Armstrong Under Criminal Investigation

[Berzin]

Aleajactaest-Betsy and Frankie were victims in all this. This has been universally accepted as the truth.

You are entitled to your opinion, but blaming them for anything Armstrong did is not only incorrect, but an unsubtle attempt at shifting blame and derailing this thread.

Please refrain from this. This thread is about Armstrong and the lawsuits coming his way.

Thank you.

 

[Aleajactaest]

Bullsh!t question.

You have attacked Betsy with complete fabrications.

Now, you have added to it by claiming Frankie lied for, what was it, ten years?

Please provide us with proof of a single lie uttered by Frankie.

Dave.

1. How would I have any idea that Betsy was a forum member.
2. Frankie doped. He denied it for years. He finally came clean in 2006. So, that would be a lie. My proof is in the New York Times.

Sorry, I posted this before reading your post Berzin. I think this is on point but I will stop this line of questioning at your request.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Aleajactaest-Betsy and Frankie were victims in all this. This has been universally accepted as the truth.

You are entitled to your opinion, but blaming them for anything Armstrong did is not only incorrect, but an unsubtle attempt at shifting blame and derailing this thread.

Please refrain from this. This thread is about Armstrong and the lawsuits coming his way.

Thank you.

But, but, but the only real victim here is Lance.

See, mean, bitter (but not fat) Betsy knew the truth, so what happened recentley is not new to her, she can not be a victim.
But poor, poor Lance would have felt "fear" and 'intimidation' that Betsy knew the truth and was trying to reveal it, the stress.

Unlike Betsy & Frankie (who lied for years, even though he was never asked and admitted it in the first interview where he was asked) other real victims are people like Wiesel, Och, Verbruggen, McQuaid - these people only found out 2 weeks ago that Lance doped, the shock and pain they must feel.
Please think of poor unfortunate people, they are the real victims here.

 

[Amsterhammer]

Calumnies, innuendo and lies about Betsy

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=18976&page=6

 

[MarkvW]

Aleajactaest-Betsy and Frankie were victims in all this. This has been universally accepted as the truth.

You are entitled to your opinion, but blaming them for anything Armstrong did is not only incorrect, but an unsubtle attempt at shifting blame and derailing this thread.

Please refrain from this. This thread is about Armstrong and the lawsuits coming his way.

Thank you.

That is serious bull. Frankie Andreu knowingly helped Armstrong dope to win the Tour de France. He may have been a victim, but he was also a perpetrator.

You gonna threaten me with a ban for telling the truth?

 

[Dr. Maserati]

That is serious bull. Frankie Andreu knowingly helped Armstrong dope to win the Tour de France. He may have been a victim, but he was also a perpetrator.

You gonna threaten me with a ban for telling the truth?

Hold on, why do you say its serious bull and then agree that Frankie "may be a victim"?

You do realize that people here are talking about "victim' in the context of Armstrong bullying and intimidating people?

 

[MarkvW]

Hold on, why do you say its serious bull and then agree that Frankie "may be a victim"?

You do realize that people here are talking about "victim' in the context of Armstrong bullying and intimidating people?

No I don't. People here take other people out of context all the time. You, of all people, should know that.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

No I don't. People here take other people out of context all the time. You, of all people, should know that.

And I pull them on it - you of all people should know that.

 

[Race Radio]

That is serious bull. Frankie Andreu knowingly helped Armstrong dope to win the Tour de France. He may have been a victim, but he was also a perpetrator.

You gonna threaten me with a ban for telling the truth?

Really? Then why was Frankie left out of the A team? No included in the Ferrari training camps. Not included in the planing of the "Program" ?

Tyler, Frankie, and George all say Frankie was marginalized when he made it clear he would not jump on the program. When Tyler's book was published he was shocked by what he read because he was not included in much of it. .....but you are saying he actually helped Lance dope. Wow

 

[ChewbaccaD]

That is serious bull. Frankie Andreu knowingly helped Armstrong dope to win the Tour de France. He may have been a victim, but he was also a perpetrator.

You gonna threaten me with a ban for telling the truth?

Cite the source please.

What you write is completely different from knowing he doped. Riding with him doped. Doping so he would ensure his spot on the team. Etc. Etc. Etc.

"Knowingly helped"...you seem so terrified that Birotte will see through your anonymous forum name, but you are more than willing to throw out some bullsh!t about Frankie.

Words have meaning and connotation, and you failed at both.

