2014: Contador vs Nibali, the official *****ing thread

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Who is the best GT rider in 2014

  • Betancur

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    0
  • Poll closed .
I

IronCQ

Oct 1, 2013
48
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3,585
Well, i thought writing the 2014 and 2013 results in a funny way to explain the weirdness of the poll results wasnt really trolling, but now i know who makes standards here. Its not that i really support specific riders, i just enjoy watching and practicing so I'm quite ok with everything or everybody winning. What i don't like is lack of respect to some racers, diminishing their victories just based on pure speculation. We know how hard it is. There is no walk in the park here. So maybe Berto will win the 2015 tour. Until july, the boss is Nib, may u like it or not. And it's right soIMHO because in 2013 the n.1 was Chris even with Vincenzo having a first and second place in Gt.
 
Cramps

Cramps

Sep 4, 2012
250
0
9,030
OK, I'll try to expand the conversation outside of gut feelings. Hang on....

Contador was about 2:30 down on Nibali when he crashed out. Nibali went on to destroy the opposition, winning by almost 8 minutes over 2nd place Peraud, and in particular almost 9:40 minutes over Valverde.

It follows that for Contador to beat Nibali's time in the Tour, he would have beaten Valverde by at least 12 minutes.

So if Contador absolutely CRUSHES Valverde in the Vuelta, then maybe he could have beat Nibali in the Tour. Otherwise, Nibali seems like the more likely winner.
 
Cramps

Cramps

Sep 4, 2012
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LaFlorecita said:
That logic completely ignores the difference in shape for Valverde, Contador, and the difference in parcours.
Click to expand...

Of course, but at least it's trying to think about how to gauge performance when the competitors haven't faced each other -- how do they do against common opposition.
 
ILovecycling

ILovecycling

Aug 4, 2010
11,337
0
0
LaFlorecita said:
So I take it if "Nib" wins the Giro next year, and finishes second at the Tour, he won't be "the boss"?

Part of me really wants to see Alberto ride the Giro too. Oh, how fun that would be :D
Click to expand...
And he would announce it 1 month before start,Nibali wouldnt be able to change his schedule lol :D
but they would be crushed by nairo and dawg later in july,which sucks
 
cineteq

cineteq

May 20, 2009
8,934
7
17,495
Cramps said:
Contador was about 2:30 down on Nibali when he crashed out. Nibali went on to destroy the opposition, winning by almost 8 minutes over 2nd place Peraud, and in particular almost 9:40 minutes over Valverde.

It follows that for Contador to beat Nibali's time in the Tour, he would have beaten Valverde by at least 12 minutes.

So if Contador absolutely CRUSHES Valverde in the Vuelta, then maybe he could have beat Nibali in the Tour. Otherwise, Nibali seems like the more likely winner.
Click to expand...
I don't agree the comparison with Valverde is linear, but your analysis is reasonable. Contador and Froome's fanboys seem to ignore how far down were them after stage 5, of course assuming Froome would have finished that stage.
 
meat puppet

meat puppet

May 29, 2011
3,549
1,651
16,680
right, so, wait until the end of vuelta, compare doc veloclinic's w/kg measurements of the two riders, on apples to apples climbs, and then decide who's more ridiculous.

hint: "winning" is not necessarily a positive thing.
 
Jspear

Jspear

Feb 23, 2014
8,827
254
17,880
IronCQ said:
Well, i thought writing the 2014 and 2013 results in a funny way to explain the weirdness of the poll results wasnt really trolling, but now i know who makes standards here. Its not that i really support specific riders, i just enjoy watching and practicing so I'm quite ok with everything or everybody winning. What i don't like is lack of respect to some racers, diminishing their victories just based on pure speculation. We know how hard it is. There is no walk in the park here. So maybe Berto will win the 2015 tour. Until july, the boss is Nib, may u like it or not. And it's right soIMHO because in 2013 the n.1 was Chris even with Vincenzo having a first and second place in Gt.
Click to expand...

IF AC wins this Vuelta, than Nibbes isn't the "boss." Tell me what is harder: Nibali in peak form beating "easier" competition (by professional cycling standards) or AC in not quite peak form, while recovering from a fractured tibia, beating harder competition? I will wait till after the Vuelta to say this concretely, but AC is very close to proving he was the best GT rider of the 2014 season.
 
UpTheRoad

UpTheRoad

Jul 27, 2009
680
0
0
cineteq said:
I don't agree the comparison with Valverde is linear, but your analysis is reasonable. Contador and Froome's fanboys seem to ignore how far down were them after stage 5, of course assuming Froome would have finished that stage.
Click to expand...

The deficit was entirely due to the cobbled stage. Nibali took 2 seconds on Contador in Sheffield and Contador took 3 seconds back the day before (???) he crashed out.

Too bad both AC and CF crashed out, as the TdF was shaping up to be awesome.

Nibali timing his peak perfectly with a lead on both AC and CF.

AC in top shape and behind on GC. Can you say attacks galore?

CF behind on GC. Can you say attacks galore?
 
cineteq

cineteq

May 20, 2009
8,934
7
17,495
UpTheRoad said:
The deficit was entirely due to the cobbled stage. Nibali took 2 seconds on Contador in Sheffield and Contador took 3 seconds back the day before (???) he crashed out.
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What's your point? Was it a secret there was a cobbled stage? Should have been neutralized?

UpTheRoad said:
AC in top shape and behind on GC. Can you say attacks galore?

CF behind on GC. Can you say attacks galore?
Click to expand...
Absolutely. Nothing Nibali couldn't have controlled to minimize any damage (if any).

Now in hindsight, it's clear the TdF was a harder, with better parcours and had equal or better competition. Don't you think?
 
Red Rick

Red Rick

Feb 20, 2012
53,829
44,172
28,180
Nibali only had that gap cause of a wet cobble stage in the Tour, which happens once in every 20 or more years. Racing on wet cobbles has very little to do with GT ability in general. Also, the Tour was the only race where Nibali reached a good (in this case, great) level. He got dropped in every other international race he entered.

Tour champion =/ best GT rider
 
Afrank

Afrank

Aug 16, 2011
10,819
2
0
Red Rick said:
Nibali only had that gap cause of a wet cobble stage in the Tour, which happens once in every 20 or more years. Racing on wet cobbles has very little to do with GT ability in general. Also, the Tour was the only race where Nibali reached a good (in this case, great) level. He got dropped in every other international race he entered.

Tour champion =/ best GT rider
Click to expand...

A little contradictory those two paragraphs. ;)
 
Red Rick

Red Rick

Feb 20, 2012
53,829
44,172
28,180
cineteq said:
Are you suggesting Valverde is the best 2014 GT rider? ;)

PS: Btw, why is Betancur in the poll and not Quintana? What if Quintana would have won La Vuelta?
Click to expand...

I didn't mention anything related to Valverde.

Betancur is a troll option, just like Vino. Who doesn't like Betancur?:rolleyes:
 
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