Brian Cookson article in Daily Telegraph

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martinvickers said:
I never realised you were a McQuaid fan, Hog.
Thanks Martin.

I'm not a McQuaid fan, no.

But I'm most concerned with the lies Dr. M has spewed all over this thread.

McQuaid like it or not has done an immense amount of work for the Asian nations. Some of the reasons why those nations wish to change the UCI constitution is so they're fairly represented at an international level.

Some fear that Cookson might bring back memories of the Empire. British rule etc. Cookson does lack depth at an international level. No one actually knows who he is beyond those in his own constituency. Even when I raced in Britian I'd not heard of him or seen his name on any of the boring paraphernalia that was sent through the mail by UK Cycling.

McQuaid like him or not has worked very hard with non-traditional cycling nations. Now some of those I believe is for his own gain. Links to GCP and his famy as sports agents and race promoters is of concern.

Cookson at this point is running on the platform that "the other guy is corrupt so vote for me" Problem he has is he was a part of that corruption and to be fair those who will vote for either McQuaid or Cookson were part of it as well.

Back to Dr. M lies. We as members of our federation do get to vote. We vote at a national level. Some can vote at a state level. That's how it works. The Irish EGM is an example of this. Power to the clubs. The Irish board had to grant the EGM and respect the vote. The Asian nations are the same. It's only a guess by but I would think most cyclists at a club level in those counties would support McQuaid. Our votes count at a club and national level.

My own thoughts is Cookson won't win. Pat has strong support from the 'silent'. Those who want him to remain due to funding the packages of many of those who sit on various committees at the UCI.

Watch this space.
 
thehog said:
Thanks Martin.

I'm not a McQuaid fan, no.

But I'm most concerned with the lies Dr. M has spewed all over this thread.

McQuaid like it or not has done an immense amount of work for the Asian nations. Some of the reasons why those nations wish to change the UCI constitution is so they're fairly represented at an international level.

Some fear that Cookson might bring back memories of the Empire. British rule etc. Cookson does lack depth at an international level. No one actually knows who he is beyond those in his own constituency. Even when I raced in Britian I'd not heard of him or seen his name on any of the boring paraphernalia that was sent through the mail by UK Cycling.

McQuaid like him or not has worked very hard with non-traditional cycling nations. Now some of those I believe is for his own gain. Links to GCP and his famy as sports agents and race promoters is of concern.

Cookson at this point is running on the platform that "the other guy is corrupt so vote for me" Problem he has is he was a part of that corruption and to be fair those who will vote for either McQuaid or Cookson were part of it as well.

Back to Dr. M lies. We as members of our federation do get to vote. We vote at a national level. Some can vote at a state level. That's how it works. The Irish EGM is an example of this. Power to the clubs. The Irish board had to grant the EGM and respect the vote. The Asian nations are the same. It's only a guess by but I would think most cyclists at a club level in those counties would support McQuaid. Our votes count at a club and national level.

My own thoughts is Cookson won't win. Pat has strong support from the 'silent'. Those who want him to remain due to funding the packages of many of those who sit on various committees at the UCI.

Watch this space.
Thanks Hog. Good post.

I would add that the two candidates in question are using PR agencies for their campaigns.

It's odd and I do wonder whom is funding those agencies. The UCI? Private enterprise with vested interests?

Question remains - why would two candidates whom are voted by delegates and not the general public would use such an approach?

My feeling is that both candidates have their own agendas once elected.

Cookson I believe is working for the "break-a-way" party who want to create "World Series Cycling" and money for all. That would include Vaughters, financial backers, SkyTV etc.

McQuaid operates the "keep it in the family" team who makes sure only he very few benefit and the money flows to them.

Vaughters worries me greatly. I think he means well on some levels but he is in bed with serious money whom want to see big changes to cycling and the way it distributes funding/revenue.

MxQuaid is a conservative. But is aware that new cycling nations are the key to his growing empire.
 
Well said hog...
the key points for me re: Cookson. What did he do to counteract the corruption of the Pat, Lance era?
Secondly did he try to stop the lawsuit against Kimmage?
And did he try to stop the lawsuit against Floyd Landis?
Kimmage asked him to respond to the latter questions but he instead choose to answer questions about the chain ring he uses when cycling.

But JV is aligning himself politically to Cookson and it's embarrassing. Because like waiting for Floyd to confess first and do all the hard part, he waited for Cookson to come along before turning into this tough guy in relation to Pat.

There's a pro Pat blog out - one entry is in relation to how JV has flip flopped over the years with Pat. And whatever your feelings are towards Pat, it's actually completely factual regarding JV and Pat. Runs with the hare, hunts with the hound...
 
