2016 TdF, Stage 15: Bourg-en-Bresse → Culoz (160km)

[arvc40]

Re: Re:

I have no worldly idea what that **** was that Froome pulled on the climb. It was such a rapid action I doubt the other riders saw it.

Lucky it did not cause a crash.

Yes, I thought that too !. Hes a strange one that's for sure.

 

[HelloDolly]

So Trek DS saying the Mollema will NOT attack after the rst day as he could lose time :lol:

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

Mollema looked cooked. Everyone else was worse. Had Quintana attacked, Froome would've gained another minute plus on everyone bar LRP. That's not the Tour cycling wants but maybe it's the Tour it deserves. It may yet get it in the Alps if Froome is really yet to peak.

Porte looked pretty tired on the last climb as well. Even Froome did not look that great but it's hard to tell by looks. Quintana never looks tired but obviously he is.

 

[Alexandre B.]

Re:

Trek manager just addmited they are happy where they are in GC.

Yes. What's the point of trying to distance other podium contenders if you feel good?

 

[SeriousSam]

Re:

Mollema looked cooked. Everyone else was worse. Had Quintana attacked, Froome would've gained another minute plus on everyone bar perhaps LRP. That's not the Tour cycling wants but maybe it's the Tour it deserves. It may yet get it in the Alps if Froome is really yet to peak.

Would be hilarious if Froome reaches a 3rd week peak as promised and puts 1:30 into the second rider on one of those MTFs.

 

[arvc40]

This race has become a TOUR !

 

[Richeypen]

Re: Re:

for all idiots complaining about lack of GC action : if a domestique is doing 350+ watts at the front you cannot attack from that

just so you know why the tour is boring

Movistar had 2 people in the early break and Valverde and Quintana. Yet they tried nothing. Sky Doms might have been bossing it but thats no excuse for not at least trying. They allowed Poels to ride tempo without even testing him.

They did try. They sent Valverde on an attack. Presumably they told him, rather than just going all in and burning himself out, to ride just above his threshold, at the kind of pace that Quintana could sustain for the remainder of the climb. Once they saw Poels easily reel it in and Froome looking comfortable, they realised that it was hopeless Quintana trying to attack and that he'd likely end up losing time.

Intent and aggression is irrelevant if one rider and his team are putting out significantly more watts than everyone else.

They didnt try to attack, Valverde followed Aru halfheartedly. Valverde didnt want to risk his top 10 by burying himself. A full on attack may have blown up Valverde but it could have taken Poels and possibly Neive with him.

What would have been the purpose of Valverde attacking full on and blowing up? All it would have achieved would be to isolate Quintana. Sky were riding to power - they would know that Valverde couldn't sustain a 450w+ burst and would just gradually reel him in and spit him out the back.

The attack that Valverde did would have tested them by riding just above his threshold; the kind of power that Quintana could sustain long-term in an attack. That's a much better way of assessing the strength of Sky on the day than a ridiculous all-in effort which is doomed to fail.

Sky closed it down easily so Movistar abandoned plans for Quintana to attack. It's obviously not what the fans want to see, but it would have been a suicidal move by Quintana to have attacked in those circumstances, with Poels and Froome looking so strong.

Because nobody knows. Riders these days are to happy to settle for a podium rather than risking everything for the outside chance of a win. If the GC was close I might understand it but it isnt, Quintana is 3 minutes down and needs to act and act soon if he wants to win.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re: Re:

for all idiots complaining about lack of GC action : if a domestique is doing 350+ watts at the front you cannot attack from that

just so you know why the tour is boring

The only counter attack to this is 5 or 6 man teams. Something which needs to happen ASAP!

Salary caps

Salary caps are not enforceable. They are extremely difficult to police even in sports competitions that only take place in one country with one legal system and involving teams that are large and stable institutions. Even in those circumstances a cottage industry in ways to circumvent a cap tends to quickly spring up. In a sport with pro teams spread across a couple of dozen countries, each with their own legal system, and some teams having links to national governments and/or dubious oligarchs? It would be purely decorative.

 

[Alexandre B.]

Heartbreaking. He deserved that stage.

 

[djpbaltimore]

Mollema saw it. He started to follow Froome. Poels was not that strong on Ventoux, it is ominous if he is actually getting stronger.

 

[HelloDolly]

Its deosn;t amtter if the teams or 9 or 6 ...SKY will have the strongest ....others need to work together and not hang onto top 10s

 

[arvc40]

Re: Re:

Mollema looked cooked. Everyone else was worse. Had Quintana attacked, Froome would've gained another minute plus on everyone bar perhaps LRP. That's not the Tour cycling wants but maybe it's the Tour it deserves. It may yet get it in the Alps if Froome is really yet to peak.

Would be hilarious if Froome reaches a 3rd week peak as promised and puts 1:30 into the second rider on one of those MTFs.

Yes, it's probably a major focus. Disprove the myth perpetuated that he is weak in week 3. Not going to be weak I'm afraid. Ive no problem with that atall.

 

[PremierAndrew]

Re: Re:

Mollema looked cooked. Everyone else was worse. Had Quintana attacked, Froome would've gained another minute plus on everyone bar perhaps LRP. That's not the Tour cycling wants but maybe it's the Tour it deserves. It may yet get it in the Alps if Froome is really yet to peak.

Would be hilarious if Froome reaches a 3rd week peak as promised and puts 1:30 into the second rider on one of those MTFs.

