2024 Tour de France CQ Game

[Armchair Cyclist]

You clearly spent the rest day onboard your team bus parked on some remote alpine road, receiving some shady injections while a French guy on a motorcycle was speeding off in the distance!

My moderator instructions don't tell me how to deal with accusing a poster of doping in a fantasy manager game. Do we need a CQ Clinic section?

 

[Kazistuta]

Thanks for hosting yet again, AC! Finally I managed something in a CQ GT game, as I usually suck at these. Had Roglic prevailed, I might even have had a shot at the yellow? (Nah, who am I kidding?😄)

 

[RedheadDane]

My moderator instructions don't tell me how to deal with accusing a poster of doping in a fantasy manager game. Do we need a CQ Clinic section?

There's always this thread...

Page 31 - State of the forum 2024

Page 31 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.

forum.cyclingnews.com

 

[hfgon1]

Thanks for organizing this and also thanks for all the congratulations.

Very surprising for me to win this as I think this is my first Grand Tour in that I fully participate and as I still havent fully understood the point system because I'm too lazy to deal with

Also surprising as I'm not very well placed in all the other competitions and as Sam Bennett was nearly a no-show and quite expensive. While submitting my team I wrote that I think a team build around Vingegaard, Roglic or Evenepoel will win but that I want to cheer for some different guys. Worked out well I think

Now Pogacar will be the role model for me. If he can win the double, it should be possible for me also. But not sure I'm as great as he is...

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

Thanks for organizing this and also thanks for all the congratulations.

Very surprising for me to win this as I think this is my first Grand Tour in that I fully participate and as I still havent fully understood the point system because I'm too lazy to deal with

Also surprising as I'm not very well placed in all the other competitions and as Sam Bennett was nearly a no-show and quite expensive. While submitting my team I wrote that I think a team build around Vingegaard, Roglic or Evenepoel will win but that I want to cheer for some different guys. Worked out well I think

Now Pogacar will be the role model for me. If he can win the double, it should be possible for me also. But not sure I'm as great as he is...

It's always interesting to see the balance of points between those teams that go all in on one rider, and those that get a balance of top ten types. Yellow Knight nearly pulled off a win for those with the former mindset: either can work.

It shows the unpredictable nature of the sport that a team can get away with one pick, like Bennett, that didn't work out at all. Perfect picking is rare indeed, but I have worked out some perfect pick teams, to follow shortly.

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

Our teams only got points because our riders did:

	cost	points	green pts	teams
POGACAR Tadej	4190​	1632​	607​	0​
VINGEGAARD HANSEN Jonas	2486​	816​	330​	2​
EVENEPOEL Remco	2119​	711​	314​	0​
GIRMAY HAILU Biniam	768​	469​	369​	0​
PHILIPSEN Jasper	2211​	435​	365​	0​
ALMEIDA Joao Pedro Gonçalves	1008​	381​	61​	3​
LANDA MEANA Mikel	805​	334​	44​	1​
CARAPAZ MONTENEGRO Richard Antonio	689​	331​	143​	9​
JORGENSON Matteo	1144​	312​	87​	10​
YATES Adam	1930​	283​	23​	0​
RODRIGUEZ CANO Carlos	1289​	270​	40​	16​
GEE Derek	354​	227​	47​	26​
YATES Simon	1122​	215​	85​	5​
VAN AERT Wout	1522​	212​	187​	0​
BUITRAGO SANCHEZ Santiago	587​	178​	18​	11​
ACKERMANN Pascal	230​	172​	152​	2​
CICCONE Giulio	436​	172​	32​	17​
DE LIE Arnaud	1556​	155​	125​	0​
BARDET Romain	807​	150​	81​	1​
MARTIN Guillaume	794​	130​	10​	0​
TURGIS Anthony	284​	130​	85​	0​
MAS NICOLAU Enric	740​	129​	50​	10​
DE PLUS Laurens	246​	125​	25​	4​
GROENEWEGEN Dylan	930​	119​	99​	0​
CAMPENAERTS Victor	209​	115​	95​	0​
GALL Felix	742​	115​	5​	12​
VAUQUELIN Kévin	629​	110​	90​	0​
KRISTOFF Alexander	858​	103​	83​	0​
CAVENDISH Mark	130​	100​	80​	28​
GAVIRIA RENDON Fernando	150​	100​	100​	5​
CRAS Steff	230​	94​	0​	7​
BAUHAUS Phil	387​	93​	93​	5​
HINDLEY Jai	755​	85​	3​	3​
ROGLIC Primoz	1732​	85​	85​	10​
KELDERMAN Wilco	339​	79​	2​	2​
ABRAHAMSEN Jonas	550​	76​	50​	0​
HEALY Ben	667​	72​	17​	3​
MEINTJES Louis	142​	72​	0​	18​
VERCHER Mattéo	29​	70​	50​	4​
VAN DEN BROEK Frank	329​	70​	50​	1​

