no longer the US but Europe.

Italian banks are even more dependent on their financial lifeline now than they were in 2008; last week's co-ordinated action by six of the world's leading central banks was prompted by evidence that Wall Street was no longer prepared to lend money to European banks. Sooner or later, Hayek and his followers would say, there has to be a purging of the system to remove the rottenness, and what has happened over the past few years is merely deferring the inevitable. Interestingly, it is not only free-market economists that believe in the power of creative destruction. The term, although it came to be associated with Joseph Schumpeter, originally came from Marxist economic theory, which held that each phase of development emerged out of the wreckage of a system that no longer worked. Socialism would follow capitalism, just as capitalism followed feudalism. The Marxists believe the attempts to muddle through are doomed to failure.
Creative destruction

There is, of course, not the slightest possibility that policymakers will opt for the creative destruction approach, at least not willingly. Nor, though, is there any great appetite for adopting a pure – as opposed to pseudo – Keynesian approach. If he were alive today, Keynes would caution against a Hayekian catharsis, but would also be critical of blanket austerity at a time when demand is weak and confidence low.

Keynes would have approved of the action to slash official interest rates. He would have approved, also, of the attempt to manipulate market interest rates lower using QE. But he would be alarmed at the weakness of private-sector investment, particularly given the large amount of cash sitting idle in company bank accounts. Keynes would conclude that the "animal spirits" of commerce are currently low, and so it is up to governments to prime the pump through higher public spending.

In the early stages of the crisis, that is what happened. Monetary policy and fiscal policy were supportive and – Keynes would say – the result was the tentative recovery seen in the second half of 2009 and early 2010. Then, however, the financial markets started to look askance at the size of government budget deficits and spooked finance ministries into taking over-hasty remedial action. The result has been that public demand has been sucked out of western economies at a time when private demand is weak. The result has been a slide back towards recession. Keynes would say that instead of worrying about deficits, governments should be worried about unemployment: get growth going again, and the deficit will look after itself.

Policymakers' riposte to Keynes would be the same as it would be to Hayek: get real. If we take no action to rein in deficits, we will be slaughtered by the markets; bond yields will go up sharply, negating the impact of cheap money. Keynesian fiscal policy, in other words, will only be possible when the markets share Keynes's belief that jobs matter more than the level of national debt, and given the way economics has been taught in universities for the past 30 years, that moment may be a long time coming.

As things stand, economic policy lacks intellectual coherence, monetary policy is governed by a belief in the need for unrestricted credit, and fiscal policy by a belief in "expansionary contraction". It is a mishmash based on one big assumption; given time, the grown-ups can fix things. There are three possible responses to this: they can fix it given time; they can fix it if they use a different toolkit; they can't fix it at all because the system is bust. You decide.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/economics-blog/2011/dec/04/global-economy-eurozone-debt-crisis
 
Jun 22, 2009
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Exhibit two.

Austerity bites in Italy – and leaves minister in tears


Elsa Fornero weeps as she tries to explain sacrifices required of Italians after cabinet passes budget with austerity measures of €30bn


Italy's "technocratic" government unveiled a package of painful austerity measures on Sunday night – so painful, indeed, that one of the ministers began to weep as she explained them to the press.

Announcing that all but the lowest pensions would be frozen next year, the welfare minister, Elsa Fornero, said: "We – and this really cost us dear, psychologically even – we've had to ask for sac…" But she was unable to say the word "sacrifices" and, brushing tears from her eyes, brought her presentation to an abrupt close.

The emergency budget, containing tax rises and spending cuts totalling €30bn (£26bn), is the latest of several passed this year aimed at restoring the credibility of the eurozone's biggest debtor nation. The government, headed by a former European commissioner, Mario Monti, is hoping to rush the measures through parliament before the next EU summit begins on Thursday.

But there were signs that what Monti called a "Save Italy decree" could face stiff resistance. Pierluigi Bersani, the leader of the centre-left Democratic party, said it "does not at all match our criteria for fairness".

The package approved by the cabinet in emergency session on Sunday did not contain a one-off wealth tax or even, as widely leaked, an increase in income tax for high earners. But it did restore a property tax on first homes and push back retirement ages for men and women – both measures that will hit the less well-off.

In addition, the pension freeze will cut the real incomes of all but the worst-off pensioners in 2012. The deputy finance minister, Vittorio Grilli, said the government now expects the economy to shrink next year by 0.4-0.5% and remain flat in 2013.

