Bigger 2010 disappointment?

[Kwibus]

Radioshack for me, but I missed the period Sky hyped itself so badly that they made a fool of themselves.

Sky did 'ok' in the end. Ofcourse far from what they said they would do so if you look at it that way it certainly is dissapointing. I'm sure they will get better every year. The experience will help them. It's good to have a big english investment in cycling.

Radioshack failed in the Tour which was THE place they wanted to shine. Allthough I guess same goes for Sky. I guess they were both dissapointing

 

[euanli]

I think I'm missing what everyone means by the hype. The marginal gains stuff as far as I'm aware is about experimenting, theorising, getting stuff right, getting it wrong and learning from it. I never expected them to know everything about road cycle to make these improvements from the get go.

However they have successfully created a brand in cycling and engaged well with their supporters which is impressive. And the bus is pimping.

 

[gingerwallaceafro]

I thought SKY were disappointing although they were 4th or 5th on number of wins through the season, a stat that surprised me. All in all I think cycling is better off from their presence and I'm pleased to see them continue. They definitely earmarked the Tour as a goal and failed badly. The Tour of Britain was a disaster..

Radioshack... Lance obviously had a nightmare Tour despite showing good form in the Tour of Switzerland, Horner could have done better in the Tour if he hadn't been working for LA for half of it. Brajkovic's win in the Dauphine was awesome against an overweight Contador coming back from 'flu and suffering from allergies (hence the Clenbuterol). I hope Brajkovic becomes the focus of the team, I think he's special.

 

[Anonymous]

Radioshack for me, but I missed the period Sky hyped itself so badly that they made a fool of themselves.

So did I. the only hype they officially put out was the aim to provide a british winner of the tour de france within 5 years. Much of the rest was the press.

By far more dissapointing than these two was BMC. judging by the hype ACF made of them and their potentially dominant cobbled classics team, their superb ardennes team, and the fact they had much better riders to support cadel in the grand tours than lotto had, they sucked big time. Most races they were in people didnt even know they were there.

If Omloop het Volk is your biggest win with that money behind you you've failed incredibly hard.

With what money? Where has this myth come from that Sky have more money than anybody else. There are at least 5, maybe 6 teams in the pro tour with bigger budgets.

Anyway, if you listened to the RS hype lance was going to win number 8 Radioshack managed also to make a laughing stock of themselves in california, missing the giro, lance and jersey gate in the tour, stamping their feet about the vuelta non-invite, threatening legal action over lombardia.. Fiasco from beginning to end.

My top 2 failures
BMC
Shack

 

[Altitude]

So did I. the only hype they officially put out was the aim to provide a british winner of the tour de france within 5 years. Much of the rest was the press.

I seem to remember them being touted as the "Manchester United" of cycling by a certain British rider who had essentially just told his previous team (with whom he still had a contract for next season) to pi$$ off.

 

[Anonymous]

I seem to remember them being touted as the "Manchester United" of cycling by a certain British rider who had essentially just told his previous team (with whom he still had a contract for next season) to pi$$ off.

Right, and that loosely translates as "we are going to win two monuments, the tour de france and the world championships".. like i say, press and internet ds's blew what comments where made out of all proportion. the thing is, weve got a team who are open with the fans, and on the whole honest, they flack they get is just going to make them shut doors and act like the rest of the teams. There are very few examples of Sky actually making any big predictions, in fact in most articles (and ive read pretty much all of them) they did the opposite. Making very small games and optimistic "ideally it would be nice to" comments.

Besides, how many years did it take Alex Ferguson to start winning titles at united? Six years!!!! So so far they are on target. In his first season at United they finished 11th in the league (w14 d14 l14). Sky are the 6th most winningest team in the pro tour so are better than man utd, On CQ rank they are the 12th best placed pro tour team so admittedly on that basis they are marginally worse than man utd. Five years to go..

BTW, i do realise most people just say Sky without even thinking about it rationally.

 

[auscyclefan94]

So did I. the only hype they officially put out was the aim to provide a british winner of the tour de france within 5 years. Much of the rest was the press.

By far more dissapointing than these two was BMC. judging by the hype ACF made of them and their potentially dominant cobbled classics team, their superb ardennes team, and the fact they had much better riders to support cadel in the grand tours than lotto had, they sucked big time. Most races they were in people didnt even know they were there.