Sometimes a rider's contribution is better represented by his RoI

	cost	points	%age	teams
VERCHER Mattéo	29​	70​	241.4​	4​
GHYS Robbe	10​	20​	200.0​	4​
CAVENDISH Mark	130​	100​	76.9​	28​
GRELLIER Fabien	26​	20​	76.9​	4​
ACKERMANN Pascal	230​	172​	74.8​	2​
GAVIRIA RENDON Fernando	150​	100​	66.7​	5​
GEE Derek	354​	227​	64.1​	26​
RUSSO Clément	40​	25​	62.5​	1​
GIRMAY HAILU Biniam	768​	469​	61.1​	0​
ARNDT Nikias	61​	35​	57.4​	1​
DRIZNERS Jarrad	36​	20​	55.6​	2​
CAMPENAERTS Victor	209​	115​	55.0​	0​
DE PLUS Laurens	246​	125​	50.8​	4​
MEINTJES Louis	142​	72​	50.7​	18​
CARAPAZ MONTENEGRO Richard Antonio	689​	331​	48.0​	9​
TURGIS Anthony	284​	130​	45.8​	0​
GRIGNARD Sébastien	45​	20​	44.4​	1​
BALLERINI Davide	52​	23​	44.2​	6​
VERONA QUINTANILLA Carlos	140​	61​	43.6​	0​
LANDA MEANA Mikel	805​	334​	41.5​	1​
CRAS Steff	230​	94​	40.9​	7​
ROMO OLIVER Javier	171​	68​	39.8​	0​
CICCONE Giulio	436​	172​	39.4​	17​
POGACAR Tadej	4190​	1632​	38.9​	0​
GIBBONS Ryan	87​	33​	37.9​	1​
ALMEIDA Joao Pedro Gonçalves	1008​	381​	37.8​	3​
BERNARD Julien	183​	65​	35.5​	0​
EVENEPOEL Remco	2119​	711​	33.6​	0​

Top riders in the top teams

Hfgon1	1473​	Almeida, Carapaz, Gee, Buitrago, Ciccone, Cavendish​
Yellow_Knight	1427​	Vingegaard, Gee, Ciccone, Cavendish, Meintjes​
Leadbelly	1390​	Carapaz, Jorgenson, Gee, Ciccone,De Plus Cavendish, Meintjes​
Del1962	1252​	Carapaz, Jorgenson, Yates S, Ciccone, Cavendish, Meintjes​
LosBrolin	1228​	Jorgenson, Rodriguez, Gee, Mas, De Plus, Meintjes, Vercher​

It's not just the top riders that determine a team's success: if Yellow Knight had gone for Vercher rather than Morkov as his cheapest pick, that would have been enough to take the win.


Same for Green points

1​	Kazistuta	685​	Ackermann, Carapaz, Gaviria, Bauhaus, Roglic, Cavendish
2​	Yellow_Knight	489​	Vingegaard, Cavendish
3​	Queen_Stagiaire	437​	Carapaz, Roglic, Cavendish, Van den Broek
4​	Del1962	430​	Carapaz, Jorgenson, Yates S, Cavendish
5​	Hfgon1	418​	Carapaz, Cavendish, Almeida

Best possible team
It was possible to beat, within the budget, the cheapest team that could be built around Pogacar

GIRMAY HAILU Biniam	768​	469​
ALMEIDA Joao Pedro Gonçalves	1008​	381​
LANDA MEANA Mikel	805​	334​
CARAPAZ MONTENEGRO Richard Antonio	689​	331​
GEE Derek	354​	227​
ACKERMANN Pascal	230​	172​
CAVENDISH Mark	130​	100​
GHYS Robbe	10​	20​
	3994​	2034​

And 896 points in the green classification
Hfgon's team comes in at 72.4% of the best possible: probably somewhat higher than average (as far as I remember, haven't looked it up).
A team within the 4417 necessary to accommodate Pogacar would replace Cavendish and Ghys with Turgis and De Plus, and score 2169, rather than Pog vs the World's 1807.
If the green classification had been the focus, the ideal team would have been:

GIRMAY HAILU Biniam	768​	369​
PHILIPSEN Jasper	2211​	365​
ACKERMANN Pascal	230​	152​
GAVIRIA RENDON Fernando	150​	100​
CAMPENAERTS Victor	209​	95​
TURGIS Anthony	284​	85​
CAVENDISH Mark	130​	80​
GHYS Robbe	10​	0​
	3992​	1246​

and that would have scored 1541 , and won, in the main game despite all riders being outside the top 80 in GC.

