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Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

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Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
Electress said:
I was neither super impressed nor super concerned with what I saw today from Alberto. I always felt it'd be a bit more of a slow start than I'd like, and that I would be up and down about his form until the Pyrenees. I thought he might be pretty tense today, actually, because I'm not sure it really favoured him much. I suspect Nairo in particular would have been working hard on this whereas AC hasn't.

TBH, I expected Froome to do more. I also thought it interesting that Porte was poor and G. said he 'just didn't feel it'. Think the heat and humidity played its part, as did the tailwind earlier on in proceedings.

tomorrow will be interesting. Hope no major issues. Think AC just has to settle in and feel the race legs coming back.
Good post :) those are exactly my feelings as well!

The spectre of 2013 always looms so large - my dread was some kind of catastrophic scenario, like Froome passing Contador!!

I've said before and elsewhere, but honestly, I think this is going to be a test of guts, guile and mental strength, unless AC really is hiding v. average form. I wonder if even he knows at the moment?

Regarding Froome, perhaps it's also reasonable to acknowledge that TT skills have taken a back seat to his practice this year.
 
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Re: Re:

BlurryVII said:
Miburo said:
Isn't it exciting this way? I love it, the uncertainty. Same feeling as 2011 and that was Contador's best GT, not in terms of performance but entertainment.

What? I'd rather see Contador 09' crushing the hell out of everyone rather than tired, injured Contador riding to entertain fake fans like you.

Damn, you're the kind of **** who would like to see Contador lose quite a lot of time in the 1st week so he can go on the rampage next just to entertain you.

Of course not surprised contadorfans go ad hominem when someone has a different opinion. Not the first, and fake fan is laughable, i started cheering for the guy before he was really succesful but that's not the point right? Throwing jabs with no context is most likely your trademark.

Yes i'm a fan of Contador but i'm a fan of cycling aswell. I think it's hilarious that you blame me for wanting to be entertained. Why do you watch sports? Why does anyone? For entertainment no? Isn't that the point of this?

The tour '09 wasn't promotion for cycling, the last week of the tour '11 was. I never said i want Contador to lose time though, just for my sake. But once again you don't care about context, you're an example of an irrational fan. There are many here so don't worry, you're not alone.

Contador's true worth, his true greatness is shown when he's cornered. I can explain this further on but you don't care about that, since you only want a boring tour where contador wins, and everyone crashes out. That's prob your standards for greatness. Once again no worries, you're not alone here with that mindset.
 
Anytime Bala beats Alberto in a power ITT we can assume Alberto is not at his best. Frankly an on form Alberto should have ridden up his butt by the end. Hopefully he just needs to find racing legs and doesn't have Giro depleted legs. As I said earlier he salvaged his ride on guts and class.
 
Miburo your post makes zero sense.
As a fan I would never ever ever celebrate a rider losing time simply because he can then launch some "epic" suicide attacks which are doomed to fail. Who cares about Contador showing greatness by cutting his 10 minute deficit to just 9 minutes and 30 seconds. I'd rather see him show his greatness by winning the Tour after a hard Giro.
 
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Whatever you thought his chances were before the TT; now they are less. While the sign of the change in chance is undeniable (negative), the magnitude is, of course, small.
 
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Re:

LaFlorecita said:
Miburo your post makes zero sense.
As a fan I would never ever ever celebrate a rider losing time simply because he can then launch some "epic" suicide attacks which are doomed to fail. Who cares about Contador showing greatness by cutting his 10 minute deficit to just 9 minutes and 30 seconds.

You take my comments completely out of context. When did i say i want contador to lose time?

I can't seem to find it, see what i mean with irrational contadorfans.
 
Re: Re:

Miburo said:
LaFlorecita said:
Miburo your post makes zero sense.
As a fan I would never ever ever celebrate a rider losing time simply because he can then launch some "epic" suicide attacks which are doomed to fail. Who cares about Contador showing greatness by cutting his 10 minute deficit to just 9 minutes and 30 seconds.

