Giro d'Italia 2023 Giro d’Italia, Stage 20: Tarvisio- Monte Lussari, 18.6km MTT

[Red Rick]

Disagree. It was pretty bad, borderline terrible. He was the best climber and time trialist on paper that year, and stage like that is really his specialty.

On paper he was. He did 3 ITTs in 2020 and none of them were great. I don't really know why.

I think he just overextended himself on the flat once Pogacars intermediates came in and that's why he collapsed on the final climb.

Would've been nice if Dumo had done a bike switch so he'd make a better comparison for the final climb cause he was in the same time as Pog just before the climb.

 

[JosefK]

Thomas to win the stage and Giro. Almeida + 30 seconds. Roglic + 1 minute, 15 seconds.

I've never been so happy to have been so wrong. I thought Primoz rode a courageous stage 19, was completely at the limit, and gave everything just for 3 seconds on a comfortable-looking Thomas, who easily covered Rog's attack in the final part of the climb. But, as another poster noted, Rog's progression this week has been up, up, up. He nearly lost the Giro on Tuesday (saved by Kuss), then battled even with G, then squeaked out 3 seconds on G yesterday. Today? OMG. I had to watch on replay -- couldn't bear to watch live. The expletives I uttered on the chain-drop. Glad no one else was in the room with me. Considering all the beatings he's taken just in this tour (nevermind all the adversity in the past) and the emotional weight he must have been carrying, I think today was the greatest ride of his career.

 

[Armchair cyclist]

I hope, and assume from the fact that I heard nothing to the contrary, that the Slovenian fans were sporting enough and did nothing to hinder Thomas. I'll assume they didn't necessarily wish him well, but it would have been horrible if foul intervention had been a determining factor in the race. It would only have taken one drunk nutter...

 

[jsem94]

This was actually quite exciting. At least not a foregone conclusion, so we had some excitement this Giro. Still the worst GT I've seen (watched them all since the 06' Tour).

 

[Devil's Elbow]

Yes hopefully this Giro doesn't get retconned like the Tour 2020 because of the exciting finish.

That was a crap race as well, heard Lance Armstrong calling it the best race of all time, proving the guy doesn't watch or know anything about cycling.

Tour 2020, while less than stellar, was far better than this. While the mountain stages underwhelmed, the green jersey battle produced many interesting stages. Stage 7 that year, with Bora dropping all the sprinters in the first 5 kilometres, an endless furious chase, then a final hour of echelon action that saw Pogacar dropped, puts any stage this year to shame.

 

[Andy schleck]

Predictable victory for roglic. Pure w/kg, he is better than thomas and almeida.

 

[Bolder]

I could write a more beautiful script than this 1/10 race.

I don't think Roglic would agree with your rating, although I might.

This was actually quite exciting. At least not a foregone conclusion, so we had some excitement this Giro. Still the worst GT I've seen (watched them all since the 06' Tour).

Weird how boring a GT that came down to the final TT was. I honestly didn't find a single compelling stage, except maybe when Remco was dropped. But when we learned the likely reason, even that was anticlimactic.

 

[jmdirt]

Congrats PR!
Solid performances by GT and JA too!

RE: single ring (1X): if 1X is to blame, how is it that it works well on mountain bikes? IMO, it was a derailleur issue (limit screw, cage tension/chain length...).

 

[Tim Cahill]

Tour 2020, while less than stellar, was far better than this. While the mountain stages underwhelmed, the green jersey battle produced many interesting stages. Stage 7 that year, with Bora dropping all the sprinters in the first 5 kilometres, an endless furious chase, then a final hour of echelon action that saw Pogacar dropped, puts any stage this year to shame.

Yes in the same vein I would say that the breakaway battles in this race were excellent and in 2020, watching them try and drop Bennett for Sagan, not just on stage 7 IIRC was very enjoyable too. A major issue in the mountain stages was that nobody perceived Pogacar as a threat, so when he did attack on Peyresourde, win sprints or lose ground in the echelons/Loze, it didn't really add anything to the suspense at the time. It just looked like a promising young talent who can win a GT in a year or two. If you watch the race back with hindsight that he was the real danger it looks like a more interesting battle than it was until the last stage.

 

[Pinot's goat]

Yes in the same vein I would say that the breakaway battles in this race were excellent and in 2020, watching them try and drop Bennett for Sagan, not just on stage 7 IIRC was very enjoyable too. A major issue in the mountain stages was that nobody perceived Pogacar as a threat, so when he did attack on Peyresourde, win sprints or lose ground in the echelons/Loze, it didn't really add anything to the suspense at the time. It just looked like a promising young talent who can win a GT in a year or two. If you watch the race back with hindsight that he was the real danger it looks like a more interesting battle than it was until the last stage.

