Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

Regarding the olympic talk, I am more interested in seeing Contador go for the ITT than the RR. It supposed to be pretty hilly, right? He could snag a medal if it's hilly enough.

Yeah, he definitely has better chance at a medal in the ITT. On paper, there are several stronger TTers, but it is just 2 weeks after the TDF so he should still be in good shape, and it's slightly hilly, so it's not impossible.

 

[DFA123]

Re:

Yea sure Spain is gonna reject Contador from the Olympics, got another good joke? LMAO

I don't think he is guaranteed at all; he's fighting for one place I think.

Valverde and Rodriguez are nailed on - they've been the heart of the Spanish team for over a decade and will both definitely go if fit. Ion Izagirre is also very likely as TT champion and a very skillful and loyal domestique. Then there will definitely be one rouleur and second TTist - probably either Castroviejo or Luis Leon Sanchez.

So the last spot could be a wildcard, in which Contador or Landa would be favourites, depending on who looks to have form. Or they could choose another climbing domestique - thinking that two leaders is enough. That would probably be Moreno or Samu Sanchez, but could also be Landa I guess - maybe even Rojas now he is national champion.

I think if he looks in good form and is prepared to do the time trial Contador will probably get the go ahead, but it's far from guaranteed from what I've heard. He's not especially popular in the Spanish federation, considering how much he has shunned their teams and championships in recent years.

 

[BlurryVII]

Re: Re:

I said before the 2015 season even started that he will ride Giro against weak competition just to have an excuse for another failure at the Tour. I was right all along. He is a quality rider. Doesn't need a bunch of people here trying to come up with random reason such as sniffles for why his preparation might not be ideal and why he is most likely going to be crushed by cyclists that are simply better than him

You must have quickly forgotten what happened in 2014. The real reason why AC did the Giro in 2015 was because of how strong he was in 2014. He realized that if he could win a gt after injuring himself, that he might be able to do the double. We now know it was to much, but his thinking was actually the opposite of your "prediction." He was so strong that he figured he'd give it a go....something Froome hasn't even been willing to do yet.

Come on now. Vuelta wasn't a huge show of strength over Froome. ITT was great, rest was wheelsucking. And that was over Froome having an absolutely nightmare of a season. Even the gaps to Rodriguez/Valverde werent impressive. Yes, Giro 2015 was an excuse in case of poor performance in the Tour. He knows he is weaker than Froome and didn't want to have another season without GT success in two of the biggest stage races in the world (none among top guns targets Vuelta, it is an aftermath to Giro/Tour). If not for Giro 2015 against weak competition Contador wouldn't have won any of Giro/Tour since 2012, that's why he went for Giro against guys that were not the strongest riders even in their own team. And Nibali is doing exactly the same. He is not strong enough to win with Froome and Quintana on this course. He was in 2014 with cobbles on the route and over 2:30min advantage he got off of them so he targeted the Tour that year, but didn't target it in this one.

Froome had a nightmare of a season, poor guy
Contador got worse at the Tour .

But... seriously you didn't enlighten us to prove your reasoning, why did he only go for the Tour in 2014 if he knows he's weaker and doesn't want a season without GT ?

And what about this year? Like here, right in front of your eyes, what's happening in a week ?

If Contador would announce now that he can't take part in the Tour because of a major physical problem, you're that kind of snake that would start barking he was planning that all season and was only targetting the Vuelta from the beginning LOL

 

[sir fly]

Re: Re:

The guy won 9 GT's and survived Armstrong.

LOL!

7

and four of those were pre-ban! :surprised:

contador is the only rider here that gets the wins he was actually dq-ed or banned for.

revisionist history on steroids!

Let's give Pollentier the 1978 TDF.
Let's give Landis back the 2006 TDF.
Armstrong is the winner of 7 TDFs.
Let's give Merckx back the 1969 Giro...

I mean why not?

Let's live in an alternate reality.

then again, all contador fans live in an alternate reality.

The fans wouldn't be such a big problem if Contador, himself, would stop insisting on 9 victories.
Classless behaviour.

 

[LaFlorecita]

LOL! Big Doopie, you are a sad hater. LOL!

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

The guy won 9 GT's and survived Armstrong.

LOL!

7

and four of those were pre-ban! :surprised:

contador is the only rider here that gets the wins he was actually dq-ed or banned for.

revisionist history on steroids!

Let's give Pollentier the 1978 TDF.
Let's give Landis back the 2006 TDF.
Armstrong is the winner of 7 TDFs.
Let's give Merckx back the 1969 Giro...

I mean why not?

Let's live in an alternate reality.

then again, all contador fans live in an alternate reality.

The fans wouldn't be such a big problem if Contador, himself, would stop insisting on 9 victories.
Classless behaviour.

Why should he say he only got 7 if he feels wronged? Have you ever seen an athlete not counting one of their own victories because they felt they didn't deserve it?

