ASO demands apology from Bakelants after sexist remarks

[Samamba]

Re: Re:

Isn't sexism saying stuff about women (or men) in general?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sexism

So did he say something in the line off "these podium girls are sleeping with everyone cause they're girls"? Saying something about a specific group of women or girls isn't always sexist you know. It can definitely be perceived as offensive just as everything is offensive to someone nowadays, but that doesn't mean it's always racist or sexist, just cause people like using those words.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

Isn't sexism saying stuff about women (or men) in general?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sexism

So did he say something in the line off "these podium girls are sleeping with everyone cause they're girls"? Saying something about a specific group of women or girls isn't always sexist you know. It can definitely be perceived as offensive just as everything is offensive to someone nowadays, but that doesn't mean it's always racist or sexist, just cause people like using those words.

No sure if serious...

 

[RedheadDane]

Re: Re:

So, saying that "I'm sorry that I offended you." doesn't put the blame squarely on the "I"?
Similar to "I'm sorry that I punched you." Surely in that case it wouldn't be implying that it's the person who was punched who's at fault.
Or saying "What I said was really offensive/hurtful."

It's the second bit that feels like an attempt to mitigate the blame. Just a bog standard "What I said was offensive. I apologise", is always the best way to do things. No confusion, no mis-interpretation. Just hands up, I did something wrong, I'm sorry.

But, to me it seems like a - perhaps failed - attempt at putting the blame even more on his own shoulders.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Just seem like a little banter to me, I assume he just said it to his teammates?

 

[Maaaaaaaarten]

Much ado about nothing. Stupid and distasteful jokes are still jokes and should be treated as such. If people want to get rid of sexism in cycling, they'd probably be better off campaigning against the phenomenon of podium girls itself, rather than throwing a hissy fit over a cyclist making a lame joke in an interview.

 

[Jagartrott]

Re: Re:

Yes, implying that women are being kept around just so cyclists can have sex with them whenever they want is totally fine and people are just taking out of context.

His team should have dropped him, straight away. Their statement is just as offensive as what Bakelants said.

He was trying to crack a few jokes, you'll find more "offensive" jokes at any comedy show.

Bakelants is not saying "that women are being kept around just so cyclists can have sex with them whenever they want is totally fine". You just made that up so you could be outraged and ask him to be removed.

"definitely a packet of condoms. You never know where those podium hostesses are hanging out." Actual quote.

Not actual quote.
Poor translation from Dutch.
He actually said something closer to 'you never know where those podium misses have been'.

 

[RedheadDane]

Re: Re:

Isn't sexism saying stuff about women (or men) in general?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sexism

So did he say something in the line off "these podium girls are sleeping with everyone cause they're girls"? Saying something about a specific group of women or girls isn't always sexist you know. It can definitely be perceived as offensive just as everything is offensive to someone nowadays, but that doesn't mean it's always racist or sexist, just cause people like using those words.

Is there a term for something that's being offensive towards people in a specific occupation? Another example could be claiming that - say - people who work in McD just needs to get an education.
Jobism? Naah...

Just seem like a little banter to me, I assume he just said it to his teammates?

It was an interview.

 

[hrotha]

It's not either/or, you know.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

Yes, implying that women are being kept around just so cyclists can have sex with them whenever they want is totally fine and people are just taking out of context.

His team should have dropped him, straight away. Their statement is just as offensive as what Bakelants said.

He was trying to crack a few jokes, you'll find more "offensive" jokes at any comedy show.

Bakelants is not saying "that women are being kept around just so cyclists can have sex with them whenever they want is totally fine". You just made that up so you could be outraged and ask him to be removed.

"definitely a packet of condoms. You never know where those podium hostesses are hanging out." Actual quote.

Not actual quote.
Poor translation from Dutch.
He actually said something closer to 'you never know where those podium misses have been'.

OH, well that makes it worse.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

So, saying that "I'm sorry that I offended you." doesn't put the blame squarely on the "I"?
Similar to "I'm sorry that I punched you." Surely in that case it wouldn't be implying that it's the person who was punched who's at fault.
Or saying "What I said was really offensive/hurtful."

It's the second bit that feels like an attempt to mitigate the blame. Just a bog standard "What I said was offensive. I apologise", is always the best way to do things. No confusion, no mis-interpretation. Just hands up, I did something wrong, I'm sorry.

But, to me it seems like a - perhaps failed - attempt at putting the blame even more on his own shoulders.

Fair enough.