With what money? Where has this myth come from that Sky have more money than anybody else. There are at least 5, maybe 6 teams in the pro tour with bigger budgets.

Anyway, if you listened to the RS hype lance was going to win number 8 Radioshack managed also to make a laughing stock of themselves in california, missing the giro, lance and jersey gate in the tour, stamping their feet about the vuelta non-invite, threatening legal action over lombardia.. Fiasco from beginning to end.

My top 2 failures
BMC
Shack

Good work at baiting moron! Please tell me how BMC were failures? no one really expected them to be up there with the team they had. Open your fricken eyes and watch and learn about the sport ofcycling. Seriously if you come up with comments like that it doesn't do much good for your reputation as a poster.

With all the money Sky had to splurge about on riders and technology there season was a failure. Also, I find it funny that they go and get wiggins who really is unproven in stage races because he only really pefromed in one in his whole career.

Though it is not just you that does this, others say this about BMC that they have failed but then say most of their riders are not up to pro continental standards. People need to make up their fricken minds. You have to look at expectations against number of wins.

Sky failed and you just are too naive to handle it.

 

[Anonymous]

Good work at baiting moron! Please tell me how BMC were failures? no one really expected them to be up there with the team they had. Open your fricken eyes and watch and learn about the sport ofcycling. Seriously if you come up with comments like that it doesn't do much good for your reputation as a poster.

With all the money Sky had to splurge about on riders and technology there season was a failure. Also, I find it funny that they go and get wiggins who really is unproven in stage races because he only really pefromed in one in his whole career.

Though it is not just you that does this, others say this about BMC that they have failed but then say most of their riders are not up to pro continental standards. People need to make up their fricken minds. You have to look at expectations against number of wins.

Sky failed and you just are too naive to handle it.

Ok, firstly I wasnt baiting. Just because someone has an honest opinion about BMC does not mean they are baiting you. stop taking things so personally.

Secondly, i posted without descending to insults, reputation as a poster, niave.. In your opinion. Just because our opinion differs does not mean I am wrong, nor does it mean you are.

What you fail to do amidst the fist pumping and foot stomping is actually address any of the points or raise any decent arguments. - At least if you are going to claim failure come up with something valid rather than just puffing your cheaks out and stomping your feet

Lets address budget. All these figures are approx. Team Sky e10m, shack e10m Rabobank e10m, katusha e10m, htc e15m, Bbelieved to be in the region of e10m, Astana e11m, Sky are not dramatically rich. Bang for Buck liquigas are by far the best value at about e6m a year.

BMC no expectations.. some of your comments from earlier in the year.

On the Tour

I think it's possible if Contador is out of the picture, with guys like Hincapie, Ballan and Burghardt on the team for the flats/cobbles BMC could really put the hammer down and possibly eliminate some of the favourites. With the support of BMC, they maybe young but their are a lot of riders who have some firepower on the climbs. Guys like Thomas Frei , Santambrogio and Mathias Frank are very good climbers and Frei and Frank are also strong in the itt. Hincapie will be a big factor as he is always handy and can do anything for a team leader.

On evans winning the tour

He doesn't have to drop contador... stay within descent reach of contador and then we have the final tt which will not suit contador. PLUS Cobbles are the key in 2010... The tour will be lost for some after the 3rd or 4th day...

You had BMC winning the tour, told us in january that their classics squad was one of the best, and the utterly failed to live up to YOUR hype.

Basically, BMC have the money, they have a very experienced squad and achieved next to nothing. Shack have a lot of money, a lot of very good riders, probably 3 riders that would be considered GC contenders and came up very short.

Sky were in their FIRST YEAR. The best comparison for Sky is probably the cervelo test team of last year. Sky picked up 22 wins this year, do you know how many cervelo got in 2009???? Twenty Five.. Only three more than Sky managed this year, and they had a vastly more talented team, Haussler (ebh), Hushovd (flecha?) Sastre (??????) Gerrans (illness issues this year), Hammond (cummings???).

Cervelo 2009 - Wins 25, 2nd places 27, 3rd places 27
Sky 2010 - Wins 22, 2nd places 22, 3rd places 27

I would say they are not too dissimilar, yet everyone said how great Cervelo did.

Now at least come back with a credible argument rather than just personal critique

 

[auscyclefan94]

Ok, firstly I wasnt baiting. Just because someone has an honest opinion about BMC does not mean they are baiting you. stop taking things so personally.