Monti earlier briefed trade unionists and employers' representatives. One quoted Monti as having said the choice was between sacrifices on the one hand and an "insolvent state" and a "euro destroyed by Italian infamy" on the other.

His package, however, came under fire from the right as well as the left. Two leading free-market economists, Alberto Alesina, a Harvard professor, and Francesco Giavazzi, who teaches at the Bocconi university in Milan, wrote in the daily Corriere della Sera that the government was less likely to plunge Italy into recession if it cut spending. Yet its budget appeared to be "three-quarters composed of higher taxes", they said.

• This article was amended on 5/12/11. The original referred to austerity measures of €24bn. This has been corrected

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/dec/04/austerity-italy-minister-tears
 
Jul 4, 2011
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rhubroma said:
I don't think, however, you take into consideration the Western colonial forces that have brought those various kingdoms together as a means to reinforce a hegemonic imprint of democracy within the Indian political institutions, visa-a-vise the former's culture of so called enlightenment and so called reason at the level of the state....

....There are, however, a number of noted Russian intellectuals who have taken a timid stand against the concentration of power and corruption that reigns over Russia today. It does not seem, though, that such criticism will result in any paradigmatic change in the psychology and form of the Russian state anytime in the near future.

http://shlapentokh.wordpress.com/20...russians-in-contempt-not-ready-for-democracy/

True, the extent of Russia is huge and the differences between various sections of the population is clear. A Dagestani is a light year apart to a Moscowite who in turn is light year apart from a Siberian. It's not too different here and the north east of India, beyond Assam, has always been a bit cut off from the rest of the country. Something that exists even today.

I'll avoid discussig Pakistan as they've unfortunately not had a strong democracy for long periods.

It is true that the British empire helped in sowing the seeds of democracy in India and Pakistan, especially in the setting up of a judiciary (some of the laws which we still follow today) but it's been seen how difficult it was to nurture democracy and the major safeguard/watchdog for democracy in India, the Election commission, was established only post independence. With free and fair elections, the Congress which had led the freedom struggle had an understandable monopoly over the Parliament in the first few years. This was the case upto 1977, more than 25 years as a republic and 25 years as an independent democracy. Even post '75 it was the Emergency, which restricted the freedom of speech and other fundamental rights, which caused the downfall for the first time of a Congress govt. It took 25 years for a country with a functioning democracy with a history of elections since the Montague Chelmsford reforms in 1919.

The challenges for Russia are of a larger magnitude because of the lack of, as you point out, a systematic judiciary and the hegemonic way in which some of the powers that be have misused their influence, in the constitutional regard and not just criminal viewpoint, and it will take a much larger time frame if a proper democracy is to be set up. When India became independent, there were similar doubts of the country being too large, not educated enough, too poor and too diverse to be a proper democracy, those doubts have been quelled effectively over the course of 50+ years. It will be difficult but if democracy's functioning in India today from the humble beginnings of the first years post independence then there are reasons to believe that Russia could do so as well. It may take many years to stop the quashing of opposition but it requires one strong election for an opposition party to significantly improve prospects of a proper democracy minus some of the thuggery/censorship and the opposition, both the Communist party and the lib dems, have had a stronger election than in the recent past.
 
Jul 3, 2009
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Amsterhammer said:
"
As things stand, economic policy lacks intellectual coherence, monetary policy is governed by a belief in the need for unrestricted credit, and fiscal policy by a belief in "expansionary contraction". It is a mishmash based on one big assumption; given time, the grown-ups can fix things. There are three possible responses to this: they can fix it given time; they can fix it if they use a different toolkit; they can't fix it at all because the system is bust. You decide.
"

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/economics-blog/2011/dec/04/global-economy-eurozone-debt-crisis

I would struggle to even call it economic policy.

The Eurozone is a failure if the fiscal imbalances continue. You cannot expect a multi-state economy to work with such wide differences between the fiscally sound and fiscally rotten states. If they truly want this to survive, there would be redistribution from the "rich" states to the "poor". Such a position though is politically unfathomable.

Of course there have always been efforts for fiscal cohesion haven't there, since the establishment of the Eurozone, certain budgetary targets which had to be met. It sounds good in theory, but when there are nations in a depressive state, can you really expect them to be compliant?

I think everyone individually should be looking at the best way to exit this group, and whether or not it is a beneficial option over this nonsense we have had over the last 18 months which looks set to continue.
 
Amsterhammer said:
Exhibit two.

