2018 Paris-Nice, 4/3-11/3

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

Sidenote:

Did anyone notice Cort sitting with the GC guys in the front group, over the last climb today?

As a sprinter/classics hybrid, when guys like Trentin, Degenkolb, Viviani and Demare can't hack it, but Cort still can, that gives him an entirely new dimension, and a wider range of races to go for.

He is going to be one to watch in the ardennes classics

Oh, and on a purely national note.... When the peloton started the final climb, I saw 6 danes in the top 20 going in..... warms my heart, how well our boys are riding at the moment .

Maybe in Amstel, other two certainly no.

If you say so

The way I see it, if Sanchez had not gone off today, the Astana guys would have kept the front group away, instead of slowing it down, and Cort would have won it on the line, in that group..... But Sanchez's GC hopes are more important (obviously).

All I'm saying is, in a 1 day race, todays stage could have ended very differently.

In the Ardennes you'll also have a Movistar team fully supporting their leader Valverde. The team they currently have at Paris-Nice is fairly young and in support of a very young Spaniard who is learning how to lead a team for a race. (Remember Valverde isn't at Paris-Nice).

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Re: Re:

Oh, and on a purely national note.... When the peloton started the final climb, I saw 6 danes in the top 20 going in..... warms my heart, how well our boys are riding at the moment .

That is an outrage! Who'd been dropped!

Well. Bak, Mørkøv, or Juul-Jensen, obviously...

About Cort; I'm pretty sure if he hadn't at a teammate up front he wouldn't he been quite so eager to make the moto go away from the group.

Moerkoev was leading Alaphillippe into the climb, Juul-Jensen was leading Kreuziger into the climb, Breschel was leading McKay into the climb, and all 3 danes on Astana were there = 6

You are right on Cort, and he wouldn't have constantly backed off either, every time the guy on the front was looking for relief

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Re: Re:

Sidenote:

Did anyone notice Cort sitting with the GC guys in the front group, over the last climb today?

As a sprinter/classics hybrid, when guys like Trentin, Degenkolb, Viviani and Demare can't hack it, but Cort still can, that gives him an entirely new dimension, and a wider range of races to go for.

He is going to be one to watch in the ardennes classics

Oh, and on a purely national note.... When the peloton started the final climb, I saw 6 danes in the top 20 going in..... warms my heart, how well our boys are riding at the moment .

Maybe in Amstel, other two certainly no.

If you say so

The way I see it, if Sanchez had not gone off today, the Astana guys would have kept the front group away, instead of slowing it down, and Cort would have won it on the line, in that group..... But Sanchez's GC hopes are more important (obviously).

All I'm saying is, in a 1 day race, todays stage could have ended very differently.

In the Ardennes you'll also have a Movistar team fully supporting their leader Valverde. The team they currently have at Paris-Nice is fairly young and in support of a very young Spaniard who is learning how to lead a team for a race. (Remember Valverde isn't at Paris-Nice).

Dude, settle down - All I said was, that he will be one to watch... as in a dark horse.

Nobody is mentioning him as a favorite, but today showed he has the potential, because he was the only "sprinter" that could hang with the GC guys - which was my point

 

[skippo12]

Wheelsucker wins...Sanchez deserved the win but I guess he will be happy about the GC.

Irrelevant comment. Lulu wants the GC. As soon as he had those 2 on the wheel, he knew that the stage win was over.
You don't have to be genius to know that and to know that in such scenario, it's common sense.. Sanchez did not even try to attack. It does show you what was his real aim.
Hivert played it smart. He even pulled. And last but not least, he has been pretty strong to be there so well deserved!

Exactly hate these comments. They are comparing it with 10km to go in a momument without a GC or stage win. Everyone did we expected and deserved their places

Reading the second part of my post should tell you that I know what Sanchez aimed for but I can still express my disappointment that Hivert didn`t do a thing to help LLS in the final. It was in Hiverts interest to chase DiGregorio but he wasn`t taking a single turn for the last 5+ kms.

 

[Koronin]

Re: Re:

Sidenote:

Did anyone notice Cort sitting with the GC guys in the front group, over the last climb today?

As a sprinter/classics hybrid, when guys like Trentin, Degenkolb, Viviani and Demare can't hack it, but Cort still can, that gives him an entirely new dimension, and a wider range of races to go for.

He is going to be one to watch in the ardennes classics

Oh, and on a purely national note.... When the peloton started the final climb, I saw 6 danes in the top 20 going in..... warms my heart, how well our boys are riding at the moment .