He's probably just using the Tour as a training ride for Rio

 

[SKSemtex]

Re: Re:

for all idiots complaining about lack of GC action : if a domestique is doing 350+ watts at the front you cannot attack from that

just so you know why the tour is boring

Movistar had 2 people in the early break and Valverde and Quintana. Yet they tried nothing. Sky Doms might have been bossing it but thats no excuse for not at least trying. They allowed Poels to ride tempo without even testing him.

THIS. THIS. THIS.

On the face of it, Movistar has a stronger climbing team than Sky. The problem is either tactical - they haven't found a way to unseat a train - or physical - Quintana's just too weak.

Sstronger climbing team? With Valvelder beeig in Giro? No f.g way

 

[arvc40]

Doc on now about Cancellara talking a load a *** about his private life

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Because nobody knows. Riders these days are to happy to settle for a podium rather than risking everything for the outside chance of a win. If the GC was close I might understand it but it isnt, Quintana is 3 minutes down and needs to act and act soon if he wants to win.

But they do know - they all have power meters. They know exactly what power they can sustain for what length of time. They know that if Poels is riding at nearly 6w/kg and is closing down attacks from Aru, Bardet and Valverde, with Froome also looking comfortable, then, at best it's a waste energy to attack, at worst it's going to cost you time.

It's obviously boring to watch, but the odds were so stacked against Quintana in a situation like that it would have been a major tactical error to go on a hard attack. He's doing the only realistic thing he can to try to win - minimize his losses when Sky and Froome are so imperiously strong and hope that they fade later in the race.

Regarding the podium, it's actually the opposite for Quintana. If he was content to ride for second, he probably would have attacked - because Yates was struggling and Mollema's level is kind of unknown. But he's not interested in them (at least for now) - he's only interested in getting the better of Froome.

 

[Publicus]

Re: Re:

for all idiots complaining about lack of GC action : if a domestique is doing 350+ watts at the front you cannot attack from that

just so you know why the tour is boring

Movistar had 2 people in the early break and Valverde and Quintana. Yet they tried nothing. Sky Doms might have been bossing it but thats no excuse for not at least trying. They allowed Poels to ride tempo without even testing him.

THIS. THIS. THIS.

On the face of it, Movistar has a stronger climbing team than Sky. The problem is either tactical - they haven't found a way to unseat a train - or physical - Quintana's just too weak.

It's not just Movistar though either. The other contenders (and I use the term lightly) need to ride more aggressively. Trying to mimic Sky's tactic is pointless (see Astana today). You're not going to out-Sky Sky.

 

[RattaKuningas]

At least Aru looked good today and maybe we can expect some action from him because when attacking today he didn't do his usual faces that we see when he is on the limit. I'm sure that he won't be content with defending 10th overall on GC.

 

[BigMac]

Re:

Heartbreaking. He deserved that stage.

Majka did.

 

[Põhja Konn]

Everyone who are still whining over Quintana not attacking should be embarrassed to call themselves a cycling fan. He obviously lacks the form and is up against a team riding a level above everyone else. What Sky is doing is insulting to every self-respecting cycling fan.

Quintana was supposed to be the main rival to Froome after Contador crashed out, and is now being scapegoated for not running repeatedly face first against a brick wall. Well, he did so. Twice. And paid for it. Appearantly, it wasn't enough. Idiotic doesn't even begin to describe such an attitude.

 

[dacooley]

what's quintana's plan of clawing 3 minutes back? he'll be losing tt to froome that's almost guaranteed.

 

[spalco]

Re:

Its deosn;t amtter if the teams or 9 or 6 ...SKY will have the strongest ....others need to work together and not hang onto top 10s

Well, it's easier said than done, when the rider's livelihood depends on the finish.

I mean, for Quintana obviously only the win matters, and regardless, he'll have a good contract for the rest of his career if he stays healthy. But for people like Mollema, Yates, Bardet and arguably Porte, a Tour de France podium would easily be the best "win" of their careers, so why shouldn't that be their goal as long as Froome looks untouchable. What would they have to gain from any collusion with Movistar?

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

for all idiots complaining about lack of GC action : if a domestique is doing 350+ watts at the front you cannot attack from that

just so you know why the tour is boring

Movistar had 2 people in the early break and Valverde and Quintana. Yet they tried nothing. Sky Doms might have been bossing it but thats no excuse for not at least trying. They allowed Poels to ride tempo without even testing him.

THIS. THIS. THIS.

On the face of it, Movistar has a stronger climbing team than Sky. The problem is either tactical - they haven't found a way to unseat a train - or physical - Quintana's just too weak.

It's not just Movistar though either. The other contenders (and I use the term lightly) need to ride more aggressively. Trying to mimic Sky's tactic is pointless (see Astana today). You're not going to out-Sky Sky.

Astana's pace was causing problems, they broke TJVG and stretched the group but if they can't keep it going and if Aru is not strong enough to capitalize on that it's not going to work but at least they tried something.

 

[DFA123]

Re:

what's quintana's plan to clawing 3 minutes back? he'll be losing tt to froome that's almost guaranteed.

His plan is the same as it has been all along. Minimize losses while Froome and his train are on top form, and hope that he cracks sometime in the third week.

The same as last year - and basically the only credible plan in his position.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

what's quintana's plan to clawing 3 minutes back? he'll be losing tt to froome that's almost guaranteed.

His plan is the same as it has been all along. Minimize losses while Froome and his train are on top form, and hope that he cracks sometime in the third week.

The same as last year - and basically the only credible plan in his position.

If he keeps losing three minutes to Froome in the first two weeks, it's hardly a plan. He is just playing catch up all the time.