Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

[ILovecycling]

Re: Re:

Never give up Alberto. its your only Giro-Tour double attempt.VAMOS!

...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0eGkfTsP7Y

 

[Jelantik]

Re: Re:

Seriously, Contador KNOWS the wattage he has to develop to beat Froome, I read last year, De jongh and Contador knew the numbers it took to beat Froome, Contador was most likely above it when he came to the Tour 2014.

And here, he shows up in this Tour being a minute behind 3rd - 4rd tier climbers? The thing is, he hyped the Tour and the double, he was counting the days on twitter and instagram those hashtags all over the place exactly when he was in la Sierra Nevada. I seriously thought everything was going well, to plan.

Turns out De Jongh and Alberto don't know what they're doing, they must've realised he didn't have it, that's for sure. So did they hope for a miracle, or did they suddenly forget Froome's value?

I understand the plan was probably peaking for the 3rd week but for that you have to be GOOD at a bare minimum right now. Now he is just SO far off his peak, it's just impossible to get anything from this Tour, he ain't gaining 20 % power in performance in just a few days or else he goes down Lance route.

If I was his coach, I'd tell him to leave this Tour right away, rest, go on a SERIOUS altitude training camp, and win the Vuelta. Instead, he'll keep up and get dropped day after day just to say he didn't give up.

This is my point. I mean we're not (unfortunately) in the age of romantic cycling anymore, even if Contador did put some of the romance back into it (and precisely for going for the double). Swashbuckling audacity, however, evidently doesn't cut it anymore. And Sky has just made Team Oleg look like a bunch of amateurs. I mean Porte road ahead of Quintana today (who has only prepared for the Tour)! No, what's needed is a 1000% committment to a plan and as you say realizing the actual strenght of your biggest rival.

Again, as you say, it's as if Contador and co. didn't take seriously enough just what kind of form he needs to bring in to beat Froome. This is what peeves me. I mean it's like what the f where they thinking?

guys, guys.. you are judging him too harshly. I'm sure they got all the information of what wattage etc, diet etc. you name it. But the point is when did the last time someone attempt the double in modern cycling? So there's no blue print yet. They have prepared all they can, and anticipate all they can, recovery, light training, intensity, diet etc, but who can actually predict how his body is going to react? Timing some one to peak isn't an exact science either. It depends in some many variables. At this point, maybe the experiment hasn't gone as what they expected. No one expect a hard 4 days in the beginning. Maybe that's cost AC to ease in to the race. I'm not blind either with what transpire. But suggesting that he isn't trying to get the shape and let himself to get rolled under the sky bus, I don't think he wants that too. He is too proud for that. Imagine yourself in his shoes, even if you know your number wasn't there (due to all kinds of factors Giro, recovery, body reaction etc), do you just decide that .. ow well, I will withdraw from the Tour because there's no way I can win it. I guess, you probably will say.. I did my best to recover, we'll see what happen. And we just saw today what happen. I would give Contador and de jongh a credit. It's a tough formula to crack. But Contador isn't the person who will break that formula unfortunately at the moment.

Unlike some, I disagree with the idea of leaving the race. Some one like Contador only leaves the race when he couldn't pedal anymore. Not because he was distanced or humiliated by getting dropped with some many 3-4 tier climber. Unless he is in exhaustion or fatigue to the point he is just immobilize, then yeah please leave the race. As long as he is just being dropped and he still can pedal.. stay in the race. I'm sure he doesn't want his last couple years before his retirement, what people remember is Contador leaves the race because he got dropped all the time. That's not a story he wants to leave us with. (at least I don't). If he looses.. then looses like a man. Take it by the chin. No matter how painful it is for us to watch. If he is citing fatigue, exhaustion or crashed then.. by all mean.. leave the race and rest.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Never give up Alberto. its your only Giro-Tour double attempt.VAMOS!

...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0eGkfTsP7Y

He only needed a few seconds on him though

 

[BlurryVII]

There you go, when I say all the others are always in horrific form when Froome is peaking. People never put things in perspective.

"@faustocoppi60 Superior performances to that of Froome today: Nibali-Hautacam 2014, Contador-Farrapona 2014. What happened? Can they bounce back? "

 

[ILovecycling]

Re: Re:

Never give up Alberto. its your only Giro-Tour double attempt.VAMOS!

...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0eGkfTsP7Y

He only needed a few seconds on him though

It was just to cheer you up Flo

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

There you go, when I say all the others are always in horrific form when Froome is peaking. People never put things in perspective.

