L'arriviste said:
Also the 3 Grand Tours aren't included in the races of which they have to suspend themselves for:
Makes sense as it would be unfair to suspend a team for 8 days when it would in reality be suspending them for 21
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Also the 3 Grand Tours aren't included in the races of which they have to suspend themselves for:
Makes sense as it would be unfair to suspend a team for 8 days when it would in reality be suspending them for 21
Originally posted a week ago in the 'Sylvain Georges positive for Heptaminol'-thread:
Netserk said:
Big Doopie said:
Fully agree with this. The team does not gain anything from doping, quite on the contrary, EVERYBODY loses, all the riders and sponsors receive severe damage to their goals. Respect for Lavenu for going through with it. I would have expected some sort of "yes, but..." excuse, which would then have made the entire MPCC useless (which it might be to begin with, I don't know).
It also gives a real incentive to the teams to control their riders better, at least the Georges positive could easily have been avoided it seems. But I also agree with what some has said it just punishes those who are too stupid to cover it up while other riders and teams with more possibilities in that area still profit. Then again the MPCC is unfair by default since many teams are not part of it.
babastooey said:
Community ftw! I hope next season will get better and Jeff and Annie finally hook up
All biggering aside. At least they are doing the right thing and does not try to get away with it.
Shame you are so well informed on the MPCC members.Big Doopie said:
http://mpcc.unblog.fr/a-propos/les-equipes-membres-du-mpcc/
Let alone their 'rules'.
Ag2R prep for the Tour was Suisse anyway. Good to see French dont dope.
Big Doopie said:
I agree, one would hope that this would push teammates to control each other, and potentially report suspicious riders to team management to at least handle internally.
What is going on itt?
By the way I don't think 'self-policing' would work. The riders will just become more secretive either individually or as a group. Not the other way around. At least that's how I would react if I was dependant, or at least felt dependant, upon PEDs.
The whole 'risking their career/livelihood' arguments means nothing also. Some riders wouldn't have careers without the dope. So they're actually risking their careers if they stop. Or more than that, why would a rider condemn themselves to the scrap heap for the (possible) benefit of someone else.
Not trying to be difficult. Its just that the simple truth is if the above approaches worked they would have worked already. The game hasn't changed that much that detention for everyone because of the class brat is suddenly a leveraged approach.
By the way I don't think 'self-policing' would work. The riders will just become more secretive either individually or as a group. Not the other way around. At least that's how I would react if I was dependant, or at least felt dependant, upon PEDs.
The whole 'risking their career/livelihood' arguments means nothing also. Some riders wouldn't have careers without the dope. So they're actually risking their careers if they stop. Or more than that, why would a rider condemn themselves to the scrap heap for the (possible) benefit of someone else.
Not trying to be difficult. Its just that the simple truth is if the above approaches worked they would have worked already. The game hasn't changed that much that detention for everyone because of the class brat is suddenly a leveraged approach.
Good question, I do hope they can ride Suisse. Otherwise their prep will be due to Route du Sud, doesnt look sufficient.Netserk said:
Yes, Peraud was always going to ride Suisse.taiwan said:
I applaud them for actually following through on a commitment they made.
Of course I expect the UCI will fine them or similar for actually doing the right thing.
Of course I expect the UCI will fine them or similar for actually doing the right thing.
Catwhoorg said:
I second that. If the first team to default on the doping problem chucks the rules then there will be no MPCC. It took guts to do it.
But what i donot understand is that what is meant by "improving blood circulation"
. It is pretty obvious that it is some medication and not vitamins and that would come under doping most likely.
IndianCyclist said:I second that. If the first team to default on the doping problem chucks the rules then there will be no MPCC. It took guts to do it.
But what i donot understand is that what is meant by "improving blood circulation"
Setting apart all the rather dry language of drug and chemical descriptions, the substance can be notably used to ease cramps.
airstream
BANNED
Another victim of declarative non-real anti doping fight. Poor rider. Honestly I think 95% of the peloton use doping now.
So they sit out for 8 days and miss a couple races, book flights for Tenerife and train instead and show up in top form for le Tour, best plan ever.
There are holes worth pointing out: the fact that it encourages team monitored doping instead of the free-for-all design which transitioned in many years ago; that the riders now get a relatively free 8 day pass without getting in competition tests
...but what is the alternative? without having a political science or philosophical discussion about authority, discipline, and punishment, besides serving extreme consequences that seek to implore behavior, what else is there?
Skepticism is only worth the potential solutions it offers.
...but what is the alternative? without having a political science or philosophical discussion about authority, discipline, and punishment, besides serving extreme consequences that seek to implore behavior, what else is there?
Skepticism is only worth the potential solutions it offers.
As alternative:
Lifetime ban on first violation UNLESS one names all suppliers etc. If so then 1-2 year ban.
Lifetime ban on first violation UNLESS one names all suppliers etc. If so then 1-2 year ban.
Netserk said:
I like that.
Stop me if I'm getting too off-topic, but how much do you value the possibility of a contaminated supplement, mishandled sample, or incomplete tell-all's?
Well, team-monitored doping went out of style because it was extremely risky in terms of plausible deniability and what not, and in-competition tests aren't as useful as well-timed OOC tests, so I don't see those as holes in the procedure.More Strides than Rides said:
hrotha said:
I was trying to address peoples dissatisfaction with the situation:
, and a few agreed. There was a sarcastic post about shipping off to tenerife for 8-days, and I lumped that in too. I guess that I could have said team-led doping is out of style, but this system encourages team-monitored doping.
Netserk said:
The real problem is what if it's a false positive? What if it really, actually was unintended? Both are real. The latter has actually happened in the U.S. with the supplement brand getting confirmation from their supplier that the production line was contaminated.
My alternative suggestion is to double the penalty for injection-delivered PED's. Which seems like nearly all of the leading edge dope.
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