 

[BlurryVII]

Re: Re:

The fans wouldn't be such a big problem if Contador, himself, would stop insisting on 9 victories.
Classless behaviour.

Cry a river in front of his house, might help

It's honest behaviour, he's not gonna show class to what he thinks is an unfair organisation .

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Why should he say he only got 7 if he feels wronged? Have you ever seen an athlete not counting one of their own victories because they felt they didn't deserve it?

Exactly, he's maintained his innocence all along; of course he's going to count them.

This is such a tedious debate which seems to crop up every few weeks. He's won 9 on the road, and 7 in the history books - it's as simple as that. Choose whichever you feel is the more important and allow others do the same - there's clearly no right or wrong number.

 

[LaFlorecita]

DFA123, interesting that you mention Izagirre and Castroviejo/Sanchez for the TT spots and that Alberto will probably only be considered for the last spot and in that case also not for a TT spot. Alberto has talked about aiming for a medal in both the TT and the RR since last year, if the Spanish federation/national team selector indicate that they don't care about his personal ambitions and deny him a TT spot but offer him the last place on the team, I fully expect him to politely refuse. His chances in the road race are limited, so he'll probably end up working for Valverde. I don't think he fancies being a domestique for Valverde at all.
Personally, I've always regarded Valverde, Purito and Contador as certainties for the team. I know Contador hasn't made many friends in the Spanish federation in the last years, but I doubt they'll be bold enough to deny him whatever he asks for. I agree with you that Izagirre is probably sure for the ITT now that he's the national champion, so that would leave just 1 spot on the team for the RR.
Objectively, Contador should always be on the team if Purito gets a place too, the latter has shown absolutely nothing for a pretty long time now. But you are right that Alberto burned many bridges whereas Purito built them.

 

[BlurryVII]

Re: Re:

Why should he say he only got 7 if he feels wronged? Have you ever seen an athlete not counting one of their own victories because they felt they didn't deserve it?

Exactly, he's maintained his innocence all along; of course he's going to count them.

This is such a tedious debate which seems to crop up every few weeks. He's won 9 on the road, and 7 in the history books - it's as simple as that. Choose whichever you feel is the more important and allow others do the same - there's clearly no right or wrong number.

Let's be honest, everyone knows history books don't mean anything, it's full of inconsistency, misjudgments, mistakes and whatnot.
The human being has shown throughout history that providing justice is certainly not one of his qualities.

Believing and only going by what is official just shows naivete and / or hatred because at the end of the day, people are totally clueless.

 

[Miburo]

Contador is by far the best ITT of all the spanish riders. Look at the guy his performances. If it's plan flat, he's pretty meh but it ain't that in rio.

Contador is imo one of the if not the best ITT ever on hilly courses. Rio isn't hilly enough though for his standards but i'll bet anyone that he'll be the best spanish rider on it.

 

[Red Rick]

What bridges dit Contador burn then exactly? He actually worked for the Spanish team every Worlds and Olympics he rode, whereas Valverde actually screwed Spain out of a WCRR title.

 

[Miburo]

Contador was hilarious in the olympics 8 years ago.

Was pulling the whole time for the team on the climb, then he dropped back and then suddenly he was pulling again.

He was also a beast in the ITT, best time at the first split, but he blew himself up then

 

[Miburo]

On hilly courses I think Contador's worst performance ever was that ITT in PV '13. He was 5th orso, that was really bad even for a bad Contador.

Otherwise he pretty much always top 3's it and usually wins it. Sometimes he even loses because of bad luck like the ITT in the giro '08 where he lost to the donkey owner because of the rain

 

[DFA123]

Re:

DFA123, interesting that you mention Izagirre and Castroviejo/Sanchez for the TT spots and that Alberto will probably only be considered for the last spot and in that case also not for a TT spot. Alberto has talked about aiming for a medal in both the TT and the RR since last year, if the Spanish federation/national team selector indicate that they don't care about his personal ambitions and deny him a TT spot but offer him the last place on the team, I fully expect him to politely refuse. His chances in the road race are limited, so he'll probably end up working for Valverde. I don't think he fancies being a domestique for Valverde at all.
Personally, I've always regarded Valverde, Purito and Contador as certainties for the team. I know Contador hasn't made many friends in the Spanish federation in the last years, but I doubt they'll be bold enough to deny him whatever he asks for. I agree with you that Izagirre is probably sure for the ITT now that he's the national champion, so that would leave just 1 spot on the team for the RR.
Objectively, Contador should always be on the team if Purito gets a place too, the latter has shown absolutely nothing for a pretty long time now. But you are right that Alberto burned many bridges whereas Purito built them.