You take my comments completely out of context. When did i say i want contador to lose time?

I can't seem to find it, see what i mean with irrational contadorfans.
And you did the same with Blurry's comments.
 
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Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
Miburo said:
LaFlorecita said:
Miburo your post makes zero sense.
As a fan I would never ever ever celebrate a rider losing time simply because he can then launch some "epic" suicide attacks which are doomed to fail. Who cares about Contador showing greatness by cutting his 10 minute deficit to just 9 minutes and 30 seconds.

You take my comments completely out of context. When did i say i want contador to lose time?

I can't seem to find it, see what i mean with irrational contadorfans.
And you did the same with Blurry's comments.

He took my words out of context, and called me a fake fan. Seems to me like a very reasonable conclusion that he's irrational when it comes to Contador. Nothing wrong with it, to each it's own.
 
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Re: Re:

Miburo said:
BlurryVII said:
Miburo said:
Isn't it exciting this way? I love it, the uncertainty. Same feeling as 2011 and that was Contador's best GT, not in terms of performance but entertainment.

What? I'd rather see Contador 09' crushing the hell out of everyone rather than tired, injured Contador riding to entertain fake fans like you.

Damn, you're the kind of **** who would like to see Contador lose quite a lot of time in the 1st week so he can go on the rampage next just to entertain you.

Contador's true worth, his true greatness is shown when he's cornered. I can explain this further on but you don't care about that, since you only want a boring tour where contador wins, and everyone crashes out. That's prob your standards for greatness. Once again no worries, you're not alone here with that mindset.


Oh alright, I take everything out of context but you don't :eek:

Now wishing AC to win = wishing his rivals to crash out :eek:

When the *** did I even talk about his rivals here? I want a fair battle, fair and square. Not a scenario similar to 2011.

I think we've had enough of that, AC showing his greatness when cornered, it's been 5 years he hasn't won, with a all the sh,it that happened to him these last years, you're telling us you'd love to see the 2011 scenario? Are you kidding?
This guy would rather see a show and AC losing rather than AC sealing the double. Winning is what matters, nothing else. Now AC has already shown his class when he is down, now it's time win and dominate, do you understand that ?

And by the way, You've already stated you would like to see Contador lose time in the 1st week, just to see him do like he did in the Tour 11', you did that, I just wouldn't be able to find that post back.
 
Re:

SeriousSam said:
Whatever you thought his chances were before the TT; now they are less. While the sign of the change in chance is undeniable (negative), the magnitude is, of course, small.

Not at all.

As I expected Contador to have a slow start, and Froome to be somewhat better than he was today, and I believe Froome is his biggest rival, it is quite logical that (in my eyes, if clearly not yours), Alberto's chances are at least the same, if not increased by today's relative performances. It all depends upon the premise you start with.
 
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I'm sorry but i won't respond any further since i don't respond to irrational people (imo at least) on forums. Enjoy the tour though.
 
Re: Re:

Miburo said:
LaFlorecita said:
Miburo said:
LaFlorecita said:
Miburo your post makes zero sense.
As a fan I would never ever ever celebrate a rider losing time simply because he can then launch some "epic" suicide attacks which are doomed to fail. Who cares about Contador showing greatness by cutting his 10 minute deficit to just 9 minutes and 30 seconds.

You take my comments completely out of context. When did i say i want contador to lose time?

I can't seem to find it, see what i mean with irrational contadorfans.
And you did the same with Blurry's comments.

He took my words out of context, and called me a fake fan. Seems to me like a very reasonable conclusion that he's irrational when it comes to Contador. Nothing wrong with it, to each it's own.
I guess we should just forget about you saying he wants all Contador's rivals to crash out because he called you a fake fan :(
 
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Re:

cellardoor said:
Honestly, there's only one person I can imagine dropping Contador in the mountains and that's Froome. Froome has far more to worry about at this point in my opinion as he was out and out favourite to take time on his rivals today.

Froome and Quintana can drop Contador, if Contador isnt at his best.

