Astana Licence to be withdrawn?

[SkyTears]

Re: Re:

I would like to know what happens to Nibali if Astana are booted to pro-conti or conti level - the UCI are potentially taking out a team that can afford to employ riders long term....who would get Astana's licence?

I agree they have had too many positives, and that action needs to be taken but is taking their licence away the answer?

it would have been the right decision in a parallel world where Cookson had shown to be independent from Sky and British cycling.
now it just leaves a very bad taste in my mouth.
Astana's stream of positives last year compared to Cookson's repeated defense of Team Sky (both publicly and behind the scenes)...
Jan Ulrich can do the math on that one.

i'm curious to hear details and evidence about Cookson defence of Sky and especially the behind the courtain defence.

 

[msjett]

Re: Re:

I think booting them to continental level would be worse than actually kicking them out altogether....but they would be the winningest team on the continental level

Maybe so..

You guys are doping too much.. Go beat the sh!it of the continental teams

I wonder if the leak was intentional by the UCI.. To put pressure on the team to offer significant changes at the hearing? (vino out?)

lol....

Maybe the UCI do want Vino out, I can't even hazard a guess the reason why they make the decisions they do? and probably it is the reason I ask the questions I do...

Remember all the way back in 2008 when the ASO said NO Astana at the tour...but they were back in 2009 - could this be another one of those situations?

 

[the sceptic]

Re:

so Astana and Riis "booted" out. Sounds like a productive week.

Sounds like we are going to get a lot more brit wins in the future. What's next, Quintana positive?

 

[sniper]

Re: Re:

so Astana and Riis "booted" out. Sounds like a productive week.

Sounds like we are going to get a lot more brit wins in the future. What's next, Quintana positive?

UCI just 'balancing out' all the negative Sky publicity generated by the USADA report on Leinders.

 

[Susan Westemeyer]

This is the Astana thread, not Sky. Please stay on topic.

 

[WillemS]

If true, then Astana is going to delay the procedure by requesting a ’application to stay the execution’ pending the CAS verdict on the case. So, they'll probably race a couple more races.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Re:

If true, then Astana is going to delay the procedure by requesting a ’application to stay the execution’ pending the CAS verdict on the case. So, they'll probably race a couple more races.

What CAS case? If Astana wants to appeal, they have to submit their appeal first.

EDIT: It should be said, that if Astana wants to appeal a UCI decision, the UCI needs to make it's decision first. As of now, it is speculation.

 

[Rollthedice]

I don't get how an UCI official already knows the outcome since they will meet with Astana on April 2nd for a hearing. Neither do Astana:

The team has said that they would be disappointed to hear that they UCI have not followed the due process but if the report proves to be true, and a decision has been made, that they will appeal to the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS) immediately.

Furthermore:

“We’ve met all the obligations, we received the licence in December with the condition that we undergo an audit and that we serve as a demonstration team for the audit that all teams will go through at the beginning of 2017,” the team said. “And that we would implement the recommendations made by the audit, in order to serve as a model team. There was never any mention in the December licence issuance that the audit would determine whether or not we would keep the licence.”

I guess Cookson wants them out badly. CAS will get busy soon.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Re:

“And that we would implement the recommendations made by the audit, in order to serve as a model team. There was never any mention in the December licence issuance that the audit would determine whether or not we would keep the licence.”

I guess Cookson wants them out badly. CAS will get busy soon.

They must not have been paying attention.

"The combined effect of this is that the Astana Pro Team can be considered very much to be on probation." Cookson in December

“In the case of an unfavourable outcome to the audit – or if the team has a new doping case in 2015, the UCI can mandate the commission to rule on a possible withdrawal of the license.”" License Commission in December

 

[mrhender]

I think the UCI is communicating to the cycling world and not the least Astana and the "leak" is also a test-balloon.

They need Astana in the world-tour, but they also need to be taken seriously so they are putting the pressure on Astana to offer change...

When the going gets tough I do think some solution will be reached. But first play has to be hard and only granting continental is a position Astana might rather negotiate from than taking their chances at CAS..

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Re:

I think the UCI is communicating to the cycling world and not the least Astana and the "leak" is also a test-balloon.

They need Astana in the world-tour, but they also need to be taken seriously so they are putting the pressure on Astana to offer change...

When the going gets tough I do think some solution will be reached. But first play has to be hard and only granting continental is a position Astana might rather negotiate from than taking their chances at CAS..

It's certainly scared off a few. Saxo is riding like terrestrials. Froome and Wiggans are back to earth.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Re:

I don't get how an UCI official already knows the outcome since they will meet with Astana on April 2nd for a hearing. Neither do Astana:

The team has said that they would be disappointed to hear that they UCI have not followed the due process but if the report proves to be true, and a decision has been made, that they will appeal to the Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS) immediately.