Maybe in Amstel, other two certainly no.

If you say so

The way I see it, if Sanchez had not gone off today, the Astana guys would have kept the front group away, instead of slowing it down, and Cort would have won it on the line, in that group..... But Sanchez's GC hopes are more important (obviously).

All I'm saying is, in a 1 day race, todays stage could have ended very differently.

In the Ardennes you'll also have a Movistar team fully supporting their leader Valverde. The team they currently have at Paris-Nice is fairly young and in support of a very young Spaniard who is learning how to lead a team for a race. (Remember Valverde isn't at Paris-Nice).

Dude, settle down - All I said was, that he will be one to watch... as in a dark horse.

Nobody is mentioning him as a favorite, but today showed he has the potential, because he was the only "sprinter" that could hang with the GC guys - which was my point

Which means he could possibly do something at Amstel, however, the other two are highly unlikely he'd be anywhere near the front. Amstel is bit different animal than the other two. Also remember that Valverde has been able to beat sprinters in uphill finishes after hard stages. Dark horse maybe, but basically no shot at Fleche Wallone or Liege unless the weather turns nasty.

 

[Blanco]

Wheelsucker wins...Sanchez deserved the win but I guess he will be happy about the GC.

Irrelevant comment. Lulu wants the GC. As soon as he had those 2 on the wheel, he knew that the stage win was over.
You don't have to be genius to know that and to know that in such scenario, it's common sense.. Sanchez did not even try to attack. It does show you what was his real aim.
Hivert played it smart. He even pulled. And last but not least, he has been pretty strong to be there so well deserved!

Exactly hate these comments. They are comparing it with 10km to go in a momument without a GC or stage win. Everyone did we expected and deserved their places

Reading the second part of my post should tell you that I know what Sanchez aimed for but I can still express my disappointment that Hivert didn`t do a thing to help LLS in the final. It was in Hiverts interest to chase DiGregorio but he wasn`t taking a single turn for the last 5+ kms.

And that is exactly a part that you don't (or won't) understand. Di Gregorio is doing only thing he could do to win, he attacks. He's the slowest of the three. That attack puts Hivert in perfect position. He knows Luis Leon is going to ride cause he wants time on the group behind, and plus he wants bonus on the line, and on top of everything Hivert knows Sanchez is very strong and that he'll eventually brought back Di Gregorio, cause he literally shake them off his wheel couple of times. So would you explain me please why the hell would be in Hivert's interest to chase Di Gregorio and spends precious strength which he would need in the final sprint very soon?!

 

[tobydawq]

Wheelsucker wins...Sanchez deserved the win but I guess he will be happy about the GC.

Irrelevant comment. Lulu wants the GC. As soon as he had those 2 on the wheel, he knew that the stage win was over.
You don't have to be genius to know that and to know that in such scenario, it's common sense.. Sanchez did not even try to attack. It does show you what was his real aim.
Hivert played it smart. He even pulled. And last but not least, he has been pretty strong to be there so well deserved!

Exactly hate these comments. They are comparing it with 10km to go in a momument without a GC or stage win. Everyone did we expected and deserved their places

Reading the second part of my post should tell you that I know what Sanchez aimed for but I can still express my disappointment that Hivert didn`t do a thing to help LLS in the final. It was in Hiverts interest to chase DiGregorio but he wasn`t taking a single turn for the last 5+ kms.

And that is exactly a part that you don't (or won't) understand. Di Gregorio is doing only thing he could do to win, he attacks. He's the slowest of the three. That attack puts Hivert in perfect position. He knows Luis Leon is going to ride cause he wants time on the group behind, and plus he wants bonus on the line, and on top of everything Hivert knows Sanchez is very strong and that he'll eventually brought back Di Gregorio, cause he literally shake them off his wheel couple of times. So would you explain me please why the hell would be in Hivert's interest to chase Di Gregorio and spends precious strength which he would need in the final sprint very soon?!

It can't be explained satisfactorily.

For some people it's just mandatory to whine whenever a guy who hasn't been taking the lion's share of the work wins a race no matter whatever obvious and completely fair reasons he might have had to not do so.

 

[skippo12]

Wheelsucker wins...Sanchez deserved the win but I guess he will be happy about the GC.

Irrelevant comment. Lulu wants the GC. As soon as he had those 2 on the wheel, he knew that the stage win was over.
You don't have to be genius to know that and to know that in such scenario, it's common sense.. Sanchez did not even try to attack. It does show you what was his real aim.
Hivert played it smart. He even pulled. And last but not least, he has been pretty strong to be there so well deserved!