At the Route de Sud, Quintana looked so easy following Contador. Quintana worry's me a bit, I think he might be a monster in the mountains.

Im not sure what to make of Contador's form yet. Today doesnt worry me.

how much difference between Contadors 2014 and 2015 weight?
 
Re: Re:

contador977 said:
cellardoor said:
Honestly, there's only one person I can imagine dropping Contador in the mountains and that's Froome. Froome has far more to worry about at this point in my opinion as he was out and out favourite to take time on his rivals today.

Froome and Quintana can drop Contador, if Contador isnt at his best.

At the Route de Sud, Quintana looked so easy following Contador. Quintana worry's me a bit, I think he might be a monster in the mountains.

Im not sure what to make of Contador's form yet. Today doesnt worry me.

how much difference between Contadors 2014 and 2015 weight?

I don't think I've ever seen Quintana struggle as such though - he just doesn't have much of a 'tell' IMO. Both were so slow on the RdS, watching one another, I'm not sure it is very meaningful.
 
Re: Re:

contador977 said:
cellardoor said:
Honestly, there's only one person I can imagine dropping Contador in the mountains and that's Froome. Froome has far more to worry about at this point in my opinion as he was out and out favourite to take time on his rivals today.

Froome and Quintana can drop Contador, if Contador isnt at his best.

At the Route de Sud, Quintana looked so easy following Contador. Quintana worry's me a bit, I think he might be a monster in the mountains.

Im not sure what to make of Contador's form yet. Today doesnt worry me.

how much difference between Contadors 2014 and 2015 weight?

No one can know for sure....I don't think anything official has been said about his weight. Everyone here seems to be saying he is slightly heavier now than last year.
 
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Re: Re:

LaFlorecita said:
Miburo said:
Didn't know fleur even attempts to bully people now. Doesn't understand a joke either, but once again it all fits the story.
Are you now going to pretend your claims about what Blurry "wants" (just like you always pretend to know exactly what I (will) think and want) were a joke?

The crash was an obvious hyperbole. I was using his logic at my post there. Wasn't it obvious fleur?

I'm done, there's no point to this, said my peace.

Besides he'll still win on the mur.
 
Re: Re:

Miburo said:
Besides he'll still win on the mur.


I don't think he will. I'm expecting TS to drive any echelons, mark GC on Huy, survive the cobbles and for him to settle down on stage 5, tbh.

I fully expect some drama with at least one of the GC contenders in the first week though. Gut *feelings* are that Astana might have a 'mare, for some reason. (I fully acknowledge this is not even remotely within nodding distance of a rational analysis - (and me a scientist!))
 
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Re: Re:

Electress said:
SeriousSam said:
Whatever you thought his chances were before the TT; now they are less. While the sign of the change in chance is undeniable (negative), the magnitude is, of course, small.

Not at all.

As I expected Contador to have a slow start, and Froome to be somewhat better than he was today, and I believe Froome is his biggest rival, it is quite logical that (in my eyes, if clearly not yours), Alberto's chances are at least the same, if not increased by today's relative performances. It all depends upon the premise you start with.
That's true. How you ought to change your belief about each of the Big 4's chances, given today's result, depends on what you expected to happen.

I expected Nibali to lose time to Contador and Froome and Quintana to lose a larger amount than he did. Nibali ended up gaining on all of them and Quintana lost much less than I thought. For that reason alone, I upgrade Nibali and Quintana relative to Contador and Froome. Second, other then just changes in GC, we received signals of their form today. For those, the directional effect is much the same. Q and N stronger than I thought, C and F weaker.

What were you expecting that you think AC's chances are at least as good?
 
Re: Re:

SeriousSam said:
Electress said:
SeriousSam said:
Whatever you thought his chances were before the TT; now they are less. While the sign of the change in chance is undeniable (negative), the magnitude is, of course, small.

Not at all.

