Armstrong will never be caught for EPO or blood boosting and here's why!!

[BroDeal]

I agree that Lance will never be caught but not because of some weird conspiracy theory. I would imagine he has a Therapuetic Use Exemption for some pretty impressive drugs. No one else in the peloton has come close to having his level of cancer. So if you have a decent lawyer, the whole premise of a TUE would seem to allow for you to be able to get treatment to keep the cancer in remission, to do otherwise could cost him his life.Its not like he is asking for steriods for asthma, he was on the verge of death, So the threat of potential liabilty to deny him treatment when others are allowed drugs for non life threatening conditions outweighs the potential backlash if the TUE is ever revealed.
Since the TUE's are confidential no one will ever know...
my theory

There are no drugs required after treatment for that kind of cancer. The way the reporter Ressiot was able to get Armstrong to release his 1999 doping forms was that rumors had always circulated that Armstrong had TUEs for various drugs. Ressiot offered Armstrong a chance to prove his critics wrong by releasing a doping form from 1999. The UCI officials then screwed up and released all of Armstrong's 1999 forms. With those forms Ressiot was able to match six samples that had tested positive for EPO to Armstrong. It was a crack bit of reporting and resolved once and for all that Armstrong was doping.

 

[Escarabajo]

There are no drugs required after treatment for that kind of cancer. The way the reporter Ressiot was able to get Armstrong to release his 1999 doping forms was that rumors had always circulated that Armstrong had TUEs for various drugs. Ressiot offered Armstrong a chance to prove his critics wrong by releasing a doping form from 1999. The UCI officials then screwed up and released all of Armstrong's 1999 forms. With those forms Ressiot was able to match six samples that had tested positive for EPO to Armstrong. It was a crack bit of reporting and resolved once and for all that Armstrong was doping.

What are we going to do now that Jackhammer won't be around to refute every theory that Lance was a doped?

 

[blackcat]

What are we going to do now that Jackhammer won't be around to refute every theory that Lance was a doped?

was?

tense?

 

[velocodger]

There still is no good test for (your own) blood doping....

Unless riders are caught with the bags of blood, they are home free.
Lance or anybody else! Just a matter of opportunity and enough planning to pull it off. When it comes to blood packing your own blood, the drug testing emperorer has no clothes, people!

 

[FoxxyBrown1111]

??

Unless riders are caught with the bags of blood, they are home free.
Lance or anybody else!

That dont say it.

Because now we all know ALL the elite drivers took/take blood doping and/or EPO, but still Armstrong NEVER lost a single stage (the Pantani Stage was a "present"; ok Ullrich had him 2003 as exception) to them.

How can it be he finished mountain stages with such great climbers like Zabel 28 mins down pre-cancer, and win the TdF every Year by 6 mins after cancer. And dont forget he beat the most talented rider of this era (Ullrich) every Year. There must be more then just extra blood. Anyone know what his TUE includes?

Did Ferrari made such a big difference? Then it means he was VERY clean pre-cancer while everybody else was "full-loaded" at the very beginning of their careers. That would be the only explanation, right?

Pls dont bring up the HGH-Stuff. 2 different studies from Australia and Sweden showed that growth hormone dont work in endurance cycling, its all placebo.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

It's more than placebo, but it doesn't boost endurance or O2 carrying capacity like some people think.

Read the Ashenden interview, he goes into detail as to just how many positives were likely there, and who had very likely doped how much. At least as far as 1999 goes.

Lance's perfect health is proof of that right Boat?

Remember, Lance isn't the only one. People implying that are fooling themselves. He's just got very expert assistance. But BigB is correct on this one. The biggest potential problem from transfusion is improper storage of blood leading to contamination, which could lead to infection, or even sepsis. Or clotting, which could kill you actually. Something any physician should be able to prevent. The big concern with EPO and other boosters is ending up with sludge blood leading to heart attacks. But that's only when your hct is above about 55, and you're dehydrated, and I don't think guys are as doped as BigB does this way. He knows crap I don't though, who knows.

Strange thing is although the OP's idea seems very out there, I can't help thinking of BALCO and thier designer steroids that were undetectable at the time.

Quite possible. I wouldn't be too shocked if someone has created a designer version of Cera, but with a slightly different code so that it's much harder to detect than the stuff Roche shared with WADA. This would be a "great" drug for endurance athletes if true. Pretty safe, easy to administer, highly effective, and very hard to detect. Especially if the powers that be don't know of it's existence.

 

[blackcat]

I hope you are joking, because that is just plain crazy.