Austerity bites in Italy – and leaves minister in tears


Elsa Fornero weeps as she tries to explain sacrifices required of Italians after cabinet passes budget with austerity measures of €30bn




http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/dec/04/austerity-italy-minister-tears

The reason why Monti's government can't place upon Italy's rich more of a fiscal responsibility, is the same reason why it can't effect a patrimonial tax, or address the judicial and state television issues that need to be reformed: namely, because Berlusconi's former majority coalition will shoot down any such efforts in parliament.

That's why. In the end, and this will be politically desastrous for Monti, all the usual suspects are the ones who will be hit the hardest and be the ones made to bear the greatest sacrifices. His government is merely a more serious and presentable one than what came before it, though I'm affraid that substantially, once again, society and the left gets defeated.
 
ramjambunath said:
True, the extent of Russia is huge and the differences between various sections of the population is clear. A Dagestani is a light year apart to a Moscowite who in turn is light year apart from a Siberian. It's not too different here and the north east of India, beyond Assam, has always been a bit cut off from the rest of the country. Something that exists even today.

I'll avoid discussig Pakistan as they've unfortunately not had a strong democracy for long periods.

It is true that the British empire helped in sowing the seeds of democracy in India and Pakistan, especially in the setting up of a judiciary (some of the laws which we still follow today) but it's been seen how difficult it was to nurture democracy and the major safeguard/watchdog for democracy in India, the Election commission, was established only post independence. With free and fair elections, the Congress which had led the freedom struggle had an understandable monopoly over the Parliament in the first few years. This was the case upto 1977, more than 25 years as a republic and 25 years as an independent democracy. Even post '75 it was the Emergency, which restricted the freedom of speech and other fundamental rights, which caused the downfall for the first time of a Congress govt. It took 25 years for a country with a functioning democracy with a history of elections since the Montague Chelmsford reforms in 1919.

The challenges for Russia are of a larger magnitude because of the lack of, as you point out, a systematic judiciary and the hegemonic way in which some of the powers that be have misused their influence, in the constitutional regard and not just criminal viewpoint, and it will take a much larger time frame if a proper democracy is to be set up. When India became independent, there were similar doubts of the country being too large, not educated enough, too poor and too diverse to be a proper democracy, those doubts have been quelled effectively over the course of 50+ years. It will be difficult but if democracy's functioning in India today from the humble beginnings of the first years post independence then there are reasons to believe that Russia could do so as well. It may take many years to stop the quashing of opposition but it requires one strong election for an opposition party to significantly improve prospects of a proper democracy minus some of the thuggery/censorship and the opposition, both the Communist party and the lib dems, have had a stronger election than in the recent past.

While I hadn't considered the arduous road to a "functioning democracy" in your country of India, which bears being pointed out as you have done, I'm nonetheless, given the history of Russia, not optimistic that the Great Bear will arrive at the same conclusions and solutions.

For one thing Russia is too proud to admit "inferiority" in this sense before the West and, consequently, doesn't perceive a need for such radical reforms. In fact another thing that Gorbiacov mentioned in that Berlin interview was that in no way should Europe as an interlocutor present itself as intrinsically superior or in a haughty manner. Evidently Russian pride is a touchy matter.
 
Jul 4, 2011
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rhubroma said:
While I hadn't considered the arduous road to a "functioning democracy" in your country of India, which bears being pointed out as you have done, I'm nonetheless, given the history of Russian, not optimistic that the Great Bear will arrive at the same conclusions and solutions.

For one thing Russia is too proud to admit "inferiority" in this sense before the West and, consequently, doesn't perceive a need for such radical reforms. In fact another thing that Gorbiacov mentioned in that Berlin interview was that in no way should Europe as an interlocutor present itself as intrinsically superior or in a haughty manner. Evidently Russian pride is a touchy matter.

I agree with the factual points that you state. I think we are just interpreting them in a different manner.

Russian pride is a massive issue politically and was definitely one of the major sticking points when Russia-US relations collapsed in the mid decade last year. As for Gorbachev's comments, those fears aren't completely unfounded especially if Chechenya was brought on the table, considering the failure of Norway as an interlocutor in Sri Lanka and their propensity to see a terrorist entity as a political entity. On economic issues though, it will all boil right back down to Russian pride and the financial rules imposed in Europe is not likely to work in Russia because of the extreme levels of corruption there.

rhubroma said:
The reason why Monti's government can't place upon Italy's rich more of a fiscal responsibility, is the same reason why it can't effect a patrimonial tax, or address the judicial and state television issues that need to be reformed: namely, because Berlusconi's former majority coalition will shoot down any such efforts in parliament.