A lot of people were tipping Pogacar to win pre race and most thought he would podium. Jumbo Visma were the weird ones who thought otherwise according to their topics.

 

[wheresmybrakes]

Gutted for Thomas, but really happy for Roglic. Great Giro for Almeida. Pinot, bravo for winning the KOM. This race got so much more interesting after stage 9, and a lot less pages to read through.

 

[Red Rick]

Tour 2020, while less than stellar, was far better than this. While the mountain stages underwhelmed, the green jersey battle produced many interesting stages. Stage 7 that year, with Bora dropping all the sprinters in the first 5 kilometres, an endless furious chase, then a final hour of echelon action that saw Pogacar dropped, puts any stage this year to shame.

Pyrenees were unexpectedly good in 2020. I think only Lusette and Grand Colombier were really disappointing mountain stages that year, except maybe if you had insane expectations of stage 2.

 

[IndurainsTdF1994]

The demons will be excised!

(I will reveal after the stage whose demons.)

Sepp Kuss and TT top 10s. I feel I am forgetting someone else...

 

[Purito1991]

This grand tour was not great. But there were equally bad or worse gts. Tour 2012,2016,2017 for example. And the giro in the last 10 years was most of the time the least interesting grand tour.

 

[tobydawq]

This grand tour was not great. But there were equally bad or worse gts. Tour 2012,2016,2017 for example. And the giro in the last 10 years was most of the time the least interesting grand tour.

*5 years.

In 2015-2018, the Giro was great.

 

[Purito1991]

*5 years.

In 2015-2018, the Giro was great.

Ok, you are right. But that because of nibali and contador.

 

[tobydawq]

Ok, you are right. But that because of nibali and contador.

Not in 2018... That race, Froome was the hero.

 

[Purito1991]

Not in 2018... That race, Froome was the hero.

Ok, im wrong. That year wasnt bad either. But the problem with the giro is that the route is always extremly backloaded and the sprintfield ist weaker than in the tour and the excitment in the firts stages is just not there.

 

[Mayomaniac]

Honestly, can't hate on Roglic winning a GT by winning the final TT after 2020.
Also, he has now won the last 3 gts that he finished, not bad at all.

Zana beating Dunbar in the ITT, they need to promote him to superdomestique for Simon Yates. Yesterday and on Bondone he actually asked Dunbar if he should do a hard acceleration to prepar an attack from the later, but both times Dunbar was already suffering.

 

[Netserk]

*5 years.

In 2015-2018, the Giro was great.

2019-2021 was quite decent as well.

 

[tobydawq]

2019-2021 was quite decent as well.

4 great editions
3 decent editions
2 poor editions

One can only shudder at the prospect of what will happen in 2024.

 

[Purito1991]

I think this win take away lot of pressure from roglic. Now its just about having fun for the rest of the season.
Just look at the wins from this year. Tirreno addriatico, volta a catalonia, giro d italia.
Thats just incredible after all these setbacks.

 

[Purito1991]

I thinl in next years it will be even harder for the giro because the great riders of these generation will be focusing on the tour. Pogacar, vingegard, evenepoel, van der poel, van aert,. I dont think that they will ride the the giro as much as nibali and contador for example.
Maybe roglic and the other oldstars.
But maybe im totaly wrong.

 

[Blanco]

Vuelta showdown with Remco would be fun. To put the boy at his place...

 

[Red Rick]

Feels like winning the Giro would make it much more likely Roglic will do the Tour as well.

I wonder in hindsight how much Roglic and Jumbo had been banking on this ITT. In the previous 2 days Roglic seemed reluctant to fully commit to his attacks, and when he winded up his sprint at the end of Tre Cime it didn't look to me like Thomas blew up but Roglic just let himself get dropped before launching an actual sprint in the final 150m.

I had also been overanalysing some past ITTs and I noticed Thomas' TTs basically seemed the better the flatter it was, including some ITTs like last Tour's ITT where his split in the hilly part was the worst part.

Maybe there's something about day to day recovery or fatigue but in a weird way fresh efforts just do seem to have bigger gaps sometimes. Or maybe in general unipuerto MTFs are better predictors for an MTT like this than a queen stage.

I don't think you can claim Thomas choked this. He obviously rode to hold pink against Roglic' time splits and he couldn't have predicted Roglic would get a mechanical. So while his pacing was suboptimal he would have lost either way