AG2R withraws from Criterium due to Giro Positive

[Froome19]

The MPCC rules, to which all member teams voluntarily agree, state among other things that a team will not pull out of a World Tour event already in progress (Rule 10).

However, a team will be required to suspend itself from racing for a period of either eight days or four weeks depending on the number of violations occurring in the team within 12 or 24 months respectively. The former case applies to AG2R (Rule 10 Case #1).

The rules are only available, afaik, in French, so I translated them in a recent blog post:

http://www.mikepadgett.com/cycling/they-like-their-credibility/

Also the 3 Grand Tours aren't included in the races of which they have to suspend themselves for:

Self-suspension will begin from the first day of the next race on the World Tour calendar with the exception of the 3 Grand Tours

Makes sense as it would be unfair to suspend a team for 8 days when it would in reality be suspending them for 21

 

[L'arriviste]

Also the 3 Grand Tours aren't included in the races of which they have to suspend themselves for:



Makes sense as it would be unfair to suspend a team for 8 days when it would in reality be suspending them for 21

Yep, sorry, I forgot to mention that!

 

[Netserk]

Originally posted a week ago in the 'Sylvain Georges positive for Heptaminol'-thread:

inrng: ag2r lampre mpcc autosuspension

http://alpes.france3.fr/2013/05/16/cyclisme-l-equipe-savoyarde-ag2r-la-mondiale-pourrait-s-autoexclure-du-criterium-du-dauphine-252439.html

10 AUTO-SUSPENSION
In the event that a team member « MPCC » is facing several cases of positive or incapacity imposed on its competitors, the team agrees to temporarily suspend its activity (to implement any corrective action that it deems appropriate).

Principles of self suspension:
- All teams must be stopped
- No abandonment of the team during the World Tour events.

In the last 12 months: Two positive doping tests and / or blood tests abnormal (excluding penalties for no-show and / or information not AMA). AUTO SUSPENSION: Team 8 days from the knowledge of the second control. The car suspension begins on the 1st day of the race calendar next World Tour, with the exception of the 3 Grand Tours.

 

[Christian]

It looks to make the pressure on the riders be "hey if you or I dope we are risking our livelihood."

on other teams we know the reverse is true.

that is the intention. A smart and noble one in my opinion.

Fully agree with this. The team does not gain anything from doping, quite on the contrary, EVERYBODY loses, all the riders and sponsors receive severe damage to their goals. Respect for Lavenu for going through with it. I would have expected some sort of "yes, but..." excuse, which would then have made the entire MPCC useless (which it might be to begin with, I don't know).

It also gives a real incentive to the teams to control their riders better, at least the Georges positive could easily have been avoided it seems. But I also agree with what some has said it just punishes those who are too stupid to cover it up while other riders and teams with more possibilities in that area still profit. Then again the MPCC is unfair by default since many teams are not part of it.

And then of course there is the darkest timeline, where 7 time Tour winner Lance Armstrong is President of the United States and Greg Lemond lives in a dungeon....and Jeff Winger is missing an arm.

Community ftw! I hope next season will get better and Jeff and Annie finally hook up

 

[melkemugg]

All biggering aside. At least they are doing the right thing and does not try to get away with it.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Big Doopie wonders if Moviestar, Astana, Saxo, Katusha, etc. would do the same.

Big Doopie points out that this was a rhetorical question.

Big Doopie appreciates the further proof that as nations go things are not equal in clinicdom.

Wonder how the clinic crazies will spin this one. (Big Doopie actually doesn't care)

Shame you are so well informed on the MPCC members.

http://mpcc.unblog.fr/a-propos/les-equipes-membres-du-mpcc/

Let alone their 'rules'.

Ag2R prep for the Tour was Suisse anyway. Good to see French dont dope.

 

[Netserk]

It's not sure that they'll do Suisse, right? (the whole 8 days thing)

 

[taiwan]

Ag2R prep for the Tour was Suisse anyway. Good to see French dont dope.

Really (because I have Peraud on my CQ team)?

 

[lemoogle]

Fair question.

I think the intention is to force team members in a sense to police each other.

It looks to make the pressure on the riders be "hey if you or I dope we are risking our livelihood."

on other teams we know the reverse is true.

Feel free to disagree with the results. But that is the intention. A smart and noble one in my opinion.

I agree, one would hope that this would push teammates to control each other, and potentially report suspicious riders to team management to at least handle internally.

 

[UlleGigo]

What is going on itt?

By the way I don't think 'self-policing' would work. The riders will just become more secretive either individually or as a group. Not the other way around. At least that's how I would react if I was dependant, or at least felt dependant, upon PEDs.

