You are incapable of fathoming the position "I'm not sure".
I advice you to think long and hard about it before you answer.
I advice you to think long and hard about it before you answer.
The Cycling News forum is looking to add some volunteer moderators with Red Rick's recent retirement. If you're interested in helping keep our discussions on track, send a direct message to
In the meanwhile, please use the Report option if you see a post that doesn't fit within the forum rules.
Thanks!
Less as in less riders are doping. Less as in less products. Less as in the effect that they are having?Dear Wiggo said:I say "less doping" is a joke / laughable.
And you look like you are disagreeing with me.
I mean. It is binary right? There is either less doping or there is not, right? Your post goes to great pains to say it could be true.
Are you saying you don't know if it's true or not? That there might be the same or more doping, or there might be less, but you don't know?
If so, I really do not understand the point of you even responding.
Franklin said:You are incapable of fathoming the position "I'm not sure".
I advice you to think long and hard about it before you answer.
Dear Wiggo said:Still waiting for you to quote the strawman I allegedly set up.
tick tock tick tock tick tock tick tock
I'm amused that you think people decided to stop doping in 2006. Oh wait. You didn't write that. You just wrote you think it may have happened. Or did you even do that.
Dear Wiggo said:Oh I am quite capable. I have watched Martin Vickers pretend to not like Wiggo for years now, saying "I am not sure if they dope", all the while insulting and ranting at anyone who suggests they do.
Your attack of my post and insulting, rhetorical posting is not balanced at all - it only supports the opposite view to the one I have.
This is a disingenuous example of "not sure".
Weak.
Franklin said:The argument was quite simple. It was "there are less tests now than ever. Fact." Your detour on how we did or didn't hold a position that cycling got clean is indeed a strawman as that's a position none of us has taken. Not by any stretch of the imagination.
Franklin said:So showing that a statement is nonsense is insulting you? The position that we need to look at facts is not balanced and it only supports the oppositeview you have?
Okay, good to know.
Franklin said:Again, if you knew we did not say that why bring it up other than to imply we hold that position? In other words a strawman.
I think you might have lost the plot here. The statement being discussed was the less tests than ever. Fact. You seem to have migrated to something else altogether.Dear Wiggo said:Wait. You just said it's not black and white, but now you're saying "less doping is a joke" is nonsense?
It's nonsense, but you're not sure.
Gee whizz, that sure sounds to me like you think it's nonsense.
You do know what nonsense means?
If I think (think, not know) that there is the same amount of doping as there always has been (ie the same % of riders doping) then it's my opinion.
And you think it's nonsense?
Gotcha.
ETA: The insult is the constant exaggeration / rhetoric in your posts ("screaming" nothing has changed) etc.
DirtyWorks said:http://veloclinic.tumblr.com/post/87026142603/catching-up-on-the-2014-giro-performance-analysis
This fits with what I've seen. But, I'm just an anonymous w@nker.
This is very encouraging as I thought the giant hole in the bio-passport (ex. Horner Vuelta) would become the norm.
DirtyWorks said:http://veloclinic.tumblr.com/post/87026142603/catching-up-on-the-2014-giro-performance-analysis
This fits with what I've seen. But, I'm just an anonymous w@nker.
This is very encouraging as I thought the giant hole in the bio-passport (ex. Horner Vuelta) would become the norm.
the sceptic said:The norm seems to be to juice up to the max human limit. And then there are some that go full mutant.
pmcg76 said:T
As I said before that is what interest's me. If a clean rider could win the biggest event totally clean in the 80s, how far could the same athlete go in the modern era. Impossible to answer but very interesting to analyse......without the hyperbole.
Dear Wiggo said:There are 3 possibilties:
1. incomplete data (works for both years)
2. less doping (bahahahahhahahahaa ahem)
3. anti-doping is now less effective than it was in 1998 (most likely imo)
Positive tests registered on dopeology.com:
1998: 30 matches for your search
2013: 18 matches for your search
That's a 40% reduction in positive tests, despite the alleged increase in testing.
Dopers are improving year on year. Testing is not keeping up.
The problem with your raw numbers is LA never tested positive. Khol only tested positive once. etc.
wansteadimp said:But 23 of those 30 are from the 2004 retests of the 1998 samples, 2 are on the back of the Gendarmes finest work, so there were only 5 positives actually triggered in 1998 by doping authorities.
DirtyWorks said:I'd argue we haven't seen full mutant this year like a Horner. That is an improvement! There are still a couple of days for riders to go full mutant.
I hope veloclinic compares the third week power to weeks one and two. For me, that's a key comparison to judge the level of PED use.
Separately, who told the teams to get off the PED's all at once? Very interesting.
DirtyWorks said:http://veloclinic.tumblr.com/post/87026142603/catching-up-on-the-2014-giro-performance-analysis
This fits with what I've seen. But, I'm just an anonymous w@nker.
This is very encouraging as I thought the giant hole in the bio-passport (ex. Horner Vuelta) would become the norm.
roundabout said:There is no way that Quintana did 5.4 Froome W/kg to Val Martello.
wansteadimp said:But 23 of those 30 are from the 2004 retests of the 1998 samples, 2 are on the back of the Gendarmes finest work, so there were only 5 positives actually triggered in 1998 by doping authorities.
DirtyWorks said:http://veloclinic.tumblr.com/post/87026142603/catching-up-on-the-2014-giro-performance-analysis
This fits with what I've seen. But, I'm just an anonymous w@nker.
This is very encouraging as I thought the giant hole in the bio-passport (ex. Horner Vuelta) would become the norm.