However, I will be watching for any strange tractor beam like devices attached to Lance's handlebars, or maybe an anti-gravity device. After all he is friends with George Bush and co. I also think they should maybe put an identifying tattoo on Lance to make sure that his clone doesn't take over halfway through the tour.

my mail is GWB does not actually like Armstrong. Armstrong is being courted by both Dems and the GOP in Texas, but has already gone on record saying he is centre/centre-left leaning and a Dem. But his narrative is all GOP. And the GOP dirty tricks would cut him down. So, I am thinking th declared and "devout" atheist, Armstrong, will soon be a "born again Christian". He is gonna run in the 2013 gubernatorial race in Texas and then on to the WH.

Lance Armstrong: Sarah Palin in spandex? - By Bill Gifford - Slate Magazine
http://www.slate.com/id/2222407?nav=wp

 

[blackcat]

That dont say it.

Because now we all know ALL the elite drivers took/take blood doping and/or EPO, but still Armstrong NEVER lost a single stage (the Pantani Stage was a "present"; ok Ullrich had him 2003 as exception) to them.

How can it be he finished mountain stages with such great climbers like Zabel 28 mins down pre-cancer, and win the TdF every Year by 6 mins after cancer. And dont forget he beat the most talented rider of this era (Ullrich) every Year. There must be more then just extra blood. Anyone know what his TUE includes?

Did Ferrari made such a big difference? Then it means he was VERY clean pre-cancer while everybody else was "full-loaded" at the very beginning of their careers. That would be the only explanation, right?

Pls dont bring up the HGH-Stuff. 2 different studies from Australia and Sweden showed that growth hormone dont work in endurance cycling, its all placebo.

it would not be a TUE, dont know why you focus on that, when everyone is on illegal stuff.

The TUE is specifically there for a reason, and it is not supposed to change the natural even playing field. So you cant get a free pass on a drug which will improve your power by 20%. Risible.

On HGH you are incorrect.

There is alot of research showing testosterone does not work also.

But, I believe there IS research showing there is a symbiosis and effectiveness, with HGH AND testo.

 

[blackcat]

It's more than placebo, but it doesn't boost endurance or O2 carrying capacity like some people think.

Read the Ashenden interview, he goes into detail as to just how many positives were likely there, and who had very likely doped how much. At least as far as 1999 goes.


Remember, Lance isn't the only one. People implying that are fooling themselves. He's just got very expert assistance. But BigB is correct on this one. The biggest potential problem from transfusion is improper storage of blood leading to contamination, which could lead to infection, or even sepsis. Or clotting, which could kill you actually. Something any physician should be able to prevent. The big concern with EPO and other boosters is ending up with sludge blood leading to heart attacks. But that's only when your hct is above about 55, and you're dehydrated, and I don't think guys are as doped as BigB does this way. He knows crap I don't though, who knows.


Quite possible. I wouldn't be too shocked if someone has created a designer version of Cera, but with a slightly different code so that it's much harder to detect than the stuff Roche shared with WADA. This would be a "great" drug for endurance athletes if true. Pretty safe, easy to administer, highly effective, and very hard to detect. Especially if the powers that be don't know of it's existence.

actually HGH has shown to have potential effect on 'crit

 

[blackcat]

actually HGH has shown to have potential effect on 'crit

can one microdose EPO, CERA, and other epo-similar variants. the Chinese and Russian variants.

You could just rotate smaller micro-doses, year round, and the bands on the MSGC test would not be any wiser. Just have to be more careful with the CERA microdosing because of the half life.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Exactly.

it would not be a TUE, don't know why you focus on that, when everyone is on illegal stuff.

Everyone? You sound like your nemesis?

I don't know that LA can get that far in politics. Maybe, but politics is even more slimy slippery, back room, back slapping, than cycling. He's also a bit of a hot head at times, and I don't know how that will play on a bigger arena.

I can see him getting elected to something like mayor of Austin, as it's left-center, at least for Texas. His name alone could do that. Gov? I just don't see it happening. And I don't see him in any legislature anywhere, he wouldn't do well being one of the many. It's an executive position, or nothing.

Texas should have elected Kinky Friedman when they had the chance.

 

[blackcat]

Exactly.


Everyone? You sound like your nemesis?

I don't know that LA can get that far in politics. Maybe, but politics is even more slimy slippery, back room, back slapping, than cycling. He's also a bit of a hot head at times, and I don't know how that will play on a bigger arena.

I can see him getting elected to something like mayor of Austin, as it's left-center, at least for Texas. His name alone could do that. Gov? I just don't see it happening. And I don't see him in any legislature anywhere, he wouldn't do well being one of the many. It's an executive position, or nothing.

Texas should have elected Kinky Friedman when they had the chance.

just telling you the plan AdH

my theory - his narrative is more attuned to the GoP. He needs to wipe the slate, declare allegiances to GoP, join a church, marry that young woman, and commit himself to the right.

