2016 Tour de France, Info & Discussion

[Miburo]

Re: 2016 Tour de France Discussion & Info

I just went through the official startlist, this time looking at the starting numbers specifically.

Weird: in case of several teams (Tinkoff, Movistar, Astana), there is a co-leader (?) wearing number "x2" on his bib, regardless of what is his name (what triggers that the alphabetical order of riders wearing numbers from "x2" to "x9" is altered).

It looks like this:
11. Quintana, 12. Valverde, 13. Anacona
21. Aru, 22. Nibali, 23. Fuglsang
31. Contador, 32. Sagan, 33. Bodnar

Not the best idea IMO. Until now, the "x2-x9 in alphabetical order" rule was strictly observed in the TdF. I hardly see any reasons to make exception from that rule in case of any rider, even if he is reigning world champion or former TdF winner.

And, if we give "x1-x2" numbers to Quintana-Valverde, Aru-Nibali and Contador-Sagan, why not to do the same with e.g. Barguil-Degenkolb or Porte-TvG?

I'm sorry, you can care about anything you want but come one bro. WHO GIVES A ***?

 

[Pantani_lives]

Apparently the rules have changed this year. I just checked 1985, 1995, 2005 and 2015 and indeed I couldn't find one exception. There's no reason to be against it. It's just another break with tradition, like the disappearance of the prologue etc.

 

[dick the quick]

Re:

Apparently the rules have changed this year. I just checked 1985, 1995, 2005 and 2015 and indeed I couldn't find one exception. There's no reason to be against it. It's just another break with tradition, like the disappearance of the prologue etc.

Thanks for checking. It was just an observation that something has changed in the TdF specifically: some will like it, some won't (me being amongst them), some other won't even care. And I realize that there is a total freedom regarding starting numbers in other races, and everybody lives with it.

 

[vedrafjord]

Re:

Apparently the rules have changed this year. I just checked 1985, 1995, 2005 and 2015 and indeed I couldn't find one exception. There's no reason to be against it. It's just another break with tradition, like the disappearance of the prologue etc.

Those two things are fairly separate. As I see it the team is given numbers x1 to x9 and they can put the riders in whatever order they want. What if someone was replaced at a late stage, would they get the number of the rider they replaced, or if Arredondo replaced Zubeldia would the whole team have to shuffle numbers to keep the alphabetical order?

One thing I do think is cool in Formula 1 is the reigning champion is always number 1, but if he's not there, his team use number 0 instead of number 1 for their leader, so 1 is kept special.

As for prologues, they only started in 1967 and will hopefully make a comeback at some point. I'd take one over a team time trial any day. It's a cool intro to a GT and gives the commentators on TV a chance to introduce all the riders and say what their buildup was like and what their goals are. It also puts some order on GC so placings aren't reliant on countbacks in the first few days, and still gives the sprinters a chance to lead GC in the following days if they had a good effort. I think they fell out of fashion because sponsors love team time trials, and people were sick of Spartacus having the yellow jersey for the whole first week. That's the fault of course design though - if you put a bunch of pan-flat stages with no time bonuses after a prologue then obviously nothing will happen in GC.

 

[vedrafjord]

But in general I'm really looking forward to the Tour this year. My biggest wish is for no first week crashes to ruin things for anyone, and also if Froome and Contador both stay out of trouble and have a fair fight, we can put a stop to stupid hypothetical Froome vs Contador threads and posts for at least the next year. Also interested to see the relative strength of the b-division guys below Froome/Contador/Quintana. And if Quintana goes for it on one of the early multi-mountain stages.

 

[Oliwright]

Re:

But in general I'm really looking forward to the Tour this year. My biggest wish is for no first week crashes to ruin things for anyone, and also if Froome and Contador both stay out of trouble and have a fair fight, we can put a stop to stupid hypothetical Froome vs Contador threads and posts for at least the next year. Also interested to see the relative strength of the b-division guys below Froome/Contador/Quintana. And if Quintana goes for it on one of the early multi-mountain stages.

