World Tour Wild Cards 2025

[Wyndbrook]

I never said anything about making teams smaller. Adding a 23rd team would add more riders to the race which I have no problem with. I was referring to other types of rules changes that have been discussed for safety like the new sprint rules they have actually implemented.

No more riders please, too many already. Could do with two teams less, not more.
Grand tours are the sporting pinnacle, stop handing out freeby wildcards and make it world tour only now.

 

[YavorD]

No more riders please, too many already. Could do with two teams less, not more.
Grand tours are the sporting pinnacle, stop handing out freeby wildcards and make it world tour only now.

Yeah, let's kill the PCT.
I find it refreshing when PCT teams are competitive and bring life to the race. Kern-Pharma immediately comes to mind (although their performance feels a bit more Pharma than Kern).

 

[pastronef]

if Tudor gets the Tour, I hope they won't get the Giro and Q36.5 gets the Giro

 

[tobydawq]

How even. Just decide mid season that teams can only go with 7? That's just ridiculous. Also bigger teams don't make it more unsafe, it was a bad reasoning anyways, more teams do tho, cause it's just means more dodgy sprint trains, more teams wanting to be at the front at all times, etc. Anyways my point remains the same, changin rules like this mid season is weird. You have a rulebook for a reason. I don't believe the UCI is going to go along with it unless they get payed off massively by a certain actor. 2 years ago they didn't even give Israel an invitation and they were threatening with a lawsuit. Also it's not new that GT organizers want more slots, of course they do.

Well, in 2021, they allowed 23 teams so it's not that unrealistic (nor that big a deal).

 

[ingsve]

No more riders please, too many already. Could do with two teams less, not more.
Grand tours are the sporting pinnacle, stop handing out freeby wildcards and make it world tour only now.

It's not too many. Currently there are 176 riders per GT. Back in the early 2000s there were Tours with 198 riders starting even. 8 more is not going to matter one bit.

 

[Pozzovivo]

Well, in 2021, they allowed 23 teams so it's not that unrealistic (nor that big a deal).

And that tour resulted in horror crashes in the first day's in bretagne! We are going back there this year. It is a big deal to admit yet another team. It will lead to more crashes.

 

[Pozzovivo]

It's not too many. Currently there are 176 riders per GT. Back in the early 2000s there were Tours with 198 riders starting even. 8 more is not going to matter one bit.

It is way too many. For dynamic reasons we need one TV-break team invited and let the rest be WT.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

And that tour resulted in horror crashes in the first day's in bretagne! We are going back there this year. It is a big deal to admit yet another team. It will lead to more crashes.

To be fair, the two leading reasons for all the crashes that Tour were Mrs. Opi-Omi and the most dangerous sprint finale in modern Tour history.

 

[tobydawq]

And that tour resulted in* horror crashes in the first day's in bretagne! We are going back there this year. It is a big deal to admit yet another team. It will lead to more crashes.

*coincided with

 

[Samamba]

Well, in 2021, they allowed 23 teams so it's not that unrealistic (nor that big a deal).

Fair enough, i forgot about that. Covid was given as an explanation but from what I read it was mainly ASO pushing for it. You're right then that it doesnt seem to be unrealistic. It not being a big deal is different tho. I read that a lot of teams found it a ridiculous decision cause of exactly the reason I'm giving. The UCI wanted to have less riders in races cause everyone (well the UCI, ASO, studies) agreed it was a big factor in crashes. Then out of nowhere they went back on it cause the ASO wanted more money. And while I don't agree with more riders = necessarily more dangerous I am pretty convinced that more teams = more dangerous. They do what they want but I will always find it a weird thing when you do it out of nowhere with no good reason other than o wait there's more good teams, we want all the stars at our GT.

 

[Pozzovivo]

Fair enough, i forgot about that. Covid was given as an explanation but from what I read it was mainly ASO pushing for it. You're right then that it doesnt seem to be unrealistic. It not being a big deal is different tho. I read that a lot of teams found it a ridiculous decision cause of exactly the reason I'm giving. The UCI wanted to have less riders in races cause everyone (well the UCI, ASO, studies) agreed it was a big factor in crashes. Then out of nowhere they went back on it cause the ASO wanted more money. And while I don't agree with more riders = necessarily more dangerous I am pretty convinced that more teams = more dangerous. They do what they want but I will always find it a weird thing when you do it out of nowhere with no good reason other than o wait there's more good teams, we want all the stars at our GT.