Interesting points. Agree for sure that he definitely won't want to work for Valverde; no love lost there I think he'd probably put in a decent performance in the TT as well, possibly even Spain's best hope of a medal unless Izagirre can somehow maintain his current form, but if politics come into play, then I think the Movistar connection could see the second TT go to Castroviejo.

As a fan I would definitely select Contador as a wild card for RR and put him in the TT. For the road race he can animate it and, even though he probably won't win, he could tear the race apart and make it great to watch. It could even help Valverde, because if Contador attacks from long, it would take the pressure off Spain to control the race for so long. Like you said though, that may be the role of Purito, and although Contador could perhaps do it better, politics will almost certainly come into it. Then the issue is whether to have 2 wild cards/ free roles in the team - which would leave Valverde short of support.

Hopefully he'll put a great TT in during the Tour and convince the selectors to let him do both races in Rio.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

What bridges dit Contador burn then exactly? He actually worked for the Spanish team every Worlds and Olympics he rode, whereas Valverde actually screwed Spain out of a WCRR title.

Yeah, he did a lot of selfless work when he actually raced for the team, but the national federation isn't happy that he almost never participates in the nationals and often refuses to ride the Worlds.

 

[Red Rick]

If you look at what Contador did to a peloton on a climb like the Col d'Eze, I can't understand why you wouldn't select him. Valverde will have done the double, he's unlikely to be in great shape I think.

 

[DFA123]

Re:

What bridges dit Contador burn then exactly? He actually worked for the Spanish team every Worlds and Olympics he rode, whereas Valverde actually screwed Spain out of a WCRR title.

It's not really about the races he has ridden, it's more about the ones he hasn't ridden. He's hardly turned up at the nationals in recent years, and has been reluctant the few times he's done the road race. He doesn't have many contacts or much influence in the federation any more - I think Ponferrada was a big factor because they really, really wanted to showcase the country and win it - and felt Contador should have ridden.

It's also to do with his relationship with Valverde, which - athough was never great - has deteriorated more in the last few years. Valverde is the darling of the federation (a lot of them even blame Purito for 2013!), and wields a huge amount of influence - so if he says he needs Moreno, Izagirre and Catroviejo to win, he may well get them.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

What bridges dit Contador burn then exactly? He actually worked for the Spanish team every Worlds and Olympics he rode, whereas Valverde actually screwed Spain out of a WCRR title.

Yeah, he did a lot of selfless work when he actually raced for the team, but the national federation isn't happy that he almost never participates in the nationals and often refuses to ride the Worlds.

[x] makes parcours flat
[x] is suprised the top climber without a sprint doesn't show up

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Hopefully he'll put a great TT in during the Tour and convince the selectors to let him do both races in Rio.

Regarding this, is it known when the selection will be made public?

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

What bridges dit Contador burn then exactly? He actually worked for the Spanish team every Worlds and Olympics he rode, whereas Valverde actually screwed Spain out of a WCRR title.

It's not really about the races he has ridden, it's more about the ones he hasn't ridden. He's hardly turned up at the nationals in recent years, and has been reluctant the few times he's done the road race. He doesn't have many contacts or much influence in the federation any more - I think Ponferrada was a big factor because they really, really wanted to showcase the country and win it - and felt Contador should have ridden.

It's also to do with his relationship with Valverde, which - athough was never great - has deteriorated more in the last few years. Valverde is the darling of the federation (a lot of them even blame Purito for 2013!), and wields a huge amount of influence - so if he says he needs Moreno, Izagirre and Catroviejo to win, he may well get them.

That is just sad

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

What bridges dit Contador burn then exactly? He actually worked for the Spanish team every Worlds and Olympics he rode, whereas Valverde actually screwed Spain out of a WCRR title.

It's not really about the races he has ridden, it's more about the ones he hasn't ridden. He's hardly turned up at the nationals in recent years, and has been reluctant the few times he's done the road race. He doesn't have many contacts or much influence in the federation any more - I think Ponferrada was a big factor because they really, really wanted to showcase the country and win it - and felt Contador should have ridden.

It's also to do with his relationship with Valverde, which - athough was never great - has deteriorated more in the last few years. Valverde is the darling of the federation (a lot of them even blame Purito for 2013!), and wields a huge amount of influence - so if he says he needs Moreno, Izagirre and Catroviejo to win, he may well get them.

That is just sad

Yep, I'm inclined to agree. The argument is that if Purito wouldn't have attacked then it would have come down to a three man sprint which Valverde would have won - which is quite possibly correct.

But, at the same time, with a man advantage like that, it's pretty reasonable and normal to try to win it before the sprint - where strange results can always happen.

 

[jens_attacks]

Contador will make grown people cry on arcalis

And i don't mean his fans.

 

[sir fly]

Re:

Contador will make grown people cry on arcalis

And i don't mean his fans.

 

[Miburo]

Re:

Contador will make grown people cry on arcalis

And i don't mean his fans.

We just need VDB2 to attack again first