Secondly, i posted without descending to insults, reputation as a poster, niave.. In your opinion. Just because our opinion differs does not mean I am wrong, nor does it mean you are.

What you fail to do amidst the fist pumping and foot stomping is actually address any of the points or raise any decent arguments. - At least if you are going to claim failure come up with something valid rather than just puffing your cheaks out and stomping your feet

Lets address budget. All these figures are approx. Team Sky e10m, shack e10m Rabobank e10m, katusha e10m, htc e15m, Bbelieved to be in the region of e10m, Astana e11m, Sky are not dramatically rich. Bang for Buck liquigas are by far the best value at about e6m a year.

BMC no expectations.. some of your comments from earlier in the year.

On the Tour

On evans winning the tour


You had BMC winning the tour, told us in january that their classics squad was one of the best, and the utterly failed to live up to YOUR hype.

Basically, BMC have the money, they have a very experienced squad and achieved next to nothing. Shack have a lot of money, a lot of very good riders, probably 3 riders that would be considered GC contenders and came up very short.

Sky were in their FIRST YEAR. The best comparison for Sky is probably the cervelo test team of last year. Sky picked up 22 wins this year, do you know how many cervelo got in 2009???? Twenty Five.. Only three more than Sky managed this year, and they had a vastly more talented team, Haussler (ebh), Hushovd (flecha?) Sastre (??????) Gerrans (illness issues this year), Hammond (cummings???).

Cervelo 2009 - Wins 25, 2nd places 27, 3rd places 27
Sky 2010 - Wins 22, 2nd places 22, 3rd places 27

I would say they are not too dissimilar, yet everyone said how great Cervelo did.

Now at least come back with a credible argument rather than just personal critique

The baiting part is disputable. If you take some of those comments seriously then you need to understand humour. At least half of bmc's riders were there first year in the big time and some of them were not near ready for it.

Zahner, Wyss, Stewart, Stalder, Schar, Nydam, murphy, louder, Kristoff, Kohler, Frank, Butler, Bookwalter, beyer and barton had all never ridden a grand tour in their lives let alone race in the top level of world cycling. That's 65% of the team. I would say BMC were dissapointing in the classics but overall a par performnace. Now if he we have less than 15 wins next season i think it would be dissapointing. These guys are not overly formidable riders.

now only 2 riders (7%) at sky had not raced a grand tour before. much more expreinced squad.

Some more stats, total career wins BMC: 280 Sky: 513, days raced in 2010: BMC: 490 Sky: 652 This is from June 2010 so the days raced would not change overly much or would possibly increase in sky's favour.

You barely addressed my arguements either, but don't worry because I know the reason.

Figures I have say that HTC are on $10m euros and Sky are on $11mllion euros. These are validated statistics.

 

[LukeSchmid]

I think BMC's biggest problem this year was they recruited mostly 1 day riders, and planned to focus on classics not GTs.Then Cadel Evans came along and they signed him late in the peice. They had very little climbing quality to support Evans in GTs. Of what they had as climbers, Frei got busted for doping, Moriabito pulled out of the Giro because of illness and Frank crashed out of the Tour de France in the prologue.
With Kroon being seriously injured in a crash and Santambrogio and Ballan being suspended alot of their better riders had interrupted seasons which did not help things. With a squad with so little depth they needed everything to go right and it certainly did not. BMC also suffered from not having a decent sprinter. Kristoff might develop into that, but Wyss is not very good.
However with Cadel Evans they had rider that did far more individually than any rider on Sky or Radioshack and produced some great moments of racing.

 

[Anonymous]

Figures I have say that HTC are on $10m euros and Sky are on $11mllion euros. These are validated statistics.

well official tour de france guide has HTC at 15m for one

 

[LukeSchmid]

The baiting part is disputable. If you take some of those comments seriously then you need to understand humour. At least half of bmc's riders were there first year in the big time and some of them were not near ready for it.

Zahner, Wyss, Stewart, Stalder, Schar, Nydam, murphy, louder, Kristoff, Kohler, Frank, Butler, Bookwalter, beyer and barton had all never ridden a grand tour in their lives let alone race in the top level of world cycling. That's 65% of the team. I would say BMC were dissapointing in the classics but overall a par performnace. Now if he we have less than 15 wins next season i think it would be dissapointing. These guys are not overly formidable riders.

now only 2 riders (7%) at sky had not raced a grand tour before. much more expreinced squad.