"@faustocoppi60 Superior performances to that of Froome today: Nibali-Hautacam 2014, Contador-Farrapona 2014. What happened? Can they bounce back? "

To be honest I don't trust jens on this.
I do not and will not believe that everyone, literally everyone that could have challenged Froome, is in bad shape. I refuse to believe it.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

It was just to cheer you up Flo

Dauphiné 2014 makes me sad.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

Even in route du sud, he was decent actually, out of the saddle, not full out and such. Which makes me think his form is actually sinking.

I don't know what the hell he has done since then, taking it easy in Livigno all the way to Route du sud was a good choice IMO, he obviously needed to rest.
But from that point, De Jongh and Alberto completely lost their gamble by playing the recovery card all the way to the Tour, it was too much, you can see he's all messed up since the start of the Tour while he was looking relatively good in Route du sud.

He should've worked he ass off from the momentum that race gave him, with some intense training. They just let off wayyy too much, at his age it's not good. He needs intense training to keep himself in form.

If it was stilll young AC, he would probably be able to be good without training too much but it doesn't work here. His body is gonna take forever before getting back up in form.

Yes, something is obviously wrong. But it's no use speculating about it. It is what it is. Hopefully he'll be able to bounce back next year (although I truly believe he should do Giro-Vuelta)

 

[dacooley]

lads, i think some of you gotta be more generous to your rider. bertie gave everything to come to the tour with the best possible form. but you never know for sure how your body reacts until first mountain battle. even such a legend like contador cannot reach peak conditions every year whilst only absolute peak allowed to have a real shot for the double. one year you have it, the next year you may not. that's a very brutal sport. after stages like that imo first of all we should thank alberto for the emotions he's given away for years. The double would be a fantastic achievement, and it's pity we won't be witnesses of this story but life goes on. if i were ac, i'd choose to quit after winning the 2016 tour. he'll be focusing on the tour next year, beyond doubt.

 

[Matteo.]

To the next days , i hope to see a remake of Alpe 2011. All alone in the last 100km of the stage . It will be great !

 

[BlurryVII]

Re: Re:

There you go, when I say all the others are always in horrific form when Froome is peaking. People never put things in perspective.

"@faustocoppi60 Superior performances to that of Froome today: Nibali-Hautacam 2014, Contador-Farrapona 2014. What happened? Can they bounce back? "

To be honest I don't trust jens on this.
I do not and will not believe that everyone, literally everyone that could have challenged Froome, is in bad shape. I refuse to believe it.

It's the truth though, the numbers in w/kg were higher, the duration of the effort a bit lower but they definetely could compete with this Froome. Contador from the Vuelta could be able to drop him.

I'm not talking about everyone, Quintana seems to be more or less at his level, he has never been significantly better than this in his career.
Same goes to Valverde and Porte.

Van Garderen was sub par, but Contador and Nibali? They are miles from what they can achieve.

 

[LaFlorecita]

For those of you who believe he should ride the Tour next year.
What if he doesn't win? What if he never reaches top shape, is beaten by Froome and Quintana, or crashes, or gets ill?
Should he then continue to go for the Tour until he wins or until his body falls apart from age?
Or should he then decide to ride the Giro in 2017?

My point is, it will be very hard for him to win the Tour next year, and in my opinion not very likely. None of us want to see him retire after being defeated. So why not try to win the Giro one last time and finish his career in his home GT?
He could throw in the Olympics Road Race just for *** and giggles.

 

[ILovecycling]

Re: Re:

It was just to cheer you up Flo

Dauphiné 2014 makes me sad.

then it was a bad try I guess

 

[Poursuivant]

Re: Re:

I think some of you are being hard on him. There's no way likes of Gallopin would easily outclimb AC usually, simply the only reason he is this bad, is because of the Giro. And it was such a tough Giro for him, with an absolutely pisspoor team, remember how isolated he was on Stage 20? He had far too many days like that, for it to not make an impact.

I think it's a mix of Giro fatigue, poor shape all year and not in peak shape.

Yes I think he wasn't in great shape at Giro, well at least compared to 2014.

Didn't he say he wasn't returning to Giro next year, which would surely mean Tour next year?

 

[cellardoor]

Re:

For those of you who believe he should ride the Tour next year.
What if he doesn't win? What if he never reaches top shape, is beaten by Froome and Quintana, or crashes, or gets ill?
Should he then continue to go for the Tour until he wins or until his body falls apart from age?
Or should he then decide to ride the Giro in 2017?

My point is, it will be very hard for him to win the Tour next year, and in my opinion not very likely. None of us want to see him retire after being defeated. So why not try to win the Giro one last time and finish his career in his home GT?
He could throw in the Olympics Road Race just for *** and giggles.