 

[Ruby United]

Re:

Yes, implying that women are being kept around just so cyclists can have sex with them whenever they want is totally fine and people are just taking out of context.

His team should have dropped him, straight away. Their statement is just as offensive as what Bakelants said.

Wow! People need to calm down. Seriously.
He made a bad joke. He's not sexist. Yes, it wasn't the most intelligent of jokes but just get over it.
If he meant it seriously, then I would be concerned. But a small, misplaced joke....?
Come on

 

[Valv.Piti]

Okay, in an interview, then I can understand people getting offended. There is really no need to crack a joke like that when you know how people will react/respond. I was not tho, but you have to respect that some people are more sensitive to stuff like that..

 

[Samamba]

Re: Re:

Isn't sexism saying stuff about women (or men) in general?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sexism

So did he say something in the line off "these podium girls are sleeping with everyone cause they're girls"? Saying something about a specific group of women or girls isn't always sexist you know. It can definitely be perceived as offensive just as everything is offensive to someone nowadays, but that doesn't mean it's always racist or sexist, just cause people like using those words.

No sure if serious...

I'm serious.

Saying that a girl is a whore cause she's a girl is sexist, saying that a girl is a whore cause you experienced her being a whore is not sexist.

Saying that a group of black man are thieves cause they're black is racist, saying that a group of black man are thieves cause you saw them steal something isn't racist.

Thus...
Saying that podium girls can be a bit "loose" cause they're girls is sexist, saying that podium girls ca be a bit "loose" cause you experienced them being exactly that isn't sexist.
He never said something in the line of the first part, and also not exactly in the line of the second part. It's all about interpreting. You're constantly saying he's implying this and that but you don't know that.

 

[classicomano]

This world has gone insane. And Bakelants is a great guy, also very funny.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

Yes, implying that women are being kept around just so cyclists can have sex with them whenever they want is totally fine and people are just taking out of context.

His team should have dropped him, straight away. Their statement is just as offensive as what Bakelants said.

Wow! People need to calm down. Seriously.
He made a bad joke. He's not sexist. Yes, it wasn't the most intelligent of jokes but just get over it.
If he meant it seriously, then I would be concerned. But a small, misplaced joke....?
Come on

I'm unsure how you can argue that someone being sexist is not sexist...

 

[Jagartrott]

Re: Re:

Not actual quote.
Poor translation from Dutch.
He actually said something closer to 'you never know where those podium misses have been'.

OH, well that makes it worse.

I don't think so. I found the English translation more insulting.
What he said was a lame joke in response to a lame question.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

Isn't sexism saying stuff about women (or men) in general?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=sexism

So did he say something in the line off "these podium girls are sleeping with everyone cause they're girls"? Saying something about a specific group of women or girls isn't always sexist you know. It can definitely be perceived as offensive just as everything is offensive to someone nowadays, but that doesn't mean it's always racist or sexist, just cause people like using those words.

No sure if serious...

I'm serious.

Saying that a girl is a whore cause she's a girl is sexist, saying that a girl is a whore cause you experienced her being a whore is not sexist.

Saying that a group of black man are thieves cause they're black is racist, saying that a group of black man are thieves cause you saw them steal something isn't racist.

Thus...
Saying that podium girls can be a bit "loose" cause they're girls is sexist, saying that podium girls ca be a bit "loose" cause you experienced them being exactly that isn't sexist.
He never said something in the line of the first part, and also not exactly in the line of the second part. It's all about interpreting. You're constantly saying he's implying this and that but you don't know that.

Did you ever find that true Scotsman?

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

Not actual quote.
Poor translation from Dutch.
He actually said something closer to 'you never know where those podium misses have been'.

OH, well that makes it worse.

I don't think so. I found the English translation more insulting.
What he said was a lame joke in response to a lame question.

Really? At least with the first one you could make the, admittedly very weak, argument that he was just going to try his luck. The second one implies more that they all sleep around.

 

[classicomano]

This need for people these days to jump on everything they can find to be offended and outraged by just to feed their own ego and sense of moral superiority is lunacy. We should stop caving and apologizing to crazy people like King Boonen who immediately call for a young father to lose his job just because he made a dumb joke. They don't deserve it, they deserve nothing.

 

[Ruby United]

Re: Re:

Yes, implying that women are being kept around just so cyclists can have sex with them whenever they want is totally fine and people are just taking out of context.

His team should have dropped him, straight away. Their statement is just as offensive as what Bakelants said.

SJW alert.

I have no idea what that means?

Social Justice Warrior.

