Bordry's people interviewed by novitzky folks and Usada

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Sep 24, 2009
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Cobblestoned said:
Of course, for me, the haters. Quiet entertaining to see these euphoric people in last few days.
You give them your little Novotzky and they take the whole hand and totally haul off. Gone by malicious joy. I wonder how they manage all these threads while always telling the same.
I prefer this Berzin guy. If I could chose one, it would be him. LMAO
Then Rrrrrradio, because he thinks Lance is even stupid, which you read almost never.
The one and only good-responder - our exclusive Lanceness. Tourminator is wrong now. He's the superresponding donkey and exclusive Exclusivnator exclusively protected.

They paint their world how they like it. Like Pipi Langstrumpf, you know. :D
"I have a house, a monkey and a horse la la la lala"
Repeat their rumors and thoughts 1000 times, so they believe it's a fact after some time and hope that people do that, too. Blind to the left and right. Just straight on their target and own logics. Applauding each other and giving 5 to themselfes.
Look - the clinic proved....
thehog said ""...
yesterday someone told me....
Novitzky is my source...
Floyd said...

Well, I remember that I was one of the three monkeys because I don't hate Lance, later I was one of the 3 Stooges. 3 Stooges were then dissolved because of a ban. Then found a new member, reunited and dissolved again because of ban, meanwhile the two left Stooges were banned for some time, too.

But see: 3 apes and 3 Stooges even admit that they are often joking with their Lancelove, but all these Mr.Langstrumpfs really think they are serious and that it's still healthy what they expose here.
But they don't hate Lance, of course. Only interested in clean cycling....
Dude!!!

What are you planning to do when the clay feet topple your idol and your world is turned upside down?:)
 
Apr 7, 2009
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All this talk about Blood Doping, yet we have only two 'confirmed' blood dopers...Hamilton and Vino. But the funny thing is, is there really a test for blood doping? If there is, and based on the readings here, everyone is doing it, shouldn't more people have been caught by now?

I bet Hamilton wakes up everyday and says WTF??

Any thoughts to maybe Novisky is trying to bust the dope ring, more than Armstrong? Armstrong is just the 'media spin'?
 
mwbyrd said:
All this talk about Blood Doping, yet we have only two 'confirmed' blood dopers...Hamilton and Vino. But the funny thing is, is there really a test for blood doping? If there is, and based on the readings here, everyone is doing it, shouldn't more people have been caught by now?

I bet Hamilton wakes up everyday and says WTF??

Any thoughts to maybe Novisky is trying to bust the dope ring, more than Armstrong? Armstrong is just the 'media spin'?
As of yet, there's no validated test for autologous transfusions. You might have heard about Contador's plasticizers levels - that's from one test that's being developed. So no, right now autologous transfusions can't be detected directly, and that's mostly why the biological passport was introduced: to detect them indirectly. It's not very effective.

Hamilton, Vino and Kasechkin were caught because they used someone else's blood.
 
Oct 25, 2010
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mwbyrd said:
All this talk about Blood Doping, yet we have only two 'confirmed' blood dopers...Hamilton and Vino. But the funny thing is, is there really a test for blood doping? If there is, and based on the readings here, everyone is doing it, shouldn't more people have been caught by now?

I bet Hamilton wakes up everyday and says WTF??

Any thoughts to maybe Novisky is trying to bust the dope ring, more than Armstrong? Armstrong is just the 'media spin'?
There really is a test for blood transfusions, but the riders (ironically) beat it by boosting the new RBC count by injecting EPO. Then they dilute the EPO by doing IV saline. EPO has a short half-life, so (ahem) the boyz are rather upset at the possibility of being tested in the middle of the night. You see, a night test would nail them for the EPO molecule itself.

Riders need to boost the "new" RBC count because the transfusion test can identify a rider who has too many "aging" RBCs in his bloodstream.
 
Oct 25, 2010
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hrotha said:
As of yet, there's no validated test for autologous transfusions. You might have heard about Contador's plasticizers levels - that's from one test that's being developed. So no, right now autologous transfusions can't be detected directly, and that's mostly why the biological passport was introduced: to detect them indirectly. It's not very effective.

Hamilton, Vino and Kasechkin were caught because they used someone else's blood.
Ashendon has spoken of the autologous test in interviews.
 
Mar 8, 2010
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buckwheat said:
Dude!!!

What are you planning to do when the clay feet topple your idol and your world is turned upside down?:)
I will exactly do, what the superpredicting haters always did, when they failed and failed again. :p
(Lance won't start....finish....Lance will get busted in France...) just to name a few examples.

Just go on and on and on.
BTW, Lance is not my idol. It's of course der Jan. But I always respected and admired Lance nonetheless.