Furthermore:

“We’ve met all the obligations, we received the licence in December with the condition that we undergo an audit and that we serve as a demonstration team for the audit that all teams will go through at the beginning of 2017,” the team said. “And that we would implement the recommendations made by the audit, in order to serve as a model team. There was never any mention in the December licence issuance that the audit would determine whether or not we would keep the licence.”

I guess Cookson wants them out badly. CAS will get busy soon.

This is standard operating procedure for the UCI.

*Something* happened that we don't actually know about to inspire firing the Kazakh squad and they couldn't do it without it vaguely fitting to some rules they decided to enforce.

Typical UCI though, the organization that issued the report is a sports science research group with no experience in sports administration and, surprise, is associated with Martial Saugy. Vrijman 3.0.

And then CAS itself is stacked with lawyers that work for the IOC sports federations when they aren't representing athletes, or working on arbitration panels. It will be interesting to see if Vino's luck at CAS is still good.

 

[70kmph]

Rather pointless as the riders will get absorbed into other teams and continue the whole cycle of taking their vitamins

 

[hrotha]

Re:

Rather pointless as the riders will get absorbed into other teams and continue the whole cycle of taking their vitamins

It's not about the riders, it's about the management, the doctors, the whole structure. Riders come and go and have relatively short careers; their impact on the problem is usually much smaller, with very few exceptions.

 

[happytramp]

Re: Re:

Rather pointless as the riders will get absorbed into other teams and continue the whole cycle of taking their vitamins

It's not about the riders, it's about the management, the doctors, the whole structure. Riders come and go and have relatively short careers; their impact on the problem is usually much smaller, with very few exceptions.

^^^^ This. Only when there's incentive for the management to have their riders ride clean can there be any real change.

 

[70kmph]

You may as well shut down all the teams in that case, this is simply discrimination for those riders who were careless and were caught
How many incidents have Sky already been involved with and yet no action is be taken there

 

[DirtyWorks]

Re:

You may as well shut down all the teams in that case, this is simply discrimination for those riders who were careless and were caught
How many incidents have Sky already been involved with and yet no action is be taken there

Yup. The federation makes it clear it's okay to dope.

The athlete and team apparently has no clue when they might go positive. But, until then, it's okay to dope.

The UCI manages the Image of a sport, like the WWE, not a sport. If you take that perspective, then so many things make more sense.

 

[SkyTears]

Re:

You may as well shut down all the teams in that case, this is simply discrimination for those riders who were careless and were caught
How many incidents have Sky already been involved with and yet no action is be taken there

how many epo & steroid positives had Sky last year ? im all ears

on the topic, im sure there a ton of hidden positives from TdF 2014 (hidden by ASO). whole Astana was doped at ridiculous levels.

Astana deserve to dissapear and from their riders maybe only Aru deserves to survive

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Re: Re:

You may as well shut down all the teams in that case, this is simply discrimination for those riders who were careless and were caught
How many incidents have Sky already been involved with and yet no action is be taken there

how many epo & steroid positives had Sky last year ? im all ears

on the topic, im sure there a ton of hidden positives from TdF 2014 (hidden by ASO). whole Astana was doped at ridiculous levels.

Astana deserve to dissapear and from their riders maybe only Aru deserves to survive

That's a choice question, asking for epo and steroid positives. No, no one tested positive for epo or steroids, except presumably Froome at Romandie with the TUE to avoid sanction. Ask about dodgy blood and you have JTL and Henao. Ask about "revelations" about staff's drug use and you have Knaven, Julich, Yates, Lienders, de Johng. Ask about steroids that didn't trip positive, and you have rampant cortisone use.

But yeah, no epo or steroid positives, so Sky is off the hook.

 

[hrotha]

Sky shouldn't be off the hook, but no EPO cases while Astana has had lots certainly means the two aren't comparable.

 

[King Boonen]

Re:

This is the Astana thread, not Sky. Please stay on topic.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Re:

EDIT: I needed the reminder

This is the Astana thread, not Sky. Please stay on topic.

 

[Netserk]

Re:

Sky shouldn't be off the hook, but no EPO cases while Astana has had lots certainly means the two aren't comparable.

Sure, but I doubt (m)any think Ag2r is worse than Sky. Or comparable to Astana.

 

[sniper]

Re:

Sky shouldn't be off the hook, but no EPO cases while Astana has had lots certainly means the two aren't comparable.

Astana have been doping since they exist, so have Sky.
Besides the obvious fact that one enjoys institutional protection while the other got heavily target-tested in 2013/14, why aren't they comparable?

 

[JimmyFingers]

That being an opinion, just saying