86th Tour de Suisse (2.UWT) // June 11th - 18th 2023

[Extinction]

My perception is that Ayuso is a monster cimber, with a climber's build, lithe and lanky. Evenepoel seems rather a compact diesel, who may have a disadvantage on multiple, high col stages against guys like him, Vingeggard and Pog in the future. But, of course, the full story is yet to be written.

 

[JosefK]

So much happening in today's queen stage. First, the Ayuso stomp. Fantastic performance and quite unexpected based on his suffering just yesterday. The other GC contenders gave good efforts. Skjelmose back in front, Ayuso just 18 seconds back, and Remco still within striking distance for the ITT. On the darker side, some apparently very bad crashes on the descent. Really hoping for the best for Sheffield and Mader. With Ayuso's mojo going up, he can't be counted out for the GC win outright. As of today, Ayuso now poised to become greatest GC rider of all time. Book it. Also, it may be possible (based on today's events) that Remco's career is not quite yet completely washed up. And, should he win the ITT by enough margin to take the GC, then we can probably safely say that he is a sure thing to be the greatest GC and classics rider of all time. Book it.

 

[Netserk]

The three Belgians were dropped near the top of the climb:

 

[Andy schleck]

The three Belgians were dropped near the top of the climb:

The belgians do not like altitude.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

I think Evenepoel's performances are quite consistent, actually. He's been pretty much the same level all race. Not great, not awful either.

Yet it apprantly says something about his natural talent.

 

[Netserk]

Evenepoel now claiming this descent was too dangerous to race. Which is absolutely stupid, because a) this descent finish has been used repeatedly in the past, and b) if this descent was too narrow, sinuous, steep or in any other way technical then we can't have descents anywhere because this road was wider and in better shape than your average HC climb. Yes, I understand emotions are high after what appears to have happened to Mäder, but simply not doing descent finishes is not the solution.

Schleck 2.0

 

[Rob5091]

Considering how bad he was yesterday, it was a big win today for Ayuso, chapeau! Today was also a good example of how a long mountain stage can be exciting.
Hope Sheffield and Mäder make it ok - does not sound good.

 

[Tim Cahill]

Condition of the descent was very good as most Swiss ones are, wide and dry roads. Sometimes terrible *** just happens, not everything has to be the fault of the organisers or the race.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Evenepoel now claiming this descent was too dangerous to race. Which is absolutely stupid, because a) this descent finish has been used repeatedly in the past, and b) if this descent was too narrow, sinuous, steep or in any other way technical then we can't have descents anywhere because this road was wider and in better shape than your average HC climb. Yes, I understand emotions are high after what appears to have happened to Mäder, but simply not doing descent finishes is not the solution.

It is not absolutely stupid because a) "I understand emotions are high after what appears to have happened to Mäder"

It is simply an emotional reaction. Pretty sure he is well aware of the fact that you can not go up a mountain without going back down, unless you make every stage a unipuerto MTF. His actual words are not that outrageous either: "One thing i think nobody was happy with, was the finish. The race ended with a dangerous descent and we've seen some crashes as well there. It would have been better to finish on the top. But well, c'est la vie".

 

[Netserk]

It is not absolutely stupid because a) "I understand emotions are high after what appears to have happened to Mäder"

It is simply an emotional reaction. Pretty sure he is well aware of the fact that you can not go up a mountain without going back down, unless you make every stage a unipuerto MTF.

When emotions are high and you are about to say something stupid, you shouldn't talk to the media. You'd be stupid to do that.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

It is not absolutely stupid because a) "I understand emotions are high after what appears to have happened to Mäder"

It is simply an emotional reaction. Pretty sure he is well aware of the fact that you can not go up a mountain without going back down, unless you make every stage a unipuerto MTF. His actual words are not that outrageous either: "One thing i think nobody was happy with, was the finish. The race ended with a dangerous descent and we've seen some crashes as well there. It would have been better to finish on the top. But well, c'est la vie".

...which is why you don't run off to do an interview at the moment when emotions are at their highest. If you can't stop yourself from letting those emotions get to you in front of the camera, whatever you say only serves to inflame things further. And, as Evenepoel has proven repeatedly in the past, he's not the kind of guy to dodge questions or refrain from saying what's on his mind.

As for his actual words... as I said previously, if this descent is too dangerous, then almost any Alpine descent is.

 

[theyoungest]

Yet it apprantly says something about his natural talent.

I think Evenepoel himself expected this climb to suit him better than the earlier ones. Apparently it didn't, and for Ayuso it certainly did. Is that such an unfair conclusion?