Some more stats, total career wins BMC: 280 Sky: 513, days raced in 2010: BMC: 490 Sky: 652 This is from June 2010 so the days raced would not change overly much or would possibly increase in sky's favour.

You barely addressed my arguements either, but don't worry because I know the reason.

Figures I have say that HTC are on $10m euros and Sky are on $11mllion euros. These are validated statistics.

Stalder did the 2006 Vuelta de Espana so had 1 GT finish.

 

[ansimi]

I thought they both had an OK debut season.

My only major Sky disappointment was missing EBH at some races when he was injured. I think Sky is in it for the long haul and will improve.

I was fully prepared to hate everything about Radioshack but I enjoyed Horner and Brajkovic. I don't think Radioshack is in it for the long haul and have even lower expectations for them next year.

 

[maltiv]

Cervelo 2009 - Wins 25, 2nd places 27, 3rd places 27
Sky 2010 - Wins 22, 2nd places 22, 3rd places 27

You do realise 8 of Cervelo's 25 wins were GT stages, and they also got the points jersey in the TDF and two top 10 gc... So basically Cervelos 2009 GT results alone were vastly superior to Sky's entire season.

Sky has failed this year, but not without a reason. They've been extremely unlucky with injuries amongst their better riders, and generally most of the team has under-performed. Simon Gerrans was no where near his 2009 form, Serge Pauwels went from being a good climber at Cervelo into becoming completely invisible at Sky, Augustyn has done nothing, Arvesen has done nothing...and so on.

 

[auscyclefan94]

I think BMC's biggest problem this year was they recruited mostly 1 day riders, and planned to focus on classics not GTs.Then Cadel Evans came along and they signed him late in the peice. They had very little climbing quality to support Evans in GTs. Of what they had as climbers, Frei got busted for doping, Moriabito pulled out of the Giro because of illness and Frank crashed out of the Tour de France in the prologue.
With Kroon being seriously injured in a crash and Santambrogio and Ballan being suspended alot of their better riders had interrupted seasons which did not help things. With a squad with so little depth they needed everything to go right and it certainly did not. BMC also suffered from not having a decent sprinter. Kristoff might develop into that, but Wyss is not very good.
However with Cadel Evans they had rider that did far more individually than any rider on Sky or Radioshack and produced some great moments of racing.

Excellent post! Spot on! Wyss is not that bad of a sprinter but I guess he could help leadout Kristoff.

well official tour de france guide has HTC at 15m for one

my tour de france guide book has them at 10 euros million

@Luke Schmid, I personally think that Simon Gerrans' form was not an issue this year but because he generally wins from breakaways or places in group sprints (like LBL last year) that his results looked better than they were.
No doubt he is a good one day racer but still over rated.

Dim I have come back with multiple credible arguements and you can only pick me up on the budget arguement? Says a lot! It wasn't just "my hype" about BMC classics team. BMC definetly did under perform in the cobbled classics but don't tell me that BMC's cobbled team is not formidable. I can concede that. Maybe you should concede some of the issues multiple posters have brought up.

People, you need to look at expectations V results.

 

[auscyclefan94]