Nothing is a given in sport, he could target the Vuelta next year and still not win it. There's always a risk of losing. I think that he should take the risk and try and target the Tour next year. Actually, I'm not even opposed to trying the double again! If he's struggling for motivation, then I think the worst thing he can do is settle for easy targets, which will make him complacent and probably result in even worse form than we're seeing now. He needs the big event and perhaps what's happened this year will provide the motivation to get it right next time.

 

[Ataraxus]

Re:

Rhubroma - none of us is happy to see him humiliated, however it is all part of the sport. Even the very best get beaten at times, and in every rider's career there's a point they start to decline.

Contador always puts a fight in the Grand Tours he competes. That's what makes him a great champion.
I really don't get this emphasis on the humiliation in this thread. Marco Pantani also got humiliated in Hautacam 2000. He finished nearly 6 minutes down, got beaten to the line by the likes of Bartoli, Casero, Beloki and Boogerd but at least he was the only one to put in a fight with Lance. And in fact, I believe Lance feared Marco more than anyone else in that Tour. And battles between these 2 are what's remembered from that Tour.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

]

Yes I think he wasn't in great shape at Giro, well at least compared to 2014.

Didn't he say he wasn't returning to Giro next year, which would surely mean Tour next year?

Yes, he did, and he also said he would fully focus on the Tour in his final year. I just don't think it is a good idea - although it would allow him to win some more 1-week stage races. I think the chance of him getting everything right, and having all the luck in world to win the race, is very small. I don't want him to leave the sport after a defeat.

 

[Brod710]

Re:

For those of you who believe he should ride the Tour next year.
What if he doesn't win? What if he never reaches top shape, is beaten by Froome and Quintana, or crashes, or gets ill?
Should he then continue to go for the Tour until he wins or until his body falls apart from age?
Or should he then decide to ride the Giro in 2017?

My point is, it will be very hard for him to win the Tour next year, and in my opinion not very likely. None of us want to see him retire after being defeated. So why not try to win the Giro one last time and finish his career in his home GT?
He could throw in the Olympics Road Race just for *** and giggles.

He should give it at least one last focused try. To go home defeated from your only proper double attempt is not a shame, but it shouldn't be his last attempt at La Tour.
Winning the Tour will always be hard and this years Giro showed that success is never final. The tour will show that failing is never fatal. It's the courage to continue that counts.
And what if he would fail to win the Giro or the Vuelta?

But maybe it's only me and nobody else wants to see him next year again. Still sad about last year.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

For those of you who believe he should ride the Tour next year.
What if he doesn't win? What if he never reaches top shape, is beaten by Froome and Quintana, or crashes, or gets ill?
Should he then continue to go for the Tour until he wins or until his body falls apart from age?
Or should he then decide to ride the Giro in 2017?

My point is, it will be very hard for him to win the Tour next year, and in my opinion not very likely. None of us want to see him retire after being defeated. So why not try to win the Giro one last time and finish his career in his home GT?
He could throw in the Olympics Road Race just for *** and giggles.

He should give it at least one last focused try. To go home defeated from your only proper double attempt is not a shame, but it shouldn't be his last attempt at La Tour.
Winning the Tour will always be hard and this years Giro showed that success is never final. The tour will show that failing is never fatal. It's the courage to continue that counts.
And what if he would fail to win the Giro or the Vuelta?

But maybe it's only me and nobody else wants to see him next year again. Still sad about last year.

Then he could try again in 2017. he is way more likely to win the Giro than the Tour

 

[SkyTears]

well, if the beating he is getting from Froome doesn't motivate him for 2016 TdF than maybe is time to retire.

 

[Miburo]

Fleur contador doesn't wanna be remembered as the guy who ran from Froome. Sugercoat it, but it stays the same, it's running.

He'll come back next year and let's hope he find his best shape again

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

Fleur contador doesn't wanna be remembered as the guy who ran from Froome. Sugercoat it, but it stays the same, it's running.

He'll come back next year and let's hope he find his best shape again

I'm not optimistic but maybe he can surprise me again...
I am just afraid this could drag on for ages and it would become more and more painful each year.. in the end he'll retire without that Tour win and way later than he wanted

 

[Miburo]

Nah last year he was a beast, he can be that guy again. I'm assuming he just *** up his prep. Do the same as 2014, he'll be fine i think.

And he could follow froome maybe, look how he destroyed quintana in TA last year.

 

[perico]

Re:

well, if the beating he is getting from Froome doesn't motivate him for 2016 TdF than maybe is time to retire.

This.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

well, if the beating he is getting from Froome doesn't motivate him for 2016 TdF than maybe is time to retire.

This.

Can he yet again make all the sacrifices necessary? I for one doubt it but you never know. But I agree it is time to retire. He does not want it anymore, he's tired, he said it many times.