Digger said:
Well said hog...
the key points for me re: Cookson. What did he do to counteract the corruption of the Pat, Lance era?
Secondly did he try to stop the lawsuit against Kimmage?
And did he try to stop the lawsuit against Floyd Landis?
Kimmage asked him to respond to the latter questions but he instead choose to answer questions about the chain ring he uses when cycling.

But JV is aligning himself politically to Cookson and it's embarrassing. Because like waiting for Floyd to confess first and do all the hard part, he waited for Cookson to come along before turning into this tough guy in relation to Pat.

There's a pro Pat blog out - one entry is in relation to how JV has flip flopped over the years with Pat. And whatever your feelings are towards Pat, it's actually completely factual regarding JV and Pat. Runs with the hare, hunts with the hound...
It was very well said by theHog.

And agree on all you write. Matt Parker who is the OP of this thread is literally gushing to get the "McQuaid is corrupt" line out there.

JV, Parker and co. couldn't be anymore obvious on what their agenda is... it is clear.

Right you are. Under this pile of stinking poo is that Vaughters and co. are using Landis to bring down Pat for their own agenda.

If Vaughters really cared he would have brought down Lance/Bruyneel/McQuaid all on his on.

It's reeks of opportunism from twitter hero JV.

But hey, he did invite Floyd over for dinner one night :rolleyes:
 

martinvickers

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Oct 15, 2012
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thehog said:
Thanks Martin.

I'm not a McQuaid fan, no.

But I'm most concerned with the lies Dr. M has spewed all over this thread.
Funny, 'cos you said you voted in your federation for a candidate.

To date, Ireland's the only federation to hold a vote, and that only for one candidate; McQuaid.

So either you voted for McQuaid, or you lied to the Dr.

Since I can only assumed you didn't lie, you must therefore have voted for McQuaid.

Or is my assumption wrong?
 
martinvickers said:
Funny, 'cos you said you voted in your federation for a candidate.

To date, Ireland's the only federation to hold a vote, and that only for one candidate; McQuaid.

So either you voted for McQuaid, or you lied to the Dr.

Since I can only assumed you didn't lie, you must therefore have voted for McQuaid.

Or is my assumption wrong?
Your assumption is wrong.

Did you vote for the Prime Minster or a member for your constituency?

As to all those that belong to clubs governed by their Federations and ultimately the UCI can vote for members within their club and/or federation.

Therefore those, say in Malaysia, will vote for their club president whom supports the national federations support of McQuaid.

Simples.

I think it's called democracy :rolleyes:

It would be a crazy thought holding a world wide general election for Cookson v. McQuaid.

That would be crazy talk Martin.
 
Oct 6, 2009
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thehog said:
Thanks Hog. Good post.

I would add that the two candidates in question are using PR agencies for their campaigns.

It's odd and I do wonder whom is funding those agencies. The UCI? Private enterprise with vested interests?

Question remains - why would two candidates whom are voted by delegates and not the general public would use such an approach?

My feeling is that both candidates have their own agendas once elected.

Cookson I believe is working for the "break-a-way" party who want to create "World Series Cycling" and money for all. That would include Vaughters, financial backers, SkyTV etc.

McQuaid operates the "keep it in the family" team who makes sure only he very few benefit and the money flows to them.

Vaughters worries me greatly. I think he means well on some levels but he is in bed with serious money whom want to see big changes to cycling and the way it distributes funding/revenue.

MxQuaid is a conservative. But is aware that new cycling nations are the key to his growing empire.
Good post, Hog. Amen, brother. :p

I have all kinds of reservations about JV now that I didn't used to have, because of his full-throated support for Sky, when he cannot possibly know everything another team gets up to behind closed doors. And being willing to get into bed with Bruyneel and Riis. Breakaway leagues. Throwing his support behind poor victimized Lance. I know JV has to be willing to compromise due to his insider status, but I hope he knows what he's doing, getting down in the mud with these shady characters that hold power in cycling.
 

martinvickers

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Oct 15, 2012
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thehog said:
Your assumption is wrong.

Did you vote for the Prime Minster or a member for your constituency?
Now, now, Hog, you're not being honest...

The Dr reminded you you don't get a vote on the UCI presidential election, and you said you did get a vote.

Here.

Now you're trying to to say you voted in some national federation election and somehow that's a proxy, even though the voters for the uci election are continental, not national.

But you know full well that's not the election that was being discussed, and you knew it at the time. You just tried to be too smart for your own good...

tut, tut, piggie telling porkies...
 
martinvickers said:
Now, now, Hog, you're not being honest...

The Dr reminded you you don't get a vote on the UCI presidential election, and you said you did get a vote.

Here.

Now you're trying to to say you voted in some national federation election and somehow that's a proxy, even though the voters for the uci election are continental, not national.

But you know full well that's not the election that was being discussed, and you knew it at the time. You just tried to be too smart for your own good...

tut, tut, piggie telling porkies...
Martin. I expect the vortex treatment from the Doctor. But not you.