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

A couple of what ifs

If Roglic had not crashed out, to the relief of 10 teams, and had continued what seemed to have been his habit, coming in just behind Evenepoel on every stage, it would have been a rather different matter: all riders positioned 4th to 50th would take fewer points, and there would be stage points lost too to accommodate him.
Roglic teams would have been the top three and seven pf the top ten, and because Almeida would have suffered most, Yellow Knight would have overtaken Hfgon for 4th.

1​	Kazistuta	1550​
2​	Queen_Stagiaire	1479​
3​	Search	1403​
4​	Yellow_Knight	1374​
5​	Hfgon1	1347​
6​	Anderis	1340​
7​	Gotland	1327​
8​	Leadbelly	1295​
9​	Scrooll07	1291​
10​	Madrazo	1238​
11​	Lecko	1183​
12​	Del1962	1180​
13​	Armchair_Cyclist	1136​
14​	Sam6	1121​
15​	LosBrolin	1105​
16​	Salvarani	1095​
17​	Evans_is_the_Best	1049​
18​	DJW	1033​
19​	18_Valve	1031​
20​	Josedin	1019​
21​	Triley36	1003​
22​	Peixotini	1002​
23​	ZigZagWanderer	973​
24​	AmisVelo	950​
25​	JumboVismaFan	928​
26​	ArchieBoy	892​
27​	BicycleBoy	885​
28​	Googolplex	882​
29​	SamuCuenca	881​
30​	Ingsve	876​
31​	BluesInTheBottle	860​
32​	Vladimir	850​
33​	Devils_Elbow	841​
34​	Titan31	831​
35​	SlowClimber	814​
36​	Laarsland	786​
37​	DJSprtsch	714​
38​	Rufs	696​
39​	RedheadDane	189​
	Collective_Wisdom	1051​
	Pog_vs_the_World	1807​

What if there were no Pogacar? In all probability, many stages would have been ridden very differently, especially by UAE members, but if we assume that the results were the same but without him, then most of our picks would have scored a bit more, but some more so than others.
Not surprising that the two teams with Vingegaard benefit most in this scenario, with Yellow Knight putative winner by a large margin, and Salvarani appearing much higher in the table.

1​	Yellow_Knight	1951​
2​	Hfgon1	1706​
3​	Leadbelly	1598​
4​	Salvarani	1591​
5​	Del1962	1448​
6​	LosBrolin	1425​
7​	Sam6	1371​
8​	DJW	1360​
9​	18_Valve	1316​
10​	Josedin	1312​
11​	Triley36	1283​
12​	Kazistuta	1261​
13​	Peixotini	1256​
14​	Evans_is_the_Best	1252​
15​	Queen_Stagiaire	1246​
16​	AmisVelo	1200​
17​	Search	1165​
18​	Anderis	1148​
19​	Gotland	1125​
20​	ZigZagWanderer	1124​
21​	ArchieBoy	1119​
21​	Googolplex	1119​
23​	BicycleBoy	1107​
24​	JumboVismaFan	1099​
25​	Vladimir	1072​
26​	BluesInTheBottle	1061​
27​	Scrooll07	1050​
28​	Titan31	1036​
29​	Ingsve	1033​
30​	Devils_Elbow	1032​
31​	Laarsland	1011​
32​	Madrazo	994​
33​	SlowClimber	984​
34​	Armchair_Cyclist	928​
35​	Lecko	909​
36​	DJSprtsch	896​
37​	Rufs	881​
38​	SamuCuenca	586​
39​	RedheadDane	202​
	Collective_Wisdom	1350​

(not absolutely accurate: lots of 11th places have not been credited with a single point)

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

Impeccable picks

if after picking 7 riders, you had these points	the best you could have done was to pick
2486-3773	VINGEGAARD HANSEN Jonas
2119-2485	EVENEPOEL Remco
768-2118	GIRMAY HAILU Biniam
689-767	CARAPAZ MONTENEGRO Richard Antonio
354-688	GEE Derek
230-353	ACKERMANN Pascal
209-229	CAMPENAERTS Victor
130-208	CAVENDISH Mark
29-129	VERCHER Mattéo
10-28	GHYS Robbe

If you were confident in your other 7 riders, you would have been better off picking Girmay and sending in a team that cost only 2650 than picking an 8th man that would bring you closer to the full 4000 point spend. (or you might have reconsidered your earlier 7 picks)

The bottom 8 of these would have won in both yellow and green, and only cost 2419.