Couldn't agree more!

 

[yaco]

I expect this to be an aggressive tour - Expect teams who are stage hunting to make many classic type days - This could make it uncomfortable for the GC teams.

 

[Oliwright]

Re: 2016 Tour de France Discussion & Info

Movistar, Astana, Tinkoff and Sky all have strong teams for the mountains. Which you think is the strongest probably depends upon who you support.

But in terms of the classics riders on each squad and who can make a difference for the flat there are massive differences.

Movistar
Erviti is a good rider, who profited well from both breaks in RVV and Roubaix.
Izaguirre riders are both versatile and will be good across most terrains
Oliveira & Herrada are average riders imo
Thats it out of the non climbers only Erviti is a top level flat rider.


Astana and Tinkoff have some experienced riders for the flat terrain and will be stronger than Movistar.

Imo Sky are a level above when it comes to classics style domestiques.

How you could argue i'm being unfair to movistar beyond me. It was no accident that quintana lost 2 mins on Stage 2 last year and was lucky not to loose time on stage 4.

 

[yaco]

Re: 2016 Tour de France Discussion & Info

Movistar, Astana, Tinkoff and Sky all have strong teams for the mountains. Which you think is the strongest probably depends upon who you support.

But in terms of the classics riders on each squad and who can make a difference for the flat there are massive differences.

Movistar
Erviti is a good rider, who profited well from both breaks in RVV and Roubaix.
Izaguirre riders are both versatile and will be good across most terrains
Oliveira & Herrada are average riders imo
Thats it out of the non climbers only Erviti is a top level flat rider.

Simple - Moviestar lost time when caught behind a crash on a windy day - Like many you are reading too much into the situation.


Astana and Tinkoff have some experienced riders for the flat terrain and will be stronger than Movistar.

Imo Sky are a level above when it comes to classics style domestiques.

How you could argue i'm being unfair to movistar beyond me. It was no accident that quintana lost 2 mins on Stage 2 last year and was lucky not to loose time on stage 4.

 

[Valv.Piti]

So why isn't Tamie cetogorized, on stage 19, surely has to be a mistake, no? Its a proper cat 2.

 

[Jungle Cycle]

86 Lemond stop Hinault run, 96 Riis stop Indurain run, 06 worst final/result ever but was fun while watching..
2016 - ??

 

[Sciocco]

Why isn't this thread stickied? It's so important.

Also Mantis, where's the next stage thread slacker?

 

[Praying Mantis]

Re:

Why isn't this thread stickied? It's so important.

Also Mantis, where's the next stage thread slacker?

Loaded and ready to go, but you know what? Rest day! Posting tomorrow.

Don't think we need sticky for this, but if you want to do some rest day banter, why not in here?

 

[Sciocco]

Re: Re:

Why isn't this thread stickied? It's so important.

Also Mantis, where's the next stage thread slacker?

Loaded and ready to go, but you know what? Rest day! Posting tomorrow.

Don't think we need sticky for this, but if you want to do some rest day banter, why not in here?

I think it's useful to have all the profiles with the mountain profiles as well.

Have you considered doing a vuelta discussion and info thread? Nevermind the stage threads but something just like this one.

 

[Praying Mantis]

Re: Re:

I think it's useful to have all the profiles with the mountain profiles as well.

Have you considered doing a vuelta discussion and info thread? Nevermind the stage threads but something just like this one.

In each stage thread you can just click the profile overview at the top, and it'll take you to this thread with all the profiles.

Yes I've considered a Vuelta thread, but the details are a little scarce at the moment. I think I'll put it up once the Tour is over, at which point there's still a month to go to la Vuelta.

 

[le jesters]

What are people's thoughts on the mountain/uphill time trial? Do u think it will suit the GC riders or the time trial specialists?