I can tell you that June 2006 turned the world upside down. Was not nice. :(
 
Sep 24, 2009
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Cobblestoned said:
I will exactly do, what the superpredicting haters always did, when they failed and failed again. :p
(Lance won't start....finish....Lance will get busted in France...) just to name a few examples.

Just go on and on and on.
BTW, Lance is not my idol. It's of course der Jan. But I always respected and admired Lance nonetheless.

I can tell you that June 2006 turned the world upside down. Was not nice. :(
So then why are you ignoring his profound mathematical observation?

You know, one and one......see my sig...
 
Mar 8, 2010
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Beckmann (ARD) to Ullrich:
"Ownblooddoping is not detectable."

Ullrich:
"Well, then you know more than me... :rolleyes: !"

:D
 
Mar 8, 2010
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buckwheat said:
So then why are you ignoring his profound mathematical observation?

You know, one and one......see my sig...
I do not, buckwheat, I do not.
You really think that I mean Lance was clean or an angel ? :D

But I am just talking about some wishful extremes, about exaggerations I can only laugh about. Not more.
 
Jul 6, 2010
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Cobblestoned said:
Of course, for me, the haters. Quiet entertaining to see these euphoric people in last few days.
You give them your little Novotzky and they take the whole hand and totally haul off. Gone by malicious joy. I wonder how they manage all these threads while always telling the same.
I prefer this Berzin guy. If I could chose one, it would be him. LMAO
Then Rrrrrradio, because he thinks Lance is even stupid, which you read almost never.
The one and only good-responder - our exclusive Lanceness. Tourminator is wrong now. He's the superresponding donkey and exclusive Exclusivnator exclusively protected.

Thank god you're from Germany. Without an 'Arnold' type accent your posts would only be silly. With the accent, they're actually pretty funny...

And, yes, I know Arnold's from Austria. No need to play the nationalist card.
 
May 23, 2010
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soulor said:
Matt Rendell's thoroughly researched book looks in detail at why Pantani was caught out by the testers in his home tour that morning. It is worth reading if only for this. The evidence points to Pantani being surprised and unable to lower his crit before being tested by the vampires. There are a number of theories as to why this happened, but there seems little doubt that advance warning would have enabled him to win the Giro that year by diluting his blood prior to the test (and would have substantially changed the subsequent history of cycling). It is probable that such advance warning of morning blood tests enabled him to win his previous GTs whilst exceeding the 50% limit enforced at the time.
I would recommend the book as well,(also Kings of the Mountains and Blazing saddles)
However I thought it was far more relevant that Pantani's entourage (including his doctor) were on the slash the night before the tests celebrating the victory (no help there then).
Pantani himself was late for breakfast- had he started eating at his usual time the blood tests would not have been allowed.
I cant imagine organised and Pantani occuring too often in the same sentance.
Thanks
 
dancing on pedals said:
I would recommend the book as well,(also Kings of the Mountains and Blazing saddles)
However I thought it was far more relevant that Pantani's entourage (including his doctor) were on the slash the night before the tests celebrating the victory (no help there then).
Pantani himself was late for breakfast- had he started eating at his usual time the blood tests would not have been allowed.
I cant imagine organised and Pantani occuring too often in the same sentance.
Thanks
Does he say anything about the 1998 Pantani-Forconi conspiracy theory?
 
Jun 29, 2010
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dancing on pedals said:
I would recommend the book as well,(also Kings of the Mountains and Blazing saddles)
However I thought it was far more relevant that Pantani's entourage (including his doctor) were on the slash the night before the tests celebrating the victory (no help there then).
Pantani himself was late for breakfast- had he started eating at his usual time the blood tests would not have been allowed.
I cant imagine organised and Pantani occuring too often in the same sentance.
Thanks
That'll serve me right for not having the book to hand;): you are quite right that despite the predictability of the blood testing, Pantani was bolloxed by the ineptitude of his handlers. It is pretty amazing given the level of chaos that Pantani attracted that he survived so long before being caught by a "healthcheck". With proper organisation and intelligence, this suggests one could get away with almost any level of doping...:rolleyes:
 
Aug 17, 2009
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soulor said:
That'll serve me right for not having the book to hand;): you are quite right that despite the predictability of the blood testing, Pantani was bolloxed by the ineptitude of his handlers. It is pretty amazing given the level of chaos that Pantani attracted that he survived so long before being caught by a "healthcheck". With proper organisation and intelligence, this suggests one could get away with almost any level of doping...:rolleyes:
The rumor that I heard was that Pantani had destroyed his own blood producing by his excessive EPO use. It was probably a blessing in disguise that he had the cocaine overdose as his motabilism had been altered by too many PEDs. I feel the same way about Frank Van Der Brouke.
If you play to hard and without being monitored by a Doctor, you play with death.
 