Sky 2010

Cancer Council Helpline Classic None Greg Henderson (NZL) Australia Rymill Park, Adelaide
Tour Down Under, Stage 6 UCI ProTour Sutton, ChrisChris Sutton (AUS) Australia Adelaide
Tour of Qatar, Stage 1 UCI Asia Tour Team time trial Qatar West Bay Lagoon
Tour of Oman, Stage 3 UCI Asia Tour Boasson Hagen, EdvaldEdvald Boasson Hagen (NOR) Oman Qurayyat
Tour of Oman, Stage 6 UCI Asia Tour Boasson Hagen, EdvaldEdvald Boasson Hagen (NOR) Oman Muscat
Tour of Oman, Points classification UCI Asia Tour Boasson Hagen, EdvaldEdvald Boasson Hagen (NOR) Oman
Tour of Oman, Young rider classification UCI Asia Tour Boasson Hagen, EdvaldEdvald Boasson Hagen (NOR) Oman
Omloop Het Nieuwsblad UCI Europe Tour Flecha, Juan AntonioJuan Antonio Flecha (ESP) Belgium Ghent
Paris-Nice, Stage 1 UCI World Ranking Henderson, GregGreg Henderson (NZL) France Contres
Tirreno–Adriatico, Stage 7 UCI World Ranking Boasson Hagen, EdvaldEdvald Boasson Hagen (NOR) Italy San Benedetto del Tronto Critérium International, Stage 2 UCI Europe Tour Downing, RussellRussell Downing (GBR) France Porto-Vecchio
Giro d'Italia, Stage 1 UCI World Ranking Wiggins, BradleyBradley Wiggins (GBR) Netherlands Amsterdam
Tour de Picardie, Stage 2 UCI Europe Tour Swift, BenBen Swift (GBR) France Cires-lès-Mello
Tour de Picardie, General classification UCI Europe Tour Swift, BenBen Swift (GBR) France
Tour de Picardie, Points classification UCI Europe Tour Swift, BenBen Swift (GBR) France
Tour de Picardie, Teams classification UCI Europe Tour [N 1] France
Tour de Picardie, Young rider classification UCI Europe Tour Swift, BenBen Swift (GBR) France
Critérium du Dauphiné, Stage 7 UCI ProTour Boasson Hagen, EdvaldEdvald Boasson Hagen (NOR) France Sallanches
Ster Elektrotoer, Stage 3 UCI Europe Tour Henderson, GregGreg Henderson (NZL) Netherlands Schimmert
Norwegian National Time Trial Championships National Championship Boasson Hagen, EdvaldEdvald Boasson Hagen (NOR) Norway Orkanger
British National Road Race Championships National Championship Thomas, GeraintGeraint Thomas (GBR) United Kingdom Pendle
Brixia Tour, Stage 3 UCI Europe Tour Sutton, ChrisChris Sutton (AUS) Italy Pisogne
Tour de Wallonie, Stage 5 UCI Europe Tour Downing, RussellRussell Downing (GBR) Belgium Welkenraedt
Tour de Wallonie, General classification UCI Europe Tour Downing, RussellRussell Downing (GBR) Belgium
Dutch Food Valley Classic UCI Europe Tour Boasson Hagen, EdvaldEdvald Boasson Hagen (NOR) Netherlands Veenendaal
Eneco Tour, Stage 4 UCI ProTour Henderson, GregGreg Henderson (NZL) Netherlands Roermond
August 24 Eneco Tour, Points classification UCI ProTour Boasson Hagen, EdvaldEdvald Boasson Hagen (NOR) Belgium/ Netherlands
September 5 British National Time Trial Championships National Championship Wiggins, BradleyBradley Wiggins (GBR) United Kingdom Llandeilo
September 12 Tour of Britain, Stage 2 UCI Europe Tour Henderson, Greg Henderson (NZL) United Kingdom Stoke-on-Trent
September 18 Tour of Britain, Points classification UCI Europe Tour Greg Henderson (NZL) Great Britain


