A psychological analysis of Alberto Contador's response

[hrotha]

It seems that in all the reported incidents of clenbuterol poisoning through eating meat, the meat that had been eaten was, specifically, the liver, where many toxins in the body accumulate.

Yes, but the problem is that's for clenbuterl poisoning, and Contador wasn't poisoned. If normal people get tiny amounts of clenbuterol, no one's going to test their meat.

Not that I believe him, mind you.

 

[Señor_Contador]

Ew on the nips! Read his links to doping and don't be upset how they may get him, he's a doper and he was caught. Don't worry though, I say may because he will walk, the rich always do and the UCI is helping him walk away from this little inconvenience. Next year he will be juiced to the gills storming up some Col.

Hey, if you call 50 picograms a positive then turn off the lights and let's get the heck out of here.

Look, I know Alberto has doped in the past, I'm not denying that. What I think is the correct course of action for WADA, and this needs to be enforced at gunpoint if need be, is to produce a solid positive on a cyclist.

50 picograms of clenbuterol is not doping. It's as simple as that. Why do you think all of a sudden the attention has turned to the plasticizers found in his blood? Because it's their only chance to bust the guy.

Does it even matter that the guy who developed the test, Jordi Segura, is ****ed mad at WADA for doing the test without his prior consent and that he has privately stated that this test may not be as precise as he previously thought?

 

[ultimobici]

Hey, if you call 50 picograms a positive then turn off the lights and let's get the heck out of here.

Look, I know Alberto has doped in the past, I'm not denying that. What I think is the correct course of action for WADA, and this needs to be enforced at gunpoint if need be, is to produce a solid positive on a cyclist.

50 picograms of clenbuterol is not doping. It's as simple as that. Why do you think all of a sudden the attention has turned to the plasticizers found in his blood? Because it's their only chance to bust the guy.

Does it even matter that the guy who developed the test, Jordi Segura, is ****ed mad at WADA for doing the test without his prior consent and that he has privately stated that this test may not be as precise as he previously thought?

Can you point out where it says that Jordi Segura is "****ed mad at WADA for doing the test without his prior consent and that he has privately stated that this test may not be as precise as he previously thought", because I can't see ot here

Developer of plasticizer test comments on Contador affair

Until recently, Dr. Jordi Segura, the head of the IOC-accredited laboratory in Barcelona, was largely unknown outside scientific circles. However, thanks to a test that he has developed to detect plasticisers within the human body, Segura has unwittingly taken centre stage in the doping affair surrounding Tour de France winner Alberto Contador.

His test is designed to detect evidence of autologous blood transfusions, and was reportedly used by the laboratory in Cologne, Germany on Contador's samples from the Tour de France.

Questioned about claims made in the New York Times and L'Equipe that Contador's levels were eight to 10 times higher than normal, Segura said, "Those reported parameters are an unequivocal indication [that a blood transfusion took place]," Segura told AS. "However, we should look at all the data and see if there are any sudden changes in the levels in the samples taken before and afterwards."

Segura said that he had no idea that his method for detecting plasticisers had been used by the laboratory in Cologne to test Contador's samples from the Tour. "Nobody has officially notified us that it has been used," Segura confirms. "I don't understand how it can be that they haven't been in contact with the people who developed the test, especially as it is being used in such high-profile case."

Segura said that although the test for di-phthalate plasticizers has yet to be formally sanctioned by the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA), the method is valid.

"It's totally good and robust, and it's one of the most important anti-doping advances in recent years because it's the only way of knowing if somebody has undergone an autologous blood transfusion," Segura explained, before outlining how the test works.

"Plastic bags have components that we call plasticizers, which retain the properties of red blood cells during storage. As these residues are also found in common items, the sample must demonstrate a very high level of detection and quantity in order to be considered positive."

Segura admitted that the test may not be legally binding, given that it has yet to be formally validated. "That would be a question for WADA," he said. "In legal terms, you may need more tests to support it, as often happens with such discoveries. But in technical terms, I can say now that it's a categorical method that is perfectly applicable."

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/segura-says-contador-plasticizer-levels-are-indicative-of-transfusion

Or is there another source that shows he has changed his mind?

 

[HoustonHammer]

Hey, if you call 50 picograms a positive then turn off the lights and let's get the heck out of here.

Look, I know Alberto has doped in the past, I'm not denying that. What I think is the correct course of action for WADA, and this needs to be enforced at gunpoint if need be, is to produce a solid positive on a cyclist.

50 picograms of clenbuterol is not doping. It's as simple as that. Why do you think all of a sudden the attention has turned to the plasticizers found in his blood? Because it's their only chance to bust the guy.

Does it even matter that the guy who developed the test, Jordi Segura, is ****ed mad at WADA for doing the test without his prior consent and that he has privately stated that this test may not be as precise as he previously thought?

I hear what you're saying, but according to both the world anti-doping code and the UCI anti-doping rules, 50pg of Clen is doping. They don't need anything else to give him a 2 year suspension.

 

[Señor_Contador]

I hear what you're saying, but according to both the world anti-doping code and the UCI anti-doping rules, 50pg of Clen is doping. They don't need anything else to give him a 2 year suspension.

Yes, but that is the problem with WADA: It doesn't even bother setting acceptable parameters with some substances.

Anyone with a decent lawyer could put these guys in a lot of trouble.

The fact of the matter is that 50 picograms of clenbuterol offer the same athletic advantage as a sip of milk. If WADA decides to criminalize a sip of milk and you guys decide to take it up the wazoo... then that's your prerogative.

It certainly isn't mine.

 

[Señor_Contador]

Can you point out where it says that Jordi Segura is "****ed mad at WADA for doing the test without his prior consent and that he has privately stated that this test may not be as precise as he previously thought", because I can't see ot here

Or is there another source that shows he has changed his mind?

Yes there is: Marca interview.

Translation:

The director of the Barcelona Anti Doping Laboratory, Jordi Segura, the scientist who developed a method to detect analogous blood transfusions and that, according to different media sources, was the one used in the Alberto Contador case, has warned that his method is definitely not conclusive.

Segura says that his method is "very good in helping to find out whether a person has received a blood transfusion or not, thus raising suspicion", but he has also said that the test has not been developed enough to be used in doping cases because it does not prove "beyond a shadow of a doubt" (meaning with 95% confidence) a doping positive.

"Food contamination or being exposed to certain environmental conditions could very well produce a similar result" (as in the Contador case).

Segura explains that the method he has developed allows, for the first time, to detect analogous transfusions through the presence of certain plastic residues found, mainly, in blood transfusion/storage bags.

Even though, as the scientists states, the method has been "published and accepted" that any person who has undergone a transfusion usually shows higher levels of plasticizers, however, it's usage in the sports world definitely needs "more research".

There's another Spanish website out there (I can't find the link) with an interview with Mr. Segura in which he basically expresses his dumbfoundness at the fact that he was notified by neither WADA nor the UCI of the implementation of his tests within the WADA anti-doping protocol.

Most likely because the Spaniard knows that the test, as applied in sports doping, is not fully developed yet, and that people carrying out these type of tests and reaching the wrong conclusions would seriously undermine his research.