Statements that his team should have dropped him immediately and his daughter should not see him anymore are totally exaggerated. People are way too sensitive these days and this political correctness crap is getting out of hand. Just an excuse so the upset people could sleep again seems right in place.

Quite right.
Watch this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1ry8zmqGrA
Or this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDrVWaig9o4
Or any Ben Shapiro video, to be honest.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RY4R3_O7RE

 

[Echoes]

Re: Re:

The original purpose of that thread: Women - in clothes - actually riding bikes, was cool.
What it sorta merged into: Woman - mostly without clothes - just standing awkwardly with bikes as if they've never seen a bike before, was just sorta weird.

Oh don't be innocent. You know that that thread was intended to depict women as object for our (men's) eyes, whether they be clothed or not. Not to present them as subject.

Basically it shows how much we are in a world of images and how it's accepted. Pictures are mightier than words and current people can no longer speak correctly (with decent vocabulary) but also they may no longer speak. It's depressing. In this case, Bakelants is cracking a joke on women who are behaving as objects on their own accord. They just need to assume what they are doing after all ...

 

[Jagartrott]

Re: Re:

Really? At least with the first one you could make the, admittedly very weak, argument that he was just going to try his luck. The second one implies more that they all sleep around.

The English translation implied that those misses are there just to be taken advantage of. The actual quote implied both loose morals on his part and on the misses part - it's not sexism in my eyes because he's also belittling himself (why would it be worse that the podium misses sleep around, he's a father?). Anyway, this is just crap. Bakelants is actually a quite intelligent guy (he studied bio-engineering iirc) and not a nasty person. Poor taste in the interview, for sure, but nothing more.

 

[Ruby United]

Re: Re:

Yes, implying that women are being kept around just so cyclists can have sex with them whenever they want is totally fine and people are just taking out of context.

His team should have dropped him, straight away. Their statement is just as offensive as what Bakelants said.

Wow! People need to calm down. Seriously.
He made a bad joke. He's not sexist. Yes, it wasn't the most intelligent of jokes but just get over it.
If he meant it seriously, then I would be concerned. But a small, misplaced joke....?
Come on

I'm unsure how you can argue that someone being sexist is not sexist...

The same way I am white and I have made racist jokes before, yet I am not racist.
The same way I am a Jew and I've made antisemitic jokes before, yet I am not antisemitic.
The same way Pewdiepie (the YouTube guy - I don't really know him) made antisemitic jokes, yet is not (as far as I know) antisemitic
I'ts called a joke. It's doesn't define who they are.

Respect the civil liberty of freedom of speech. It is freedom of speech that separates Western democracies from the countries in the Middle East who execute women and gays on a daily basis.
People like you, who don't believe in freedom of speech, are the people who lose it when one 'homophobic', 'misogynistic', 'racist' or 'antisemitic' joke is said. Yet, ironically - and paradoxically-, it is only because of freedom of speech that these people have equal rights and equality of opportunity. Just look at the Middle East.

 

[King Boonen]

Re: Re:

Yes, implying that women are being kept around just so cyclists can have sex with them whenever they want is totally fine and people are just taking out of context.

His team should have dropped him, straight away. Their statement is just as offensive as what Bakelants said.

Wow! People need to calm down. Seriously.
He made a bad joke. He's not sexist. Yes, it wasn't the most intelligent of jokes but just get over it.
If he meant it seriously, then I would be concerned. But a small, misplaced joke....?
Come on

I'm unsure how you can argue that someone being sexist is not sexist...

The same way I am white and I have made racist jokes before, yet I am not racist.
The same way I am a Jew and I've made antisemitic jokes before, yet I am not antisemitic.
The same way Pewdiepie (the YouTube guy - I don't really know him) made antisemitic jokes, yet is not (as far as I know) antisemitic
I'ts called a joke. It's doesn't define who they are.

Respect the civil liberty of freedom of speech. It is freedom of speech that separates Western democracies from the countries in the Middle East who execute women and gays on a daily basis.
People like you, who don't believe in freedom of speech, are the people who lose it when one 'homophobic', 'misogynistic', 'racist' or 'antisemitic' joke is said. Yet, ironically - and paradoxically-, it is only because of freedom of speech that these people have equal rights and equality of opportunity. Just look at the Middle East.

Sorry, if you make racist jokes then you are a racist.

I'm not sure how you think I don't believe in freedom of speech, would you care to elaborate? If anything you seem to be the one suggesting I shouldn't express my opinion on this matter.

 

[hrotha]

Freedom of speech means he can't be prosecuted for what he says, it doesn't mean he's above criticism.