Cervelo 2009
February 2 Tour of Qatar, Stage 2 UCI Asia Tour Hammond, RogerRoger Hammond (GBR) Qatar Al Khor
February 6 Tour of Qatar, Teams classification UCI Asia Tour Qatar
February 6 Tour of Qatar, Points classification UCI Asia Tour Haussler, HeinrichHeinrich Haussler (GER) Qatar
February 6 Tour of Qatar, Young rider classification UCI Asia Tour Haussler, HeinrichHeinrich Haussler (GER) Qatar
February 17 Tour of California, Stage 3 UCI America Tour Hushovd, ThorThor Hushovd (NOR) United States Modesto
February 18 Volta ao Algarve, Stage 1 UCI Europe Tour Haussler, HeinrichHeinrich Haussler (GER) Portugal Olhao
February 22 Volta ao Algarve, Stage 5 UCI Europe Tour Haussler, HeinrichHeinrich Haussler (GER) Portugal Portimão
February 28 Omloop Het Nieuwsblad UCI Europe Tour Hushovd, ThorThor Hushovd (NOR) Belgium Gent
March 9 Paris–Nice, Stage 2 UCI World Calendar Haussler, HeinrichHeinrich Haussler (GER) France La Chapelle-Saint-Ursin
March 15 Giro del Mendrisiotto UCI Europe Tour Konovalovas, IgnatasIgnatas Konovalovas (LTU) Switzerland Mendrisiotto
May 18 Volta a Catalunya, Stage 1 UCI ProTour Hushovd, ThorThor Hushovd (NOR) Spain Lloret de Mar
May 23 Volta a Catalunya, Stage 6 UCI ProTour Hushovd, ThorThor Hushovd (NOR) Spain Barcelona
May 23 Giro d'Italia, Stage 14 UCI World Ranking Gerrans, SimonSimon Gerrans (AUS) Italy Bologna
May 25 Giro d'Italia, Stage 16 UCI World Ranking Sastre, CarlosCarlos Sastre (ESP) Italy Monte Petrano
May 29 Giro d'Italia, Stage 19 UCI World Ranking Sastre, CarlosCarlos Sastre (ESP) Italy Mount Vesuvius
May 31 Giro d'Italia, Stage 21 UCI World Ranking Konovalovas, IgnatasIgnatas Konovalovas (LTU) Italy Rome
June 6 GP Triberg-Schwarzwald UCI Europe Tour Haussler, HeinrichHeinrich Haussler (GER) Germany Triberg im Schwarzwald
July 9 Tour de France, Stage 6 UCI World Ranking Hushovd, ThorThor Hushovd (NOR) Spain Barcelona
July 17 Tour de France, Stage 13 UCI World Ranking Haussler, HeinrichHeinrich Haussler (GER) France Colmar
July 26 Tour de France, Points classification UCI World Ranking Hushovd, ThorThor Hushovd (NOR) France
August 1 Danmark Rundt, Stage 4 UCI Europe Tour Hunt, JeremyJeremy Hunt (GBR) Denmark Køge
August 23 GP Ouest-France UCI ProTour Gerrans, SimonSimon Gerrans (AUS) France Plouay
August 27 Tour du Poitou-Charentes, Stage 4 UCI Europe Tour Hushovd, ThorThor Hushovd (NOR) France Loudun
August 28 Tour du Poitou-Charentes, Stage 5 UCI Europe Tour Haussler, HeinrichHeinrich Haussler (GER) France Poitiers
September 8 Vuelta a España, Stage 10 UCI World Ranking Gerrans, SimonSimon Gerrans (AUS) Spain Murcia
September 9 Tour of Missouri, Stage 3 UCI America Tour Hushovd, ThorThor Hushovd (NOR) United States Rolla
September 13 Tour of Missouri, Points classification UCI America Tour Hushovd, ThorThor Hushovd (NOR) United States
September 17 Vuelta a España, Stage 18 UCI World Ranking Deignan, PhilipPhilip Deignan (IRL) Spain Ávila

16 Cervelo victories in strong races against 10 for sky

 

[Christian]

With what money? Where has this myth come from that Sky have more money than anybody else. There are at least 5, maybe 6 teams in the pro tour with bigger budgets.

It feels like Sky more ostentatiously displayed the fact that they have a crapload of money. Buying out Wigans, the Jaguars, the team bus, the weather van, iPhones for everyone ...

Of course it could well be that other teams' buses are just as expensive and that they give out free iPhones as well but if so I feel like they are more discrete about it. Katusha for example probably has the largest budget, but I feel like they never made such a big deal about it.

You're probably right that the press is responsible for creating that image of Sky, but to a certain extend I can't help but feel that they're responsible themselves

/edit: I just hope Team Luxembourg won't fall into the same trap next year with their Mercedes!

 

[stefrees]

It feels like Sky more ostentatiously displayed the fact that they have a crapload of money. Buying out Wigans, the Jaguars, the team bus, the weather van, iPhones for everyone ...

Of course it could well be that other teams' buses are just as expensive and that they give out free iPhones as well but if so I feel like they are more discrete about it. Katusha for example probably has the largest budget, but I feel like they never made such a big deal about it.

You're probably right that the press is responsible for creating that image of Sky, but to a certain extend I can't help but feel that they're responsible themselves

/edit: I just hope Team Luxembourg won't fall into the same trap next year with their Mercedes!

It's when teams start turning up with Aston martins you have to worry

 

[sublimit]

Obviously the bitter Garmin fans cant stand the sight of SKY but the Shack have been lame to the point of useless. SKY have been carried by Hendo, Flecha, Hagen all picking up good wins and some reasonable wins by Downing, Swift, Sutton in other races etc..

So its no contest really.