That's why. In the end, and this will be politically desastrous for Monti, all the usual suspects are the ones who will be hit the hardest and be the ones made to bear the greatest sacrifices. His government is merely a more serious and presentable one than what came before it, though I'm affraid that substantially, once again, society and the left gets defeated.

When do you expect elections and do you want Monti to head this government for the full term?
 
Jul 4, 2011
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rhubroma said:
While I hadn't considered the arduous road to a "functioning democracy" in your country of India, which bears being pointed out as you have done, I'm nonetheless, given the history of Russian, not optimistic that the Great Bear will arrive at the same conclusions and solutions.

For one thing Russia is too proud to admit "inferiority" in this sense before the West and, consequently, doesn't perceive a need for such radical reforms. In fact another thing that Gorbiacov mentioned in that Berlin interview was that in no way should Europe as an interlocutor present itself as intrinsically superior or in a haughty manner. Evidently Russian pride is a touchy matter.

I agree with the factual points that you state. I think we are just interpreting them in a different manner. Russian pride is a massive issue politically and was definitely one of the major sticking points when Russia-US relations collapsed in the middle of the past decade, not to mention the fallout in eastern Europe (although not completely unprovoked).

rhubroma said:
The reason why Monti's government can't place upon Italy's rich more of a fiscal responsibility, is the same reason why it can't effect a patrimonial tax, or address the judicial and state television issues that need to be reformed: namely, because Berlusconi's former majority coalition will shoot down any such efforts in parliament.

That's why. In the end, and this will be politically desastrous for Monti, all the usual suspects are the ones who will be hit the hardest and be the ones made to bear the greatest sacrifices. His government is merely a more serious and presentable one than what came before it, though I'm affraid that substantially, once again, society and the left gets defeated.

When do you expect elections and do you want Monti to head this government for the full term?
 
ramjambunath said:
...


When do you expect elections and do you want Monti to head this government for the full term?

I don't know. Monti certainly doesn't expect them before 2013, when his term is up. With, however, the perenial problem in Italian politics of keeping a functioning majority together and not becoming a lame duck, I don't know if his expectations will be met.

Certainly Bersani of his Partito Democratico can't be smiling right now, given that all of Berlusconi's criteria have essentially been met to get a vote of confidence. On the other hand, should Monti actually maintain his word and enforce a policy of equitable sacrifice distribution, with perhaps a patrimonial tax to boot, then he looses Berlusconi's placet and his government.

So I'd say it's 50/50 he makes it till the end.
 
Jul 4, 2011
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With the question of longevity/ survivability of the govt always hanging over his head, will he try to make brave decisions of possible restructure of economy? From the outside, his task seems extremely unenviable.
 
ramjambunath said:
With the question of longevity/ survivability of the govt always hanging over his head, will he try to make brave decisions of possible restructure of economy? From the outside, his task seems extremely unenviable.

Monti is a bourgeois, Catholic economic liberal of the old right-wing type in this country, who once worked for Lehman Brothers. He's the reincarnation of Democristiani who governed this country for 50 years after WWII with US approval. I think that makes him an improbable candidate for making brave decisions of the kind I approve, but as far as the market and finance goes, yes, he can make the "brave," though socially unpopular ones. In that case his problem becomes the left, rather than Berlusconi and the right.

Such as it is, though, in the EU today.
 
Jul 4, 2011
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So, basically he'll do a Greece all over again. All the social spending cuts is one thing but the mountain of debt Italy faces would need some sort of real restructuring of the economy/financial sector, which are two different entities which have become intertwined beyond healthy levels in my opinion.

As of today, what are the chances of the govt led by his party's re-election?
 
Jun 22, 2009
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El Pistolero said:
Belgium has a government.

Hurrah! Bravo! Applause! Whistles! Cheers!

I think the most significant lesson to be learned from this bizar episode is that civilzation as we know it did not cease to exist during this extended period without a working government.

A six party coalition - in Belgium? Doomed, I tell ya.:rolleyes:
 
Jun 22, 2009
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Best to avert your eyes if you can't stand the sight of the word 'Fox' anymore.


The Muppets Are Communist, Fox Business Network Says

r-PIGGY-KERMIT-large570.jpg


It ain't easy being green, but according to Fox Business, Kermit the Frog and his Muppet friends are reds.