Human error is among the factors causing crashes. The more humans the more...

 

[Pozzovivo]

To be fair, the two leading reasons for all the crashes that Tour were Mrs. Opi-Omi and the most dangerous sprint finale in modern Tour history.

The. by far.most destructive crash of that tour was the one after Opi-Omi on stage 1. This was a classic big bunch fighting for position type of crash. Road was wide and fast.

 

[Pozzovivo]

*coincided with

Had* the worst crashes in recent Tour memory.

And, it was the invite team (B&B) that coincidentally had the rider bringing down 50? riders on day one.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

The. by far.most destructive crash of that tour was the one after Opi-Omi on stage 1. This was a classic big bunch fighting for position type of crash. Road was wide and fast.

The stage 3 finale claimed a lot more victims than the one at like 6k to go on stage 1. Having one like the latter somewhere in the three weeks is sadly par for the course at the Tour.

 

[RedheadDane]

It is way too many. For dynamic reasons we need one TV-break team invited and let the rest be WT.

Is it really that dynamic if it's always riders from the same team going into TV-breaks?

 

[Pozzovivo]

The stage 3 finale claimed a lot more victims than the one at like 6k to go on stage 1. Having one like the latter somewhere in the three weeks is sadly par for the course at the Tour.

Having more abandons as a direct consequence? Haig and who? Stage 1 had 3 Dnfs and that high speed crash was way worse as I see it, It involved maybe 40 guys and many were very seriously injured. Several DNF. Haig got very unlucky but the rest of the field more or less made it.

 

[Pozzovivo]

Is it really that dynamic if it's always riders from the same team going into TV-breaks?

No, it is not dynamic at all. I meant to move the stage along at a pace we need riders going in these breaks. There could be anyone, of course, but the invite teams should know this as their role. Waiting to use the entire team for sprints with Kristoff and Dujardin/Turgis or whoever is understandable but also not doing what ASO expect them to do.

 

[tobydawq]

Human error is among the factors causing crashes. The more humans the more...

Disallow humans in the races then.

 

[RedheadDane]

No, it is not dynamic at all. I meant to move the stage along at a pace we need riders going in these breaks. There could be anyone, of course, but the invite teams should know this as their role. Waiting to use the entire team for sprints with Kristoff and Dujardin/Turgis or whoever is understandable but also not doing what ASO expect them to do.

Are you saying that Wild Card Teams shouldn't be allowed to go for the win?

 

[Pozzovivo]

Are you saying that Wild Card Teams shouldn't be allowed to go for the win?

Nope.

"Waiting to use the entire team for sprints with Kristoff and Dujardin/Turgis or whoever is understandable but also not doing what ASO expect them to do."

 

[Pozzovivo]

Disallow humans in the races then.

That is a useless reductio ad absurdum.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

Having more abandons as a direct consequence? Haig and who? Stage 1 had 3 Dnfs and that high speed crash was way worse as I see it, It involved maybe 40 guys and many were very seriously injured. Several DNF. Haig got very unlucky but the rest of the field more or less made it.

Did you miss the huge crash in the actual sprint? Basically two-thirds of the sprint field abandoned either immediately or in the following stages because of injuries sustained on that day.

 

[ingsve]

Disallow humans in the races then.

Ya, make the whole Tour a competition on Zwift.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Let's just make the Tour a two rider race: Pogačar will ride the official route, while Morton will ride a different one. First rider to get to Paris wins. If anyone crashes they will be executed/forced to sign with TotalEnergies.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

No more riders please, too many already. Could do with two teams less, not more.
Grand tours are the sporting pinnacle, stop handing out freeby wildcards and make it world tour only now.

We basically already have that, they just want to make it a 20-22 team World Tour and kill off the only remaining flexibility the organisers have. They've already reduced the number of Wildcards from 4 to 2 because the organisers MUST invite 2 "mandatory wildcards" which is a complete oxymoron.

Plus of course it also gives those 'mandatory wildcard' teams a huge and easy headstart in regaining WT status or at least retaining mandatory wildcard status, making the gap between the haves and have nots even bigger than it already was.