 

[pmcg76]

Well, we all know RadioShack was built for one man and one race but they failed miserably. One rider scraping into the Top 10 at the Tour thanks to a break when the previous year they were touting a clean sweep of the podium with the same riders (minus Contaor) at Astana is a huge letdown. Think back to the off-season when all the hype was about how 'the Shack' were going to defeat Contador and all the Lance v Contador rubbish. Yes, we knew it was BS but just goes to show what the media's priorities are, sales over quality. Also, a non-exsistent Classics arm and failure to win their other main target California suggest total failure.

On the flip side, RadioShack did win Basque Country & Dauphine Libere both of which are good races. I now have to take an interest in 'the Shack' as one of our Irish boys has signed for them. Personally, I think RadioShack could be decent next year but need to boot Bruyneel/Lance completely(unlikely I know) and totally change their aims to other parts of the season. Forget Levi & Kloeden and focus on Brajkovic, Machado and the younger guys. A big ask I guess.

SKY, a lot of people complaining about the hype surrounding but considering they are the first ever major British cycling team team, I thought that was kinda understandable. They got on the wrong side of people early on with the Wiggins saga but I agree the media went a bit OTT about them.

I never expected anything of Wiggins at the Tour and the rest of the team never looked to have more than small races/stage winning capabilities, a kinda HTC-Lite without Cavendish/Greipel. They did suffer with injuries to key riders like EBH/ Arvesen but quite a few were also dissappointments, Gerrans, Pauwels, Froome, Augustyn & many more.

Overall, I dont think SKY were a disaster, plenty of wins but lacking big results. RadioShack were the bigger dissappointment to me as the Tour was their only aim and they did even worse than I expected there.

As for BMC, a great Classics team on paper but rubbish on the roads, a one man team if there ever was one but we knew that of course. 4 wins all season, worst of the so called 'Big teams' in the peloton.

 

[auscyclefan94]

.

As for BMC, a great Classics team on paper but rubbish on the roads, a one man team if there ever was one but we knew that of course. 4 wins all season, worst of the so called 'Big teams' in the peloton.

How is BMC one of the "big teams" on paper? On paper they would be one of the little teams?

Still awaiting TSF's response to my credible arguements...

 

[jsem94]

RS had dauphine, a tour stage, branbaste pijl, Pais Vasco.

Sky had Omloop Het Nieuwsblad, Giro prologue, same stage wins by henderson & EBH.
Lövkvist woulda won Strade Bianche if he knew how to sprint...

 

[Mellow Velo]

I don't see what the problem is with BMC.
They performed exactly as most pundits here expected.
4 wins tells the story of their season.
A lightweight squad of youngsters and on the slide, classics men.
In reality Sky also performed to the pundits forecast and only failed to live up to the wildly inflated expectations of a few.
The Shack were probably the biggest failure, simply because the failed to achieve any of their major goals.
In all other aspects, they had a reasonable season.

 

[maltiv]

In reality Sky also performed to the pundits forecast and only failed to live up to the wildly inflated expectations of a few.

I think the problem here is that the team were heavily overrating themselves, making people believe they'd have some amazing season. But looking at the squad before the season started it was quite obvious that they wouldn't live up to their self-inflicted hype.

The team had no real climber (they only have one win in a hilly stage this season, which was won by their "sprinter"), no dominating sprinter (their best sprinter is not really a sprinter!), no reliable GT contender, two guys who could win classics (one of which were injured), one guy who could do well hilly classics (who had no form at all the entire season)...

 

[Anonymous]

How is BMC one of the "big teams" on paper? On paper they would be one of the little teams?

Still awaiting TSF's response to my credible arguements...

your credible argument was that you read that HTC budget was 10m and Sky's 11m which is contrary to my findings.

Your credible argument was that Sky have more GT experience than BMC which i dont disagree with, and more experience generally, which i also dont disagree with i just dont see its relevance.

You then attempt to prove that cervelos quality of wins was better than sky's. again i dont disagree but is largely irrelevant. I was just attempting to show that win wise they had a similar number of wins and podiums so while cervelo did better, to have cervelo's debut season as amazing, and skys debut season as appaling is ridiculous. Yes on the scale of success they are not the same, but they are far from being at opposite ends of the spectrum.

I think if i just said that Radioshack were worse than sky we would not be having this discussion. Its because I had the gaul to bring your beloved BMC into it. Who i still beleive in my opinion had a far worse season than Sky considering all the hype you built up around how BMC would dominate the classics and cadel would win the tour.

merry christmas