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Are We in the We Don't Know Era?

Page 4 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.

How Confident Are you the Top Guys Are Doping?

  • Highly Confident They Are Doping

    Votes: 28 59.6%
  • Probably Doping

    Votes: 9 19.1%
  • Unsure/I Don't Know

    Votes: 7 14.9%
  • Probably Clean

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • Highly Confident They Are Clean

    Votes: 1 2.1%

  • Total voters
    47
There were speculation about Bahrain couple years ago, when everybody were flying and Padun was the best climbet at Dauphine.

Whatever they were on, they quickly got off of it shortly afterwards and never been the same teamwide.

That's only big suspicion i can remember after Team Sky and bloodbags.

Padun was 2021

Bahrain 2022: Sanremo, Fleche, Andalucia. podium at: Giro, Tirreno, Itzulia, Lombardia.
stage wins at: Giro, Tirreno, Suisse, Romandie
21 victories

Bahrain 2023: stage TDUnder, 2 stages Giro, 3 stages Tour (as in 2021), 1 stage Vuelta, GT win Pologne
podium at: Fleche, Liege, Romandie, PaysBasque, San Sebastian.
19 victories
 
Could the Biological Passport be like a Doper's Passport?
Though it has been defeated by richer riders
it is still rolled out to the media as the scientific mechanism to stop modern doping.

My 2¢ conspiracy theory:
Biological Passport only ever gets examined when riders/teams
are frowned upon for "political" reasons (money power etc)
Otherwise, just carry on guys, you're cleans to go, regardless?
 
Padun was 2021

Bahrain 2022: Sanremo, Fleche, Andalucia. podium at: Giro, Tirreno, Itzulia, Lombardia.
stage wins at: Giro, Tirreno, Suisse, Romandie
21 victories

Bahrain 2023: stage TDUnder, 2 stages Giro, 3 stages Tour (as in 2021), 1 stage Vuelta, GT win Pologne
podium at: Fleche, Liege, Romandie, PaysBasque, San Sebastian.
19 victories
They have good team and they are racing great tactically, but they wasn't ridiculous anymore
 
They have good team and they are racing great tactically, but they wasn't ridiculous anymore

well, every year is different. races are won/lost in moments. Mohoric launched the perfect attack at the foot of the Poggio downhill 2 weeks ago. just VDP working for Philipsen avoided another Sanremo for him. Buitrago smashed a super stage in Paris-Nice. Moho is injured for Roubaix. it takes so little win/lose
 
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if I were to bet on it I would say there is absolutely a new, undetectable, extremely effective substance in the peloton, ala EPO in the early '90's. the one strange thing to me is that there hasn't really been very many "donkey to racehorse" transformations that were the signature of the EPO era. it feels like the level of the peloton has risen collectively and the guys who are winning were all highly touted from a young age for the most part. that to me would speak to it being very widespread but even then you would expect there to be a few out of nowhere super-responders. possibly it's just something they just all got ahold of very young, but i kinda doubt that.
 
if I were to bet on it I would say there is absolutely a new, undetectable, extremely effective substance in the peloton, ala EPO in the early '90's. the one strange thing to me is that there hasn't really been very many "donkey to racehorse" transformations that were the signature of the EPO era. it feels like the level of the peloton has risen collectively and the guys who are winning were all highly touted from a young age for the most part. that to me would speak to it being very widespread but even then you would expect there to be a few out of nowhere super-responders. possibly it's just something they just all got ahold of very young, but i kinda doubt that.
The UCI passport would (in time) detect any increase in the level of oxygen carrying capability of the bloodstream above that rider's baseline - assuming they actually enforce it. But I think you might be onto something with the bold? If riders can dope their levels before they ever get tested that would help them circumvent the passport and explain the lack of donkey to racehorse transformations in recent years. But this is only conjecture on my part.
 
The UCI passport would (in time) detect any increase in the level of oxygen carrying capability of the bloodstream above that rider's baseline - assuming they actually enforce it. But I think you might be onto something with the bold? If riders can dope their levels before they ever get tested that would help them circumvent the passport and explain the lack of donkey to racehorse transformations in recent years. But this is only conjecture on my part.

as others have stated in this thread, the biopassport has been rendered nearly useless unless the blood doping is super egregious and especially if the rider suspected has a ton of money to fight the case with.

i think what you're saying is possible in isolation but not with all of the 5-7 riders who currently dominate. i can't see them all having the means or the expertise to dope themselves up at 15/16/17 to the right level to somehow beat the passport forever. that theory just kinda falls apart for me when i think about it more deeply.
 
The UCI passport would (in time) detect any increase in the level of oxygen carrying capability of the bloodstream above that rider's baseline - assuming they actually enforce it. But I think you might be onto something with the bold? If riders can dope their levels before they ever get tested that would help them circumvent the passport and explain the lack of donkey to racehorse transformations in recent years. But this is only conjecture on my part.
I find it plausible for that to be one of the reasons for very young pros being so good so early.
 
Operation Aderlass being sophisticated: I rather think it was insanely amateurish. Some random athletes that haven’t had better access to more sophisticated doping paid a German doctor to meet them at motorway resting areas and give them access to drugs/store blood. And they did blood transfusions themselves in the hotel - no assistance on the medical act (ok, thats doable) and organization.
Not sophisticated? Lol Why don't you read Tammjarv's CAS hearing & see the techniques that were utilized in blood transfusions IC & circumventing the ABP:


Danilo Hondo was even in on the act. Able to blood dope undetected during his competition season. He even had a code name in Operation Aderlass: "James Bond." Now you know that's a sophisticated operation when someone has the code name of a legendary spy character (I can just imagine hearing the James Bond 007 Theme Song as Hondo is re-infusing his blood bag before a competition. Lol).

 
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