2019 Giro d'Italia Stage 14: Saint Vincent-Courmayeur 131 km

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Re:

Climbing said:
Wake up people, Roglic (and the others) just weren't strong enough to stay with Carapaz uphill, end of the story.
Still, the Giro is very long and hard, anything can still happen.
Indeed. But certainly not to the point of losing almost two minutes.
 
Re: Re:

Lequack said:
MrRoboto said:
gatete said:
Dazed and Confused said:
Very smart racing by Roglic today.
In general a fairly good stage to watch.
The thing I don’t get is that according to ESPN Latin America, Roglic got directly to the podium to get his pink jersey, wasn’t he aware he lost the chance? Has someone else confirm this?
That is hilarious if true. Might explain some things.
Maybe noone told him Carapaz was off the front and he forgot. :)

Well in any case if Carapaz manages to win this, they basically gifted him almost 2 minutes, and on the flat and slightly uphill where a group of riders have a huge advantage. Even the struggling Yates went past everyone. It's like no one wants to win this Giro. Very strange riding from Nibali, Roglic, MAL and Majka, Landa was never going to chase obviously.
The final season of the Giro d'Italia

Written by: David Benioff and D.W. Weiss
 
Re: Re:

Asero831 said:
Climbing said:
Wake up people, Roglic (and the others) just weren't strong enough to stay with Carapaz uphill, end of the story.
Still, the Giro is very long and hard, anything can still happen.
Indeed. But certainly not to the point of losing almost two minutes.
Yeah I don't buy that. They went super slow, even Yates, Dombrowski and others were able to join and go past. All they had to do was just cooperate for literally 10 kilometers, but they couldn't, or their DS were telling them on the radio to not cooperate, in which case it's the team's fault.
 
Re:

Climbing said:
Wake up people, Roglic (and the others) just weren't strong enough to stay with Carapaz uphill, end of the story.
Still, the Giro is very long and hard, anything can still happen.
No question that Carapaz was the strongest today, but you still can't look at how the Roglic group was going up the final climb and say they were flat out. Clearly Roglic and Nibali were aware that any work they did themselves was playing into the other's hands, but also helping out Landa who was along for the ride.
 
Great display by little Carapaz. If he keeps this shape after the rest day, there's a real chance he might end up winning this Giro d'Italia! Nibali won't win Roglic the pink jersey so the Slovenian needs to control Carapaz himself if he wants to reel him back in in the final TT. That said, Carapaz' last race against the clock was surprisingly good actually. We're in for a true fight for pink now. Who would've thought that just 6 days ago!
 
Nibali lost only 7 seconds today to the real leader of the race. Roglič on the other hand lost more than 2 minutes compared to his closest GC opponent...
Nibali is racing to win, he can't win unless he can gain massive time on Roglič. Roglič on the other hand went from the clear favorite to the second one. He needs to race to win too, so far he's not doing it. He's racing to beat Nibali.
 
Chapeau Carapaz & Movistar - played it right. Good riding too by Sivakov, Dombrowski & Caruso (nibs owes him for today). Yates returns! Or was it the others stalled?

Roglic can still wheel suck until the last stage (unless he's really empty then) so Nibs & others need to gain some time.
 
Re: Re:

Dazed and Confused said:
Asero831 said:
Climbing said:
Wake up people, Roglic (and the others) just weren't strong enough to stay with Carapaz uphill, end of the story.
Still, the Giro is very long and hard, anything can still happen.
Indeed. But certainly not to the point of losing almost two minutes.
This is correct.
So who benefited the most in the chase group?`

Easy answer: Roglic.
I don't think there were any winners in the chase group, unless you coun't not having to wear pink an advantage, but Roglic couldn't have known he'd lose exactly the required amount of time to lose it.

DenisMenchov said:
Nibali lost only 7 seconds today to the real leader of the race. Roglič on the other hand lost more than 2 minutes compared to his closest GC opponent...
Nibali is racing to win, he can't win unless he can gain massive time on Roglič. Roglič on the other hand went from the clear favorite to the second one. He needs to race to win too, so far he's not doing it. He's racing to beat Nibali.
I don't know, seems to me that everybody lost 2 minutes on Carapaz.
 
Re:

Climbing said:
Wake up people, Roglic (and the others) just weren't strong enough to stay with Carapaz uphill, end of the story.
Still, the Giro is very long and hard, anything can still happen.
Do you believe that Roglic, Nibali, Landa and Lopez are not collectively strong enough to hold off Dombrowski?

They didn't race for time, they didn't attempt to keep him on a tight leash time-wise.
 
Re: Re:

Dazed and Confused said:
Asero831 said:
Climbing said:
Wake up people, Roglic (and the others) just weren't strong enough to stay with Carapaz uphill, end of the story.
Still, the Giro is very long and hard, anything can still happen.
Indeed. But certainly not to the point of losing almost two minutes.
This is correct.
So who benefited the most in the chase group?`

Easy answer: Roglic
.
Yup. The first 160kms tomorrow are flat, and it's now Movistar's job to ride on the front for that.

Roglic doesn't need to gain time on anybody, he has a TT for that.
 