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

The hard luck table
As explained on rest day two, the net cost for each team of their DNF riders.

SamuCuenca	4​	2342​
Kazistuta	3​	1991​
Lecko	2​	1941​
Gotland	2​	1930​
Madrazo	2​	1930​
Armchair_Cyclist	2​	1792​
SlowClimber	4​	1773​
Anderis	2​	1697​
Scrooll07	2​	1697​
Queen_Stagiaire	1​	1647​
Search	1​	1647​
RedheadDane	4​	1114​
DJSprtsch	3​	1036​
Hfgon1	1​	540​
Titan31	1​	540​
DJW	2​	428​
Vladimir	1​	326​
Josedin	1​	294​
Peixotini	1​	294​
Laarsland	1​	283​
Triley36	1​	283​
Del1962	1​	145​
Rufs	1​	62​
18_Valve	1​	50​
Yellow_Knight	1​	41​
AmisVelo	0​	0​
ArchieBoy	0​	0​
BicycleBoy	0​	0​
BluesInTheBottle	0​	0​
Devils_Elbow	0​	0​
Evans_is_the_Best	0​	0​
Googolplex	0​	0​
Ingsve	0​	0​
JumboVismaFan	0​	0​
Leadbelly	0​	0​
LosBrolin	0​	0​
Salvarani	0​	0​
Sam6	0​	0​
ZigZagWanderer	0​	0​
Collective_Wisdom	0​	0​
Pog_vs_the_World	1​	41​

The 4 seasons table (Vuelta still to come)

		Spring Classics	Giro	Tour	Vuelta	Total	change in position during Tour
1​	Salvarani	1525​	2380​	1118​		5023​	1​
2​	BluesInTheBottle	1913​	2001​	953​		4867​	-1​
3​	DJW	1643​	1985​	1151​		4779​	2​
4​	Laarsland	1547​	2209​	866​		4622​	-1​
5​	Devils_Elbow	1652​	2018​	931​		4601​	-1​
6​	Anderis	1346​	2203​	985​		4534​	1​
7​	AmisVelo	1199​	2223​	1034​		4456​	1​
8​	SlowClimber	1592​	1964​	884​		4440​	-2​
9​	Evans_is_the_Best	1268​	2027​	1131​		4426​	1​
10​	Peixotini	1248​	2057​	1108​		4413​	-1​
11​	Queen_Stagiaire	1114​	2169​	1104​		4387​	0​
12​	Sam6	1276​	1846​	1211​		4333​	2​
13​	Leadbelly	1359​	1558​	1390​		4307​	6​
14​	Josedin	1487​	1601​	1132​		4220​	1​
15​	Search	999​	2151​	1037​		4187​	-3​
16​	Triley36	1401​	1605​	1124​		4130​	0​
17​	Scrooll07	1013​	2116​	934​		4063​	-4​
18​	Vladimir	1254​	1735​	954​		3943​	-1​
19​	Madrazo	1267​	1683​	867​		3817​	-1​
20​	DJSprtsch	1068​	1846​	786​		3700​	0​
21​	Hfgon1	922​	1184​	1473​		3579​	3​
22​	Kazistuta	508​	1838​	1147​		3493​	0​
23​	Del1962	1585​	622​	1252​		3459​	0​
24​	Rufs	1013​	1570​	782​		3365​	-3​
25​	Armchair_Cyclist	744​	1249​	768​		2761​	0​
26​	RedheadDane	583​	970​	195​		1748​	0​
	Collective_Wisdom	1510​	1997​	1181​		4688​

So that's at least 26 teams that should remember to take part in the Vuelta game (coming to a forum near you c 8th August)

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

Teams

Some teams obviously didn't get the memo about the budget limit being 4000 points, others got nowhere near it. But most of them didn't do nearly as well as most of us, especially if you disregard those that overspent

	team cost	points
UAD	11431​	2443​
TVL	7810​	1511​
SOQ	4964​	1162​
IWA	3145​	647​
IGD	4513​	620​
ADC	5384​	540​
EFE	4544​	520​
IPT	2187​	500​
MOV	3633​	465​
LTK	4451​	445​
TEN	1865​	429​
JAY	3616​	416​
TBV	4455​	409​
LTD	3895​	385​
UXM	4260​	352​
DFP	2860​	343​
DAT	3616​	298​
BOH	5407​	286​
ARK	3356​	262​
COF	3530​	259​
GFC	4528​	236​
AST	1553​	191​

If there are any other data worth extracting, they're in the Spreadsheet If it's interesting, please share it.