Exactly hate these comments. They are comparing it with 10km to go in a momument without a GC or stage win. Everyone did we expected and deserved their places

Reading the second part of my post should tell you that I know what Sanchez aimed for but I can still express my disappointment that Hivert didn`t do a thing to help LLS in the final. It was in Hiverts interest to chase DiGregorio but he wasn`t taking a single turn for the last 5+ kms.

And that is exactly a part that you don't (or won't) understand. Di Gregorio is doing only thing he could do to win, he attacks. He's the slowest of the three. That attack puts Hivert in perfect position. He knows Luis Leon is going to ride cause he wants time on the group behind, and plus he wants bonus on the line, and on top of everything Hivert knows Sanchez is very strong and that he'll eventually brought back Di Gregorio, cause he literally shake them off his wheel couple of times. So would you explain me please why the hell would be in Hivert's interest to chase Di Gregorio and spends precious strength which he would need in the final sprint very soon?!

Again...I completly understand the situation and chances each rider had. I just don`t like it that the rider who did the least work wins the race.

 

[Geraint Too Fast]

Sam Bennett has a seriously weak immune system. He can't stop getting sick.

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Skippo12:

What you don't seem to understand is, that it was Sanchez's choice to make, and he clearly did not go for the stage win.

He could have easily forced the others to take turns, or taken a shot to get away from them, but it would probably have cost him 30 seconds on the peloton.

As such, this is not a moral issue, as Sanchez made the choice himself, to ride the way he did, with the priorities he had.

 

[skippo12]

Re:

Skippo12:

What you don't seem to understand is, that it was Sanchez's choice to make, and he clearly did not go for the stage win.

He could have easily forced the others to take turns, or taken a shot to get away from them, but it would probably have cost him 30 seconds on the peloton.

As such, this is not a moral issue, as Sanchez made the choice himself, to ride the way he did, with the priorities he had.

I completly understand this...it is pretty obvious because he set a consistent pace for the last kms. I can still be unhappy with the result and voice my opinion.

 

[Jungle Cycle]

Re:

Good to see Alaphilippe being so attentive and serious about this. Tomorrow's stage runs past Saint-Amand-Montrond which is the birthplace of Julian Alaphilippe. There is bonus secs o the top of Chablis to Chalon-sur-Saône (which is like a long version of Poggio).

I hope the GC men will fight for those. It's almost more exciting than the sprint.

Good call....

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Re: Re:

Good to see Alaphilippe being so attentive and serious about this. Tomorrow's stage runs past Saint-Amand-Montrond which is the birthplace of Julian Alaphilippe. There is bonus secs o the top of Chablis to Chalon-sur-Saône (which is like a long version of Poggio).

I hope the GC men will fight for those. It's almost more exciting than the sprint.

Good call....

Second that

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Re: Re:

Skippo12:

What you don't seem to understand is, that it was Sanchez's choice to make, and he clearly did not go for the stage win.

He could have easily forced the others to take turns, or taken a shot to get away from them, but it would probably have cost him 30 seconds on the peloton.

As such, this is not a moral issue, as Sanchez made the choice himself, to ride the way he did, with the priorities he had.

I completly understand this...it is pretty obvious because he set a consistent pace for the last kms. I can still be unhappy with the result and voice my opinion.

Just seems illogical to me.... kinda like arguing Lars Bak should win, not Greibel, because he did all the hard work.

Sanchez could have easily beaten both his compatriots, everyone knows that, but it would have cost him a once in a lifetime GC opportunity, so why begrudge a guy from another team, for which this will be the biggest win of the season, most probably, that he plays it smart and gets the job done, for his employer?

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Interesting TT tomorrow, the first 8 K is a gradual climb, with an average 3,5 % gradient, then a technical decent, then a few K flat, but with 4 K to go, there is a 1 km climb of 8 %, with another technical decent.

It is by no means a climbers TT, but we may see some freak results

 

[Son of Amsterhammer]

LLS should have told them both to take turns with him and he wouldn't contest the sprint. Not sure they both would have gone for it, maybe he did make the offer and was told no by 1 or both.

 

[Broccolidwarf]

Re:

LLS should have told them both to take turns with him and he wouldn't contest the sprint. Not sure they both would have gone for it, maybe he did make the offer and was told no by 1 or both.

DiGregorio needed to go early, he knew he was weakest in a sprint.