Mar 11, 2009
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dancing on pedals said:
I would recommend the book as well,(also Kings of the Mountains and Blazing saddles)
However I thought it was far more relevant that Pantani's entourage (including his doctor) were on the slash the night before the tests celebrating the victory (no help there then).
Pantani himself was late for breakfast- had he started eating at his usual time the blood tests would not have been allowed.
I cant imagine organised and Pantani occuring too often in the same sentance.
Thanks
Yes, the health/medical inspectors were probably as suprised as Marco with the results of the blood tests. I remember them being almost apologetic at the time regarding the required 2 week suspension for health reasons.

"Haters" and "Vampires" did not exist at that time - they would come soon after the 1999 TdF sigh....

RIP Marco.
 
Apr 7, 2009
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hrotha said:
As of yet, there's no validated test for autologous transfusions. You might have heard about Contador's plasticizers levels - that's from one test that's being developed. So no, right now autologous transfusions can't be detected directly, and that's mostly why the biological passport was introduced: to detect them indirectly. It's not very effective.

Hamilton, Vino and Kasechkin were caught because they used someone else's blood.
Oh yeah. Good catch, my bad. Hard to believe they would do something like that....and only 3 cyclists...hmmm

But I digress? Any thoughts so Novistky trying to bring the doping ring down instead of LA? Wasn't Novistky trying to prove there was doping in Baseball more than bring Clemons down?
 
Jun 29, 2010
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hrotha said:
Does he say anything about the 1998 Pantani-Forconi conspiracy theory?
Rendell points out (pp. 133-134) that a conspiracy "seemed implausible" (due to the necessary involvement of a number of anti-doping officials) but possible, especially as the originator of the allegation was Forconi's former team manager (prior to his arrival at Mercatone) who "knew him extremely well". He also points out that Pantani's team threatened to sue, but didn't (familiar story?)
 
dancing on pedals said:
neither, but there are copyright rules and in most countries there are public libraries,
thanks
I don't think discussing the contents of a book without even quoting it infringes copyright law anywhere, and finding English-language books on a topic like cycling in a public library around here might be harder than you think.
soulor said:
Rendell points out (pp. 133-134) that a conspiracy "seemed implausible" (due to the necessary involvement of a number of anti-doping officials) but possible, especially as the originator of the allegation was Forconi's former team manager (prior to his arrival at Mercatone) who "knew him extremely well". He also points out that Pantani's team threatened to sue, but didn't (familiar story?)
Thank you very much. I actually wasn't aware anyone had given that conspiracy theory much thought, it was something I remembered reading but I'm not sure where I got it from. I'll put it in my "probably not" list.
 
Bilirubin said:
I just caught up with Armstrong's tweet on Novitzky's meeting with Bordry.



http://twitter.com/lancearmstrong/status/4667776199299073
Absolutely no sense or caring about the gravity of the situation.
GRANDIOSE SELF-WORTH -- a grossly inflated view of one's abilities and self-worth, self-assured, opinionated, cocky, a braggart. Sociopaths are arrogant people who believe they are superior human beings
http://www.sociopathicstyle.com/traits/classic.htm

Dave.
 
Oct 7, 2010
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Berzin said:
No it wasn't. Here's why-

Contenders like Ullrich had much more talent at stage racing than Armstrong, who doped before he got sick and never managed a top 20 place at the Tour, struggled in the time trials and climbed like a tortoise carrying a sack of rocks. What changed? Weight loss? Higher cadence? Training harder than anyone else with a maniacal focus reserved only for mythical Greek Gods? Hardly.

1) Armstrong had Dr. Ferarri signed to a non-compete clause, which was never done before. This made a huge difference. Even in doping circles there is always one doctor who is outstanding in his field, and Ferarri is it. Everyone knows it. Get on his program and you'll be winning in no time. Exclusivity to this doctor would assure no one else is on the same program during the same race.

2) Armstrong payed bribes to the UCI for preferential treatment. How else were all those ex-Postal riders caught only after they left the fold? Is anyone naive enough to think those riders began doping only after they left Postal?

4) The sheer ridiculousness of winning 7 Tours in a row. Preposterous for even the most talented rider, for Armstrong it was nothing less than the pinnacle of his reinforcement of cycling's Iron Triangle between the UCI, Dr. Ferarri and himself.

After the Landis accusations came to light, the UCI clearly stated they were not going to investigate the claims. Their monumental arrogance lead us to where we are today, and now Novitzky is leading the charge in this Federal investigation. Since the UCI were clearly backing Armstrong, someone had to take the other side.
I like some of your thoughts here. Could a potential manifestation of this "conspiracy" be that the UCI and their antics get fully drawn into light? If the cycling world can have a portion of those dark corners lit up and although the proceedings are not about them, but perhaps a byproduct could force transparency of this body, and we could see more proper applications of all rules?
 

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