As I expected Contador to have a slow start, and Froome to be somewhat better than he was today, and I believe Froome is his biggest rival, it is quite logical that (in my eyes, if clearly not yours), Alberto's chances are at least the same, if not increased by today's relative performances. It all depends upon the premise you start with.
That's true. How you ought to change your belief about each of the Big 4's chances, given today's result, depends on what you expected to happen.

I expected Nibali to lose time to Contador and Froome and Quintana to lose a larger amount than he did. Nibali ended up gaining on all of them and Quintana lost much less than I thought. For that reason alone, I upgrade Nibali and Quintana relative to Contador and Froome. Second, other then just changes in GC, we received signals of their form today. For those, the directional effect is much the same. Q and N stronger than I thought, C and F weaker.

What were you expecting that you think AC's chances are at least as good?

Contador's performance relative to Froome has to be taken into account too. His time loss was less than anticipated. To me, Quintana is the biggest winner, followed by Nibali, followed by Pinot. Contador is neutral to minor loser. Froome the biggest loser.
 
Re: Re:

Tinkoffs version of the interview with Alberto. As always almost a world of difference to the version presented by CN. Not a word about higher pulse, good sensations, basically everything:

“It was a very tough time-trial and I felt my legs quite well, I had good sensations. The race course was very, very fast. I decided to take the first half of the race at a slightly slower pace and then push hard. I got off slower but then I wasn't able to finish off strongly. All in all, I think it was a normal time-trial and all the favorites are within a few seconds of each other. We now have to focus on tomorrow”, says Alberto Contador, who adds about some of the challenges on the opening contre-la-montre.

“I don't think the wind was a factor because even if it blew strongly, it was the same for everybody. Maybe the current high temperatures make the heart beat faster but it wasn't an issue. Again, a few seconds separate the main rivals and that is, in my opinion, a good thing”.



http://www.tinkoffsaxo.com/news/contador-satisfied-with-sensations-at-grand-depart-of-tour-de-france/
 
Re: Re:

SeriousSam said:
Electress said:
SeriousSam said:
Whatever you thought his chances were before the TT; now they are less. While the sign of the change in chance is undeniable (negative), the magnitude is, of course, small.

Not at all.

As I expected Contador to have a slow start, and Froome to be somewhat better than he was today, and I believe Froome is his biggest rival, it is quite logical that (in my eyes, if clearly not yours), Alberto's chances are at least the same, if not increased by today's relative performances. It all depends upon the premise you start with.
That's true. How you ought to change your belief about each of the Big 4's chances, given today's result, depends on what you expected to happen.

I expected Nibali to lose time to Contador and Froome and Quintana to lose a larger amount than he did. Nibali ended up gaining on all of them and Quintana lost much less than I thought. For that reason alone, I upgrade Nibali and Quintana relative to Contador and Froome. Second, other then just changes in GC, we received signals of their form today. For those, the directional effect is much the same. Q and N stronger than I thought, C and F weaker.

What were you expecting that you think AC's chances are at least as good?

Never fond of the words 'ought to'.

I felt Nibali would be a little weaker than he was, but the degree to which he was better than expected was not significant to me, so in terms of underlying form…meaningless. Neither indicative of one thing or another. As it would have been had he been a little worst than I expected, although I'll acknowledge I'd have preferred it, emotionally speaking.

I believed Nairo would have been working on the TT more than his rivals, as this is a relative weakness; strong TT riders were never going to invest a lot of effort in something they were already good at with so few TT kms this year. (Indeed, Froome said this in his interview). So, Nairo was not entirely surprising for me, especially given the tailwind the earlier starters had. Which also favoured Pinot.

In short, no significant variation from expectations for me means no significant indication of form from what I anticipated, so meaningless to interpret anything about 'direction'. Insignificant is insignificant.
 
Wanted to read this thread through, it suddenly had 5+ pages extra.

1. He's been mediocre in short flat tt's since his ban, once he starts to suck at medium lenght hilly ones, I'll get worried when he sucks in the hilly ones.

2. First day, no need to say more

3. Froome was just as bad

4. How do you know the difference between bad day or bad form?