 

[WheelofGear]

Re:

Sidenote:

Did anyone notice Cort sitting with the GC guys in the front group, over the last climb today?

As a sprinter/classics hybrid, when guys like Trentin, Degenkolb, Viviani and Demare can't hack it, but Cort still can, that gives him an entirely new dimension, and a wider range of races to go for.

He is going to be one to watch in the ardennes classics

Oh, and on a purely national note.... When the peloton started the final climb, I saw 6 danes in the top 20 going in..... warms my heart, how well our boys are riding at the moment .

Trentin is not a worse climber than Cort. Just look at yesterday's stage. They are pretty similar. Along with Colbrelli, those three form the bridge between hardier sprinters like Kristoff or Degenkolb and heavier punchers like GVA and Sagan.

And he can only win a conservative version of Amstel. Brabantse Pijl is a more realistic goal if we talk hilly races. He has a better shot at the cobbled classics, most likely something like Gent-Wevelgem.

But Cort hasn't really proved that he is a rider who can go into breakaways or smaller groups which is important in the classics. At least Colbrelli and Trentin are able to do so.

 

[The Barb]

Interesting and wide open time trial, although I kinda think Alaphillipe will smash it.

 

[HelloDolly]

Re:

Sam Bennett has a seriously weak immune system. He can't stop getting sick.

THere si alot of sickness in the race e.g. Kristoff

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Re:

LLS should have told them both to take turns with him and he wouldn't contest the sprint. Not sure they both would have gone for it, maybe he did make the offer and was told no by 1 or both.

That wouldn't work because deGregorio knew he had the worst sprint of the other two - so he had to attack to win.

 

[Bushman]

Re: Re:

Sidenote:

Did anyone notice Cort sitting with the GC guys in the front group, over the last climb today?

As a sprinter/classics hybrid, when guys like Trentin, Degenkolb, Viviani and Demare can't hack it, but Cort still can, that gives him an entirely new dimension, and a wider range of races to go for.

He is going to be one to watch in the ardennes classics

Oh, and on a purely national note.... When the peloton started the final climb, I saw 6 danes in the top 20 going in..... warms my heart, how well our boys are riding at the moment .

Trentin is not a worse climber than Cort. Just look at yesterday's stage. They are pretty similar. Along with Colbrelli, those three form the bridge between hardier sprinters like Kristoff or Degenkolb and heavier punchers like GVA and Sagan.

And he can only win a conservative version of Amstel. Brabantse Pijl is a more realistic goal if we talk hilly races. He has a better shot at the cobbled classics, most likely something like Gent-Wevelgem.

But Cort hasn't really proved that he is a rider who can go into breakaways or smaller groups which is important in the classics. At least Colbrelli and Trentin are able to do so.

I strongly disagree. I used to think that Cort’s future would be the Flemish classics but he has some trouble with positioning (which is evident in easy bunch sprints as well) and he doesnt really seem to have improved very much. I think he will continue to have trouble staying at the front of races like Ronde Van Vlaanderen.

However, his climbing is greatly improved this year. He got over the last climb yesterday better than any sprinter and the stage he won in Oman was the same: group of only 20 riders exclusively made up of climbers, puncheurs and a few strong classics riders and then Cort.

 

[Krokro]

Interesting and wide open time trial, although I kinda think Alaphillipe will smash it.

Do you think it's hilly enough for him to fight the likes of Sanchez, Wellens, Poels, Izagirre and even Gallopin?

As you said, it looks pretty open. We might have a nice edition this year again.

 

[Hugo Koblet]

Interesting and wide open time trial, although I kinda think Alaphillipe will smash it.

Do you think it's hilly enough for him to fight the likes of Sanchez, Wellens, Poels, Izagirre and even Gallopin?

As you said, it looks pretty open. We might have a nice edition this year again.

I don't think the profile tells the true story. It's definitely a very hilly and technical ITT and it should suit Alaphilippe very well.

 

[Krokro]

Interesting and wide open time trial, although I kinda think Alaphillipe will smash it.

Do you think it's hilly enough for him to fight the likes of Sanchez, Wellens, Poels, Izagirre and even Gallopin?

As you said, it looks pretty open. We might have a nice edition this year again.

I don't think the profile tells the true story. It's definitely a very hilly and technical ITT and it should suit Alaphilippe very well.

Thanks for the heads up, I don't really know how to apprehend this TT route. If it's hilly and technical as you say, then Balaphilippe could rank pretty great.
Probably not like last year but, if close, he might have a shot at a top 3. It seems like he has been improving in higher/longer hills.