Last week, on the network's "Follow the Money" program, host Eric Bolling went McCarthy on the new, Disney-released film, "The Muppets," insisting that its storyline featuring an evil oil baron made it the latest example of Hollywood's so-called liberal agenda.

Bolling, who took issue with the baron's name, Tex Richman, was joined by Dan Gainor of the conservative Media Research Center, who was uninhibited with his criticism.

"It's amazing how far the left will go just to manipulate your kids, to convince them, give the anti-corporate message," he said.

"They've been doing it for decades. Hollywood, the left, the media, they hate the oil industry," Gainor continued. "They hate corporate America. And so you'll see all these movies attacking it, whether it was 'Cars 2,' which was another kids' movie, the George Clooney movie 'Syriana,' 'There Will Be Blood,' all these movies attacking the oil industry, none of them reminding people what oil means for most people: fuel to light a hospital, heat your home, fuel an ambulance to get you to the hospital if you need that. And they don't want to tell that story."

Indeed, there was no mention of the benefits of oil drilling in the Muppets, but there was also no discussion of any other aspect of the industry. Richman, played by Chris Cooper, was out to destroy the Muppets theater. Kermit and his friends, then, were not committed environmentalists (though one must imagine the frog is concerned with his swampy homeland) but simply puppets looking to save a place they once loved.

Still, Gainor blamed the film, and its predecessors, for Occupy Wall Street and the environmental movement.

"This is what they're teaching our kids. You wonder why we've got a bunch of Occupy Wall Street people walking around all around the country, they've been indoctrinated, literally, for years by this kind of stuff," Gainor said. "Whether it was 'Captain Planet' or Nickelodeon's 'Big Green Help,' or 'The Day After Tomorrow,' the Al Gore-influenced movie, all of that is what they're teaching, is that corporations is bad, the oil industry is bad, and ultimately what they're telling kids is what they told you in the movie 'The Matrix': that mankind is a virus on poor old mother Earth."

The Teletubbies were unavailable for comment. Mahna-Mahna.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/...aign=daily_brief&ref=fb&src=sp&comm_ref=false
 
ramjambunath said:
So, basically he'll do a Greece all over again. All the social spending cuts is one thing but the mountain of debt Italy faces would need some sort of real restructuring of the economy/financial sector, which are two different entities which have become intertwined beyond healthy levels in my opinion.

As of today, what are the chances of the govt led by his party's re-election?

No it won't ever come to a possible referendum as in Greece. Monti would step down before that. He's been "hired" to get the job done. If he fails in reinstalling confidence regarding Italy at the financial markets, then his raison d'etre is over and hence his position as head of state.

Well, yes, the difference between austerity and growth are two different things. Convincing, however, Italians that job insecurity and workers flexibility are the same thing, when production and competitively are low, is not very convincing to anyone. But it isn't as if under the present regime, with production being outsourced, is there any hope for a solution. In fact Fiat is downsizing in the Boot. Also finance is also a hostile beast.

Italy is a classic case for which market liberalism has been lethal to a region that can't convert labor into services very easily. Nor does it have the wherewithal of a Germany to overcome this with innovative production methods and finance.

What are his chances for re-elction? It depends on how much being successful in makeing Europe and the markets happy, doesn't disenchant an already skeptical public. Of course if he doesn't satisfy A, then B will alsocondemn him. So, yes, Monti is in a most unenviable position.
 
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Bloomberg’s Girlfriend Was Paid $109,954 In 2009 By The Tax-Dodging Owners Of Zuccotti Park

It has now been almost three weeks since New York City mayor Michael Bloomberg suddenly sent in riot police to evict the Occupy Wall Street encampment of Zuccotti Park. Today, revelations emerged that the owners of Zuccotti Park, Brookfield Properties, owe the city over $139,000 — four times the starting salary of an officer in the New York Police Department — in back taxes.

MichaelMoore.com notes this in the context of a major conflict of interest. Michael Bloomberg’s girlfriend — Diana Taylor — currently serves on the Board of Directors of Brookfield Properties. The site found that Taylor was paid a whopping $109,954 in 2009, having attended meetings only nine days a year, by Brookfield:

(snip)

The fact that Bloomberg’s girlfriend netted a six-figure salary from a company that dodged a six-figure amount of taxes while it requested the city to crack down on protesters is discomforting, to say the least. """"

http://thinkprogress.org/special/2011/12/05/382403/bloombergs-girlfriend-zuccotti-park/
 
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