Re: Re:

Leinster said:
Dazed and Confused said:
Asero831 said:
Climbing said:
Wake up people, Roglic (and the others) just weren't strong enough to stay with Carapaz uphill, end of the story.
Still, the Giro is very long and hard, anything can still happen.
Indeed. But certainly not to the point of losing almost two minutes.
This is correct.
So who benefited the most in the chase group?`

Easy answer: Roglic
.
Yup. The first 160kms tomorrow are flat, and it's now Movistar's job to ride on the front for that.

Roglic doesn't need to gain time on anybody, he has a TT for that.
The first 160km were a problem for nobody. Just let the rigth break go and give them 20 minutes no problem.
 
Re: Re:

Lequack said:
Asero831 said:
Climbing said:
Wake up people, Roglic (and the others) just weren't strong enough to stay with Carapaz uphill, end of the story.
Still, the Giro is very long and hard, anything can still happen.
Indeed. But certainly not to the point of losing almost two minutes.
Yeah I don't buy that. They went super slow, even Yates, Dombrowski and others were able to join and go past. All they had to do was just cooperate for literally 10 kilometers, but they couldn't, or their DS were telling them on the radio to not cooperate, in which case it's the team's fault.
Why would you cooperate with the virtual pink? You play mind games and force him to do the work.
Roglic is not buying it so Caruso did most work. That's how cycling works.

Roglic is a smart rider, he knows that Carapaz is not a decent TT and he will not be bullied by Nibali.

I do not get why Roglic is considered second favorite now. He is still clearly the favorite.

In 2017, Dumuolin is almost a minute down on Quintana going into the final TT and went on to gain 90 seconds on him.
 
I actually think this is a positive outcome from Roglic's point of view. Ok it'd be better if he had lost no time to Carapaz. But he has still more than 2min on Nibali and more than 3min on Landa if you count the final ITT. Also Colle San Carlo was in my opinion the least suited climb for him in this Giro apart from the Mortirolo. On top of that Carapaz has the maglia rosa but is only 7s ahead. He still needs almost a minute more.

Movistar is in the lead and with how strong Carapaz is they'll probably defend the jersey in a more traditional way. So no more half the team in the break but a more controled race with a strong team.

I'm really curious to see what happens tomorrow. Nibali's going to try for sure. He needs time. Will Carapaz be this strong again and gain more time on everybody? He's been mightilly impressive. If he doesn't fade, the rest are fighting for 2nd place. But the Giro is unpredictible and anything can happen. What is more or less clear is that the winner should be out of those four riders, Nibali, Roglic, Landa or Carapaz. The others aren't strong enough or consistent enough to be a serious threat.
 
Re:

johnymax said:
I actually think this is a positive outcome from Roglic's point of view. Ok it'd be better if he had lost no time to Carapaz. But he has still more than 2min on Nibali and more than 3min on Landa if you count the final ITT. Also Colle San Carlo was in my opinion the least suited climb for him in this Giro apart from the Mortirolo. On top of that Carapaz has the maglia rosa but is only 7s ahead. He still needs almost a minute more.

Movistar is in the lead and with how strong Carapaz is they'll probably defend the jersey in a more traditional way. So no more half the team in the break but a more controled race with a strong team.

I'm really curious to see what happens tomorrow. Nibali's going to try for sure. He needs time. Will Carapaz be this strong again and gain more time on everybody? He's been mightilly impressive. If he doesn't fade, the rest are fighting for 2nd place. But the Giro is unpredictible and anything can happen. What is more or less clear is that the winner should be out of those four riders, Nibali, Roglic, Landa or Carapaz. The others aren't strong enough or consistent enough to be a serious threat.
What makes you think that?

It was clear that Carapaz is the best climber at the moment and surely he is going to attack again when the terrain gets tough enough. Roglic' hope may be that Carapaz burns out from attacking like Yates did last year. The scenario of Carapaz-Roglic is not that different from last year's duel between Tom D and Yates where Yates tried to secure as much time before the ITT as possible.

And let's not forget Nibali who might do a Froome and turn things around when everybody expects it to be Carapaz against Roglic.
 
Re: Re:

Leinster said:
Dazed and Confused said:
Asero831 said:
Climbing said:
Wake up people, Roglic (and the others) just weren't strong enough to stay with Carapaz uphill, end of the story.
Still, the Giro is very long and hard, anything can still happen.
Indeed. But certainly not to the point of losing almost two minutes.
This is correct.
So who benefited the most in the chase group?`

Easy answer: Roglic
.
Yup. The first 160kms tomorrow are flat, and it's now Movistar's job to ride on the front for that.

Roglic doesn't need to gain time on anybody, he has a TT for that.
How the hell did Roglic benefited from losing 2 minutes to a guy who climbs better than him, has a team 10 times stronger than his, there are still 4 mountain stages left and a short ITT with a climb the middle?
 
Re: 2019 Giro d'Italia Stage 14: Saint Vincent-Courmayeur 13

I get that not everybody sees carapaz as the favorite but how you can argue today went well for Roglic is beyond me. He basically went from "outstanding favorite, nobody except maybe Nibali can beat him" to "not even in pink and behind a seemingly stronger climber" in two days. How on earth is that good?
 
So Carapaz is 2 minutes faster than Caruso. Nibali wants to tire out Roglic rather than risk the big attack needed to drop him. It looks like Roglic is tiring a little bit though not enough yet. There's still time. I expect Nibali to win the stage tomorrow. Great race.
 

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