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

...which is why you don't run off to do an interview at the moment when emotions are at their highest. If you can't stop yourself from letting those emotions get to you in front of the camera, whatever you say only serves to inflame things further. And, as Evenepoel has proven repeatedly in the past, he's not the kind of guy to dodge questions or refrain from saying what's on his mind.

You think Evenepoel is someone who has to run around to find a camera crew or journalist to give his opinion to? The guy can't move an inch without somebody asking his opinion. He's simply honest in his responses. Whether people like it or not, whether it comes across arrogant or not, whether it is emotional or sensible or not. Let's hope he doesn't change.

 

[Extinction]

The descent was on wide, dry road, with the usual Alpine switch-backs. If something tragic happened it's because cycling is an inherently dangerous sport.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

I think Evenepoel himself expected this climb to suit him better than the earlier ones. Apparently it didn't, and for Ayuso it certainly did. Is that such an unfair conclusion?

Evenepoel himself says he felt a lot better than he did yesterday. He only had to let go his nearest rival for GC victory 300 meters from the top.

“Ik kan volgens mij redelijk tevreden zijn met wat ik vandaag heb laten zien. Het was een rit met een super lange klim, een zware dag. Mijn benen voelden zeker beter dan gisteren en de dag daarvoor.”

 

[Eddy Evenepoel]

Blick reported 15 minutes ago that Mäder was still at the accident spot and got treatment from medical personnel.
I’m not feeling good about this, I would’ve thought they would move him to the helicopter as quickly as possible.

 

[Big Doopie]

Today was also a good example of how a long mountain stage can be exciting.

agreed. the short stuff has its place (i guess) but it is a really different test and rarely ends in dramatic ways or big differences (attacks and collapses).

 

[Devil's Elbow]

You think Evenepoel is someone who has to run around to find a camera crew or journalist to give his opinion to? The guy can't move an inch without somebody asking his opinion. He's simply honest in his responses. Whether people like it or not, whether it comes across arrogant or not, whether it is emotional or sensible or not. Let's hope he doesn't change.

The 'run off' was metaphorical. It's his choice and his alone to give an interview, in this situation it would have been wiser not to do so.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

This definitely seems the kind of situation where no news is likely to be bad news...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1669368644839653376

 

[titan31]

My perception is that Ayuso is a monster cimber, with a climber's build, lithe and lanky. Evenepoel seems rather a compact diesel, who may have a disadvantage on multiple, high col stages against guys like him, Vingeggard and Pog in the future. But, of course, the full story is yet to be written.

Tbf for the TdF, lots of climbs there will suit Remco. There's probably a ton of routes there, particularly if they go heavy on TT Kms that would make him one of the favourites (Pog and Vingegaard also being strong ttists doesn't help though)

 

[titan31]

Hopefully Mader and Sheffield are ok too

 

[Extinction]

agreed. the short stuff has its place (i guess) but it is a really different test and rarely ends in drasematic ways or big differences (attacks and collapses).

Big Doppie, you seem to have something against the high mountains, which, in the 20th century, made cycling the most grueling sport in the world.

Here in Italy riding up maintains is synonomous with epic cycling.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

The 'run off' was metaphorical. It's his choice and his alone to give an interview, in this situation it would have been wiser not to do so.

I can agree to that. But there was no reason to call his opinion stupid, when it was clearly emotional and not thought through. He crashed hard himself, he could have died himself, he had to fight his way back after a horrible injury. You know this, the context is there. That will never change. You can join Netserk's juvinile Bambi train, or you can simply put the comment within the context of riders crashing and Evenepoel's own history.

 

[search]

Blick reported 15 minutes ago that Mäder was still at the accident spot and got treatment from medical personnel.
I’m not feeling good about this, I would’ve thought they would move him to the helicopter as quickly as possible.

the article seems to have been updated since. It now says that Mäder was brought to hospital by helicopter.

Gino Mäder stürzt bei Albulapass-Abfahrt schwer

Die Königsetappe der Tour de Suisse von Fiesch VS nach La Punt GR wird von zwei schweren Stürzen überschattet. Einer der involvierten Fahrer ist der Schweizer Rad-Profi Gino Mäder.

www.blick.ch

There's a short statement from Thalmann in there. Apparently both riders crashed in the same corner, and he saw them "laying far down off the road"

 

[QueenStagiaire]

This definitely seems the kind of situation where no news is likely to be bad news...

https://twitter.com/x/status/1669368644839653376

When they specify ‚bad‘, you know it‘s bad.