Alberto Contador and ITT - World class, good or average?

[LaFlorecita]

Sigh... SiAp1984, is it really impossible for you to accept that you were wrong??
You and your "urban myths". Don't forget you were the first to mention world class. I've never said that. You're a hopeless hater..

 

[Parrulo]

so i was right. libertine showed him the results and all he did was interpret them in his own special way and getting other results ignoring factors like wind and rain

 

[spanky wanderlust]

AC's tt is totally kickass!

if you compare him to the entire world of competitive cyclists he is clearly world class.

if you compare him just to pro tour riders, he still stacks up very very well. he can hang on a flat tt up to 40k or so and if you add a hill or two he has shown that he can beat the specialists, from time to time. but there are a few that are a notch above him.

like libertine seguros said, if you narrowly define world class as the 5 or so best specialists in the world, well, ac is clearly a notch below those guys. but they are specialists and built for it, and many are not even competing for gc overall.

the simple fact is that alberto has a monster tt that he uses to close multiple gc wins. in my book that makes him world class.

btw, i really doubt whether alberto cares whether you or anyone else think he is a good tter or not, as long as those gc jerseys keep piling up.

 

[dabaideschbi]

AC is definitely world class. No doubts about it

 

[Ragerod]

If I had to pick 3 cyclists to compete against Martians on pure time-trialling ability I wouldn't pick Contador. I consider the top tier or top three, whichever is greater, in a discipline to be world class and Contador narrowly misses out.

However, if the course is up a mountain or in the third week of racing he's in the team but they are instances where climbing and recovery ability are as important as time trialling capabilities.

The reason that Contador's world class because he's lighter than time-trial specialists is one of the worst I've ever heard.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

so i was right. libertine showed him the results and all he did was interpret them in his own special way and getting other results ignoring factors like wind and rain

And he edited a couple of wins (Spanish nationals, Algarve) in long ITTs out of his article too.

 

[rides like a girl]

Hard to classify riders just by time in this area for me.

I find it hard to compare times and say that one is world class and the other isn't based solely on time. There are factors that come into play that affect final time in the ITT.

The GC placement of the riders in the overall and work done in mountains the stages prior to the ITT in the Tour are also factors that make it hard to compare ITT's just on time. If someone does no work in the stages prior to the ITT, just rides in the autobus and then busts a great ITT time, I don't think that time can be fairly compared to decide greatness to the time of someone who went all out in the mountains the stage or two before the ITT.

Another factor is was the rider going for the ITT win, or did they chose to not take risks on the course to maintain GC standing. If they chose to maintain GC standing it would make them slower on the ITT. Another reason it makes it harder to classify guys when you just compare final times

Among the GC contenders during a 3 week race, AC is world class. I don't know which other contender can gain time on him in a ITT. If you add a hill to the course, he even moves ahead of the specialists.

 

[Waterloo Sunrise]

Can we make this thread actually interesting my discussing what sort of time gap we expect on Andy this year, as well as all afirming he is world class.

The Grenoble route has a couple of punchy climbs which should suit him very well, and Wiggins put over minute in to lots of good GC TTers (Evans, Jani etc) and 2 minutes in to several others (Bobby, Jurgen).

I'm going to say, based on Andy going balls out with his gynacologist, perhaps 75 seconds, but closer to 120 wouldn't shock me.

 

[jobiwan]

The OP must not have watched Giro '11, Tour '09 (He beat Cancellara!), or many more of his races.

Contador is a world-class champion, whether you want to root for him or not.

 

[ImmaculateKadence]

The way I would explain his drastic improvement in the TTs belongs in the clinic, but consider the parcours of the TT too. Of course, he will excel in mountain TTs, but on a flat course...

 

[SiAp1984]

And he edited a couple of wins (Spanish nationals, Algarve) in long ITTs out of his article too.

I did not ignore them. The times when Spanish national championships in ITT meant anything ain an international perspective are long over, so these results are irrelevant (btw, he lost this very championships just a few days ago, right?). And I focussed on the GTs, that is true, because ACis a GT rider in the first place for me. If he takes some ITTs and smaller races in Spain seriously, be it. Most of his GT-competitors do not. I added the prologues in ACs favor, because the short ITTs - and even the very short ones - suit him without a doubt. I never said I took all of your listed results in my list. And I added some time he lost and behind whom he finished, because that's at least equally important (or unimportant) as to know which guys he beat.

Anyway, I just wanted to express with this post, that I was wrong to rate AC as bad or only average ITT rider. If this point came through, I am satisfied.

 

[SiAp1984]

The way I would explain his drastic improvement in the TTs belongs in the clinic, but consider the parcours of the TT too. Of course, he will excel in mountain TTs, but on a flat course...

That is what I used to think... but I am not so sure about this now... btw., he often did not win his mountain ITTs surprisingly (Vuelta 2008, Giro 2008).

 

[spanky wanderlust]

I did not ignore them. The times when Spanish national championships in ITT meant anything ain an international perspective are long over, so these results are irrelevant (btw, he lost this very championships just a few days ago, right?). And I focussed on the GTs, that is true, because ACis a GT rider in the first place for me. If he takes some ITTs and smaller races in Spain seriously, be it. Most of his GT-competitors do not. I added the prologues in ACs favor, because the short ITTs - and even the very short ones - suit him without a doubt. I never said I took all of your listed results in my list. And I added some time he lost and behind whom he finished, because that's at least equally important (or unimportant) as to know which guys he beat.

Anyway, I just wanted to express with this post, that I was wrong to rate AC as bad or only average ITT rider. If this point came through, I am satisfied.

have you heard the term "confirmation bias"? you should google it. dropping results from your research because they do not fit your existing beliefs is a critical mechanism of cb. you got it bad. but that's ok. so do 80% of the posters on here.

i am pleased you were able to budge your opinion a little, given the overwhelming evidence. there is hope for you.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Can we also point out that he was an excellent TTer as a junior and his first professional victory was an ITT? In fact he was originally thought of as an ITT rider who could climb a bit by Manolo Saíz.

 

[BYOP88]

@SiAp1984

If Contador wins the ITT, no one would be shocked it may have some chat in the clinic, but no where near the amount of chat if Schleck won it. If I had to pick either Contador or Schleck to ride an ITT for my life, I'd pick Contador every single time, he has in the past shown he can do a good ITT, Schelck on the other hand has only shown how much he sucks at them(oh and winning his national championship doesn't count, as I'm sure some forum members could win the Luxembourg national ITT).

 

[Scirea]

He gets into the top5-6 in virtually every ITT where he cares. How is that not world class?

 

[greenedge]

World class on top form.

 

[reyan12]

After so many TT wins(against international opponent) you dont consider AC as world class???SiAp1984..define world class?