Lance helped Lance dope. Bruyneel helped Lance Dope. Ferrari helped Lance dope. Kristin helped Lance dope. Pat helped Lance dope.

Frankie just rode the ****ing bike and doped. But you keep hammering on the people who have been telling the truth longer than most. Your colors have once again shown themselves...and to think I almost considered you a legitimate poster here...

EDIT: And please, for the love of all that is holy, don't say you chose your words badly, or that you meant something different. None of us are nearly as stupid as you seem to think we are. You're an attorney; you use words for specific reasons. Quit ****ing on us and telling us it's rain.

 

[D-Queued]

That is serious bull. Frankie Andreu knowingly helped Armstrong dope to win the Tour de France. He may have been a victim, but he was also a perpetrator.

You gonna threaten me with a ban for telling the truth?

Lie as in Libelous.

Dave.

 

[hiero2]

. . .
2. Frankie doped. He denied it for years. He finally came clean in 2006. So, that would be a lie. My proof is in the New York Times.
. . .

Link, my friend, link. Otherwise the reference is meaningless, no good, worthless, not worth the paper it is printed on - you get the drift? Please give a proper reference to a source, for quotes and facts. The BASIC requirement is that ANYONE reading your copy will be able to go look up your source and verify the quote. Ok? Take the extra few minutes to make your argument strong and real.

 

[RobbieCanuck]

The federal investigation is back on. Things have been elevated to an office higher than Andre Birotte.

My favorite part of the article...
"Today, a high level source told ABC News, "Birotte does not speak for the federal government as a whole."

The source said that Birotte is not in the loop on the current criminal inquiry, which is being run out of another office."

You do not have your facts straight. There are (or were) two investigations into LA. The first alleges fraud and that was the Birotte investigation and the reason for the LA grand jury. For reasons no one (except Birotte) can understand that investigation was dropped. It has not been reopened. At least not yet. It may be there is a higher DOJ officer than Birotte that has the authority to reopen that investigation.

The second investigation is the witness tampering, obstruction of justice and intimidation investigation arising out of Armstrong's alleged deliberate attempt in Aspen to scare Tyler Hamilton off. That investigation continues.

 

[xrayvision]

Originally Posted by CivilRightsCycling
The crime of trying to stop people reporting you is a very common one that prosecutors usually don't prosecute. It's defensive rather than proactive criminality - a side effect of the main matter. Prosecutors have a lot of discretion depending on the circumstances. The wider circumstances in this situation is not only doping in cycling - hardly a priority for law enforcement - but the matter that LA has now confessed to the doping and is going through a process of talking and apologising to people who feel hurt along the way. I think that is a very good reason for the feds to stay out of it. So yeah, Oprah does matter. What about Floyd fairness fraud - a proactive rather than a defensive crime - did people call for Floyd to go to jail? And didn't even ths user who opened the thread claim to have withheld negative information on Jo Papp so as to help ensure he didn't go to jail? Ah? Hypocrisy anyone?

In this case, it's quite likely that many people who have received harsh words from Lance don't want him to go to jail. Why would your opinion matter more than theirs? That is bizarre to me.

No wonder the world is so fu.ked up with posters like this.
I´m just wondering for how long all Lance´s puppies will continue down this lane...

 

[Aleajactaest]

Link, my friend, link. Otherwise the reference is meaningless, no good, worthless, not worth the paper it is printed on - you get the drift? Please give a proper reference to a source, for quotes and facts. The BASIC requirement is that ANYONE reading your copy will be able to go look up your source and verify the quote. Ok? Take the extra few minutes to make your argument strong and real.

I'm not supposed to continue this discussion per one of the other mods. However, I can't get to the original NYT article, it appears to be too old to appear in search results..

There, however, numerous articles that say he used EPO and confessed in an interview with the NYT in 2006.

Here is one of many with that statement.

http://www.globaltvbc.com/ap+interv...rt+on+armstrongs+doping/6442732449/story.html

BTW, if we're going to start having the mods enforce this citation issue,it needs to cover every assertion. Not just the ones people don't like.

 

[D-Queued]

I'm not supposed to continue this discussion per one of the other mods. However, I can't get to the original NYT article, it appears to be too old to appear in search results..

There, however, numerous articles that say he used EPO and confessed in an interview with the NYT in 2006.

Here is one of many with that statement.

http://www.globaltvbc.com/ap+interv...rt+on+armstrongs+doping/6442732449/story.html

BTW, if we're going to start having the mods enforce this citation issue,it needs to cover every assertion. Not just the ones people don't like.