 

[capuldemetal]

http://www.ilmeteo.it/meteo-europa/Mont+Ventoux?g=3& ans strong crosswinds,the stage from carcasonne to montpeller will be also under crosswinds.let there be havok!

 

[Sciocco]

Re: Re:

I think it's useful to have all the profiles with the mountain profiles as well.

Have you considered doing a vuelta discussion and info thread? Nevermind the stage threads but something just like this one.

In each stage thread you can just click the profile overview at the top, and it'll take you to this thread with all the profiles.

Yes I've considered a Vuelta thread, but the details are a little scarce at the moment. I think I'll put it up once the Tour is over, at which point there's still a month to go to la Vuelta.

Yea I've been doing that. Guess I'm just spoiled from Eshnar's Giro previews and such.

These threads are useful and something nice to reference almost everyday for three weeks plus. I know it takes a lot of work though so if you don't want to I understand. A vuelta one would be great though! I guess you could always pass the torch as well.

 

[Gigs_98]

I read the ramaz might be out of stage 20 because of the danger of rockfalls. If that really is the case stage 20 would become extremely lame and generally it's just annoying that something like this happens to stage 20 in the tour for the 2nd year in a row.
However this would even be great if the aso now decides to use the joux verte after the joux plane because it would be too easy otherwise. Nevertheless I wouldn't expect that to happen since we are talking about the aso.

 

[CheckMyPecs]

Joux Plane is still one hell of a climb.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Should substitute by going from Colombière to Côte des Araches (used in the 2009 stage and matches first 6km of this profile) and using one of the sides of the Morillon-les Esserts climb (preferably this one although that would entail doing a loop-de-loop) to lead directly into Joux-Plane.

Does it match up to Ramaz? Of course not. But it'd be better than nothing.

 

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

A double ascent of Joux Plane would have my preference.

 

[binz]

Re:

What are people's thoughts on the mountain/uphill time trial? Do u think it will suit the GC riders or the time trial specialists?

Should be a mix I think. Dumoulin wants this stage im pretty sure Ion Izaguire maybe?

 

[lenric]

Tour de France - Part I

10 Jul 2016

Only small skirmishes in the Pyrenees: despite the absolute domination of his team, Chris Froome failed to make a difference on the first mountains.

Only a spectacular downhill attack earned him about twenty seconds on the most dangerous rivals, Nairo Quintana above all.
​

In the crucial stage to Andorra, after an early attack by Contador and Valverde, easily controlled by Team Sky, the pace on the climbs was not that impressive with VAM values around 1400-1500 m/h, also due to the scorching heat.

On the final climb to Andorra (10 km at 7.2%) the numerous accelerations of the best riders determined a VAM of 1630 m/h (6.3 w/kg), despite a strong hailstorm that cooled body temperatures, but froze leg muscles.

​

Generally, the level shown so far by the best climbers was rather mediocre, the competitive spirit restrained by caution: no one dared attacking far away from the finish, everybody has been simply waiting for the final kilometers, thus helping Froome's own game, who however appeared always on top of the situation. Quintana never even got out of the wake of the Team Sky's captain, perhaps waiting for a possible decline of the british rider in the third week.

​
The first rider forced to abandon the race came during the 7th stage, a sign of an early part of the TdF less demanding than usual.

Alberto Contador was forced to abandon the race on the way to Andorra, after testing his condition in the first part of the day. Two crashes in the first stages, plus a feverish condition deprived the race of one of the most awaited protagonists, even though, his form in the pre-TdF races had not shown to be his best.

http://www.53x12.com/#!tdf16pt1/ar3p0

 

[Oliwright]

Re:

What are people's thoughts on the mountain/uphill time trial? Do u think it will suit the GC riders or the time trial specialists?

The GC guys for Sure, it's a serious climb and when you have Froome who can TT and Climb so well it's hard to see the specialists, even those like Dumoulin who can climb winning.