You're better than this.

How could I vote if I'm not a delegate?

The Irish did not vote either at their EGM. They were voting for nomination not for presidency.

Vortex was trying to be the vortex. Picking out one point and insessantly repeating ad nausem.

I. Rightfully corrected his lack of knowledge and appears I'm also correcting your lack of knowledge.

Martin, I know you agree that we as cyclists whom are members of clubs can vote for the presidency. Not directly but through our clubs with its elected members. That has been both McQuaid's and Cookson's path.

That is the system. Most similar to Commonwealth countries around the world.

There's good discussion going on here. Don't lower yourself and spoil the thread with point scoring. And certainly don't jump into bed with the vortex. Your posts are so much better than that.

Look forward to reading better value postings in future.

Cheers.
 
Jul 15, 2013
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Beech Mtn said:
I have all kinds of reservations about JV now that I didn't used to have, because of his full-throated support for Sky, when he cannot possibly know everything another team gets up to behind closed doors.
JV dropped a very heavy hint (as is his way) that he does not believe in Sky/Froome following the pyrenees stages.
 
Beech Mtn said:
Good post, Hog. Amen, brother. :p

I have all kinds of reservations about JV now that I didn't used to have, because of his full-throated support for Sky, when he cannot possibly know everything another team gets up to behind closed doors. And being willing to get into bed with Bruyneel and Riis. Breakaway leagues. Throwing his support behind poor victimized Lance. I know JV has to be willing to compromise due to his insider status, but I hope he knows what he's doing, getting down in the mud with these shady characters that hold power in cycling.
JV is a twitter hero but he does have a very long history of lying.

A lot guys burned on the cross and he still lied to protect himself and build the empire.

I don't mind Vaughters. Some of what he says rings true. But he only came out when it was fashionable to do so.

He criticises Pat for his lack of transparency but was Vaughters ever transparent about his drug use?
 
thehog said:
the hint being?
JV is very good at 'hints' apparently...according to JV he went to the authorities in 2004 to talk about improving testing and to 'hint' about his own doping...but of course he said he was waiting for the right moment to do public...yes the right moment being when Floyd and Tyler had done the hard yards, and more significantly, when the SOL did not apply anymore.

But then there is that affidavit from the 2005 SCA trial regarding the IM conversation...but look JV is clearly a great guy with loads of credibility. He doesn't lie. He doesn't stretch the truth or give politicised answers. This guy is trying to fix the sport from the inside...and he's also give his whole life to anti doping...from an MBA perspective, he's the guy to lead cycling forward - along with Cookson...a guy who sat like a guy who couldn't read, write or talk for the last few years while all this was taking place.
 
Digger said:
JV is very good at 'hints' apparently...according to JV he went to the authorities in 2004 to talk about improving testing and to 'hint' about his own doping...but of course he said he was waiting for the right moment to do public...yes the right moment being when Floyd and Tyler had done the hard yards, and more significantly, when the SOL did not apply anymore.

But then there is that affidavit from the 2005 SCA trial regarding the IM conversation...but look JV is clearly a great guy with loads of credibility. He doesn't lie. He doesn't stretch the truth or give politicised answers. This guy is trying to fix the sport from the inside...and he's also give his whole life to anti doping...from an MBA perspective, he's the guy to lead cycling forward - along with Cookson...a guy who sat like a guy who couldn't read, write or talk for the last few years while all this was taking place.
Cookson supports the World Anti-Doping Agency’s proposed four-year bans – which will be in place from 2015 – and their imposition on guilty coaches and medical staff too, but it is his proposed fit-and-proper person test that stands out.

He said: “If elected UCI president I will introduce a fit-and-proper-person’s test in cycling, taking the example from regulations which govern who is fit to be a company director. I want to see the UCI adopt a process by which team managers, team doctors and sports directors are assessed for their suitability to be in a position of authority in the sport.”
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/cycling/brian-cookson-vows-to-hunt-down-cyclings-drug-pushers-if-he-makes-uci-president-8727149.html

If Cookson has his way with "proper people" it might exclude Vaughters for his drug taknig :rolleyes:

alas Vaughters is gunning to be the Prez himself:

Could the head of international pro cycling some day be based in Denver?

Jonathan Vaughters, CEO of Boulder-based Team Garmin-Sharp, is taking steps toward possible consideration for pro cycling's top post in the distant future. The Denver native and Cherry Creek High School graduate is getting his MBA at the University of Denver. With the International Cycling Union (UCI) under fire the past few years and Vaughters involved in cycling politics, the ambition makes sense.

"For sure, I'd consider it someday," Vaughters said, "but I need a little more education and a little more experience and maturity."
http://www.denverpost.com/cycling/ci_23531392/jonathan-vaughters-might-be-good-fit-cyclings-top
 

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