I trust you are not a computer invalid.

Google "Frankie Andreu Wikipedia" FFS. Is it really that hard, or are you willfully ignoring the obvious?

Then, instead of harassing Betsy by accusing her of being a 'crazy *****', perhaps you can recant just like your hero did as is noted on that same Wikipedia page.

Dave.

 

[Aleajactaest]

I trust you are not a computer invalid.

Google "Frankie Andreu Wikipedia" FFS. Is it really that hard, or are you willfully ignoring the obvious?

Then, instead of harassing Betsy by accusing her of being a 'crazy *****', perhaps you can recant just like your hero did as is noted on that same Wikipedia page.

Dave.

I'm not clear what your point is.

1. Wikipedia is crowd sourced and is not authoritative for any use. Academically, you are prohibited from using it as a reference.

2. If if were authoritative, it say that Frankie Admitted using EPO in the 2006 interview with the NYT. I've found that reference numerous places.

3. Since had had previously denied using drugs, that means he lied. What is the issue?

I'm not harassing anyone. Betsy isn't a target of anything I said. I do think she responds in ways that contribute to how she is perceived. I'm not sure why saying that is so horrible.

I will not respond to the blame question as I have been asked not to.

 

[Oldman]

I'm not clear what your point is.

1. Wikipedia is crowd sourced and is not authoritative for any use. Academically, you are prohibited from using it as a reference.

2. If if were authoritative, it say that Frankie Admitted using EPO in the 2006 interview with the NYT. I've found that reference numerous places.

3. Since had had previously denied using drugs, that means he lied. What is the issue?

I'm not harassing anyone. Betsy isn't a target of anything I said. I do think she responds in ways that contribute to how she is perceived. I'm not sure why saying that is so horrible.

I will not respond to the blame question as I have been asked not to.

Then you should Live for something else and move on....Juxtiposing incidents and "facts" to suit a conclusion usually wont' pass scrutiny.

 

[Race Radio]

NPR spoke with a witness contacted in Armstrong Criminal case

http://www.npr.org/2013/02/08/171438616/lawsuit-investigation-loom-over-lance-armstrong

Lance being nicer to USADA in hopes they can help. Travis is his best hope.

Those who think that Borat is fine.....this quote says a lot

"Birotte does not speak for the federal government as a whole."

 

[H2OUUP2]

http://www.npr.org/2013/02/08/171438616/lawsuit-investigation-loom-over-lance-armstrong

I see in the comments there's still a few diehard fan boys still holding on.....It's amazing how the conversation has changed. Just 6 months ago if you read an article on LA, 8 out of 10 comments left below it would be in favour of him.

 

[Turner29]

Too bad that criminal statute of limitations means that Armstrong and others won't be prosecuted regarding SCA Promotions.

I do not mean perjury; rather, criminal fraud and conspiracy to commit fraud.

Lance Armstrong admitted that in his view, nobody could be him in the Tour de France. Therefore, Tailwind Sports would have a compelling reason to "insure" his bonus for winning a Tour.

Thus, their insurance "claim" is as fraudulent as anyone committing arson on their own property...

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I'm not clear what your point is.

1. Wikipedia is crowd sourced and is not authoritative for any use. Academically, you are prohibited from using it as a reference.

2. If if were authoritative, it say that Frankie Admitted using EPO in the 2006 interview with the NYT. I've found that reference numerous places.

3. Since had had previously denied using drugs, that means he lied. What is the issue?

I'm not harassing anyone. Betsy isn't a target of anything I said. I do think she responds in ways that contribute to how she is perceived. I'm not sure why saying that is so horrible.

I will not respond to the blame question as I have been asked not to.

"What is the issue?" - well its that the highlighted is untrue.
He admitted his doping to the very first journalist who asked about it, which was Juliet Macur in 2006. Here is the link to her NYT article.

But what you are saying is he "denied it for years" - either link to it or admit you are wrong.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

I'm not clear what your point is.

Nevertheless your 'dice' are very obvious.

 

[Race Radio]

Lance should talk to his good buddy Joe Papp......Travis kept him out of prision

 

[peterst6906]

Lance should talk to his good buddy Joe Papp......Travis kept him out of prision

From his behaviour on here, particularly in relation to you, Joe is the type of person who will naturally find his way to prison eventually. Can't help himself, its in his character.

Lance may be a little the same.

Travis pushing water uphill if they have to rely on his good will to help them.