But remember in Cali, blue state that Schwarzenegger turned, albeit on the back of the blackouts and the gov't balance sheet.

But still think Armstrong will embrace the GoP if he wishes to take a run for the WH in future. The GoP have far better dirty tricks, that would kill him, if he was to run as a Dem.

 

[BroDeal]

just telling you the plan AdH

my theory - his narrative is more attuned to the GoP. He needs to wipe the slate, declare allegiances to GoP, join a church, marry that young woman, and commit himself to the right.

But remember in Cali, blue state that Schwarzenegger turned, albeit on the back of the blackouts and the gov't balance sheet.

But still think Armstrong will embrace the GoP if he wishes to take a run for the WH in future. The GoP have far better dirty tricks, that would kill him, if he was to run as a Dem.

I agree with the GOP option. His biggest supporters are often jingoistic douchebags who get off on him beating the french (even though there has not been a legitimate french contender since 1997--not that they would know that). Throwing away those types of potential voters would be giving up a natural source of support.

The atheism thing may be a problem inTexas no matter what party he runs for. People in normal social situations will ask you what church you go to.

 

[Mongol_Waaijer]

The atheism thing may be a problem inTexas no matter what party he runs for. People in normal social situations will ask you what church you go to.

did anyone else see him wearing a crucifix when his jersey was unzipped the other day?

Very political....

 

[blackcat]

he will cross himself before the ITT, and kiss the cross.

 

[BroDeal]

did anyone else see him wearing a crucifix when his jersey was unzipped the other day?

Very political....

I think that is the same one he has had for a long time. It was a gift from someone and he does not wear it for any religious purpose.

 

[FoxxyBrown1111]

??

So you cant get a free pass on a drug which will improve your power by 20%.

20% improvement?? no way. Lance was 6 mins. down on Indurain on TT, later he won (almost) every single TT. So lets say he gained 8 mins. on 50km. Thats 13%-Improvement, which is toooo crazy. I mean we talk about well trained Athlets on which doping may bring you 5%-Improvment (which i think is still too high for high-class-athletes with no more possibilities of improving skills). Another example is Ben Johnson: He went from 10,7 to 9,8 sec. in 100-Dash. Thats 9%-Improvement (but the 10,7 Race was in way too big shoes and without propper Training, so lets better say we take the time of 84-Olympics which he ran 10,19 sec. = 4%-Improvement).

So i again ask: What did Lance do different then others (Pre-Cancer 6 mins. down on TT, 28mis. on climbs, finishing with climbing legends like Zabel // after cancer he beat full blood/Epo-doped World-Class Riders who showed talent EARLY like Virenque, Ullrich) to gain such a heavy advantage? It cant be "only" Extra-Blood and Epo, right?

Did Ferrari made such a big difference? Then it means he was VERY clean pre-cancer while everybody else was "full-loaded" at the very beginning of their careers. That would be the only explanation, right?

Or maybe the effects of doping had/have much greater outputs for him then for other riders (like every medicine; for some pipo it works, for others not. like penicilline work good with me, while my mother has big side effects)? Then he must be the luckiest person in the world. Imagine Ullrich sitting at home having bills with no income, while Armstrong makes millions. The only thing Ullrich did was safeing his talent (getting into PED`s). Not because i am german, but i think he was the most talented rider since Hinault/Lemond.

I am not a doc or scientist, so i would like to know the opinion from some experts

 

[blackcat]

20% improvement?? no way. Lance was 6 mins. down on Indurain on TT, later he won (almost) every single TT. So lets say he gained 8 mins. on 50km. Thats 13%-Improvement, which is toooo crazy. I mean we talk about well trained Athlets on which doping may bring you 5%-Improvment (which i think is still too high for high-class-athletes with no more possibilities of improving skills). Another example is Ben Johnson: He went from 10,7 to 9,8 sec. in 100-Dash. Thats 9%-Improvement (but the 10,7 Race was in way too big shoes and without propper Training, so lets better say we take the time of 84-Olympics which he ran 10,19 sec. = 4%-Improvement).

So i again ask: What did Lance do different then others (Pre-Cancer 6 mins. down on TT, 28mis. on climbs, finishing with climbing legends like Zabel // after cancer he beat full blood/Epo-doped World-Class Riders who showed talent EARLY like Virenque, Ullrich) to gain such a heavy advantage? It cant be "only" Extra-Blood and Epo, right?

Did Ferrari made such a big difference? Then it means he was VERY clean pre-cancer while everybody else was "full-loaded" at the very beginning of their careers. That would be the only explanation, right?