The whole 'risking their career/livelihood' arguments means nothing also. Some riders wouldn't have careers without the dope. So they're actually risking their careers if they stop. Or more than that, why would a rider condemn themselves to the scrap heap for the (possible) benefit of someone else.

Not trying to be difficult. Its just that the simple truth is if the above approaches worked they would have worked already. The game hasn't changed that much that detention for everyone because of the class brat is suddenly a leveraged approach.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

It's not sure that they'll do Suisse, right? (the whole 8 days thing)

Good question, I do hope they can ride Suisse. Otherwise their prep will be due to Route du Sud, doesnt look sufficient.

Really (because I have Peraud on my CQ team)?

Yes, Peraud was always going to ride Suisse.

 

[Catwhoorg]

I applaud them for actually following through on a commitment they made.

Of course I expect the UCI will fine them or similar for actually doing the right thing.

 

[IndianCyclist]

I applaud them for actually following through on a commitment they made.

Of course I expect the UCI will fine them or similar for actually doing the right thing.

I second that. If the first team to default on the doping problem chucks the rules then there will be no MPCC. It took guts to do it.
But what i donot understand is that what is meant by "improving blood circulation". It is pretty obvious that it is some medication and not vitamins and that would come under doping most likely.

 

[L'arriviste]

I second that. If the first team to default on the doping problem chucks the rules then there will be no MPCC. It took guts to do it.
But what i donot understand is that what is meant by "improving blood circulation". It is pretty obvious that it is some medication and not vitamins and that would come under doping most likely.

Setting apart all the rather dry language of drug and chemical descriptions, the substance can be notably used to ease cramps.

 

[airstream]

Another victim of declarative non-real anti doping fight. Poor rider. Honestly I think 95% of the peloton use doping now.

 

[ElChingon]

So they sit out for 8 days and miss a couple races, book flights for Tenerife and train instead and show up in top form for le Tour, best plan ever.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

There are holes worth pointing out: the fact that it encourages team monitored doping instead of the free-for-all design which transitioned in many years ago; that the riders now get a relatively free 8 day pass without getting in competition tests

...but what is the alternative? without having a political science or philosophical discussion about authority, discipline, and punishment, besides serving extreme consequences that seek to implore behavior, what else is there?

Skepticism is only worth the potential solutions it offers.

 

[Netserk]

As alternative:
Lifetime ban on first violation UNLESS one names all suppliers etc. If so then 1-2 year ban.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

As alternative:
Lifetime ban on first violation UNLESS one names all suppliers etc. If so then 1-2 year ban.

I like that.

Stop me if I'm getting too off-topic, but how much do you value the possibility of a contaminated supplement, mishandled sample, or incomplete tell-all's?

 

[hrotha]

There are holes worth pointing out: the fact that it encourages team monitored doping instead of the free-for-all design which transitioned in many years ago; that the riders now get a relatively free 8 day pass without getting in competition tests

...but what is the alternative? without having a political science or philosophical discussion about authority, discipline, and punishment, besides serving extreme consequences that seek to implore behavior, what else is there?

Skepticism is only worth the potential solutions it offers.

Well, team-monitored doping went out of style because it was extremely risky in terms of plausible deniability and what not, and in-competition tests aren't as useful as well-timed OOC tests, so I don't see those as holes in the procedure.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Well, team-monitored doping went out of style because it was extremely risky in terms of plausible deniability and what not, and in-competition tests aren't as useful as well-timed OOC tests, so I don't see those as holes in the procedure.

I was trying to address peoples dissatisfaction with the situation:

That's the MPCC for you.

Punishment is not for doping but for not being sophisticated enough to not have anyone test positive. A team with well established doping channels and supervision for their riders is a lot safer than one which does nothing, leaving individuals to find their own way....

, and a few agreed. There was a sarcastic post about shipping off to tenerife for 8-days, and I lumped that in too. I guess that I could have said team-led doping is out of style, but this system encourages team-monitored doping.

 

[DirtyWorks]

As alternative:
Lifetime ban on first violation UNLESS one names all suppliers etc. If so then 1-2 year ban.

The real problem is what if it's a false positive? What if it really, actually was unintended? Both are real. The latter has actually happened in the U.S. with the supplement brand getting confirmation from their supplier that the production line was contaminated.

My alternative suggestion is to double the penalty for injection-delivered PED's. Which seems like nearly all of the leading edge dope.

 

[Froome19]

So they sit out for 8 days and miss a couple races, book flights for Tenerife and train instead and show up in top form for le Tour, best plan ever.

Dauphine is a very big race for a French team.

 

[Netserk]

http://inrng.com/2013/05/who-sets-the-rules-mpcc-vs-uci/

 

[LaFlorecita]

Ridiculous but I guess joining MPCC was ridiculous as well.