Or maybe the effects of doping had/have much greater outputs for him then for other riders (like every medicine; for some pipo it works, for others not. like penicilline work good with me, while my mother has big side effects)? Then he must be the luckiest person in the world. Imagine Ullrich sitting at home having bills with no income, while Armstrong makes millions. The only thing Ullrich did was safeing his talent (getting into PED`s). Not because i am german, but i think he was the most talented rider since Hinault/Lemond.

I am not a doc or scientist, so i would like to know the opinion from some experts

20% power does not translate into time decrease of 120/100.

aero drag coefficient is speed squared. I was using an arbitrary number. 1% improvment, 76% improvement, the number was an arbitrary example to make point for instruction.

 

[FoxxyBrown1111]

20% power does not translate into time decrease of 120/100.

aero drag coefficient is speed squared. I was using an arbitrary number. 1% improvment, 76% improvement, the number was an arbitrary example to make point for instruction.

Ok i got it

 

[Johnny Colnago]

I hear LA uses alien tech that came out of the Lizardmen/Greys war back in '46 during WW III. The Nazi's Moonbase and their Antarctic stronghold were captured by the Greys. The Lizardmen never forgave them for this and started to infiltrate higher and higher levels of the US military industrial complex.

Lance is obviously Lizard and because of his stature within the Lizardmen heirarchy he has been given serious high tech alien gear to allow him to continue his mission of TdF domination.

Now before you call me crazy I suggest you check out this website I found on the internet because who would lie on the internet!

 

[Quicksilver]

The reason he hasnt been caught is because he Doesnt Dope,
Lets not forget he was a phenominal Junior Triathlete long before US cycling picked him up after his lab test results.
Every so often a superfit athlete comes along, Lance happens to have the skill and will like Micheal Jordan to match it.
Apart from the schoolboy error sitting up to early in the Team trial he looks to have done the hard work to get back within a few percent of his best.
Probably not enough to win but Le Tour is still more interesting with him than without him.

 

[BroDeal]

The reason he hasnt been caught is because he Doesnt Dope,
Lets not forget he was a phenominal Junior Triathlete long before US cycling picked him up after his lab test results.
Every so often a superfit athlete comes along, Lance happens to have the skill and will like Micheal Jordan to match it.
Apart from the schoolboy error sitting up to early in the Team trial he looks to have done the hard work to get back within a few percent of his best.
Probably not enough to win but Le Tour is still more interesting with him than without him.

Let's not forget that his retrospectively tested urine from 1999 showed six posiitves for EPO. He dopes. It has been proven. He admitted using a wide variety of doping PEDs during while racing when he was in treatment for cancer. His person assistant also found steroids in his bathroom.

It is only the naive who believe that the winner of the TdF can win without doping. Without the benefit of a break, it is extremely unlikey that anyone can even break the top ten without doping. You just have to look at the list of top ten from the 1995 - 2005 TdFs to see that 80% have been shown to have doped.

 

[antoine]

sure...

sometimes, say if someone's been tested non-stop for 10 years, you just kind of have to believe what every single piece of evidence tells you. right?

That's why I believe Marion Jones was clear, I mean clean. Never failed a test.

 

[antoine]

And coffee is just plan nasty for the body, anyway. No beneficial, long term, influences for the body.

Really, doctor? How about the study showing caffeine reduces alzheimer's risk? Not really important, I just don't like people using false statements to back up an argument.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Did Ferrari made such a big difference? Then it means he was VERY clean pre-cancer while everybody else was "full-loaded" at the very beginning of their careers. That would be the only explanation, right?

No. People dismiss this, but I think the fact that he had cancer cells and tumors throughout his body pre-1997 had to have been weighing him down. By 1999 his body was not only cancer free, but he was fit again, and he had fine tuned his gear. This was also during a time when doping was down a little, and he was jacked (see Ashenden interview, Lance to Landis). Plus, everyone was fully loaded pre-1998. 1993-1997 were years of just mega doping. No restrictions on hct, no EPO tests at all, etc.

Or maybe the effects of doping had/have much greater outputs for him then for other riders.

This is probably true as well. Some people respond to drug therapy better than others. Willy Voet pointed out in his book how Alex Zulle generally didn't respond well, and an overmix of cordicoids cost him the 1998 Giro. Shame, Alex was an extremely talented rider.

Another way to look at this is tuning. You start with a master doctor (Ferrari), a willing patient (Lance) and you can spend the time tuning the program. The more you win, the more money you have, the more tuning you get. The further up the ladder, the better the stuff, the more attention to getting you perfect, and the less likelihood you'll get caught. This, as much as anything to me, is why doping sucks, and needs to be suppressed (it will never be eliminated).