Teams & Riders Brothers in (crank) arms - Yates Discussion Thread

[18-Valve. (pithy)]

I thought Bernal looked to be on the verge of cracking at one point. Probably wasn't, but was indeed put under pressure. Yates did indeed get dropped, but I don't think there's much in between them right now (other than Bernal's Purito factor).

 

[limak_]

Maybe that was just my impression or high % gradients thing, but imo Bernal didn't went full out after he attacked Yates and seemed to be having that 5% reserve left in his legs. At the same time, this whole theory of Yates, saving himself for the 3rd week may turn out to be quite true in fact. Then maybe he also wasn't on his absolute limit yesterday and he just decided not to respond immediately for Bernal's attack but just keep the reasonable gap until the finish line, which he managed to do.

Anyway, I expect some decent, close rivalry between them in upcoming mountains. While Bernal still seems to be quite a definite favourie for the overall win, it will also be very beneficial for the value of his potential triumph if he acheives that after a fierce battle somene like Yates being in his top form.

 

[SafeBet]

Before we start discussing Simon Yates and the cold, his DS just said this was not a problem today. He just had a bad day. They were not expecting it.

 

[Pinot's goat]

He can still podium but I was hoping he could take the fight to Bernal.

 

[yaco]

The team has misused Yates since the beginning of 2019 - Your role as a team is to get the most value from a prized asset - I'm running the team and Yates is riding 3 GT's a year as a STAGE HUNTER - He can take it easy in the first week, drop time and then go stage hunting - I am confident he could win two breakaway stages in each GT - You only have to look at the type of riders who've won stages from the breakaway at this Giro.

 

[Red Rick]

Before we start discussing Simon Yates and the cold, his DS just said this was not a problem today. He just had a bad day. They were not expecting it.

Yates

Not expecting bad days

Pick one.

 

[Bolder]

The team has misused Yates since the beginning of 2019 - Your role as a team is to get the most value from a prized asset - I'm running the team and Yates is riding 3 GT's a year as a STAGE HUNTER - He can take it easy in the first week, drop time and then go stage hunting - I am confident he could win two breakaway stages in each GT - You only have to look at the type of riders who've won stages from the breakaway at this Giro.

Maybe, but unlike 99% of the riders in the WT peloton, he actually has won a GT. And he's got Top 10s in all 3 GTs.

Now, maybe winning the Vuelta was an anomaly, but he's clearly got the talent. Was he misused since 2019, or was his training off? I'm not quite sure what went wrong this Giro but all isn't yet lost. If he finishes top 5 you'd have to consider it a success.

Besides, no one since Virenque has made a sustainable career out of stage hunting. I'm exaggerating a little bit but Simon is a bigger talent than that. Look at what's happened to Mollema when he decided to become a stage hunter.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Now, maybe winning the Vuelta was an anomaly, but he's clearly got the talent.

His (and his brother's) sheer wattage per kilogram is very impressive indeed. Consistency over 3 weeks is not his strength though.

 

[yaco]

Maybe, but unlike 99% of the riders in the WT peloton, he actually has won a GT. And he's got Top 10s in all 3 GTs.

Now, maybe winning the Vuelta was an anomaly, but he's clearly got the talent. Was he misused since 2019, or was his training off? I'm not quite sure what went wrong this Giro but all isn't yet lost. If he finishes top 5 you'd have to consider it a success.

Besides, no one since Virenque has made a sustainable career out of stage hunting. I'm exaggerating a little bit but Simon is a bigger talent than that. Look at what's happened to Mollema when he decided to become a stage hunter.

You gotta remember that TBE had 0 GT wins in 2020, and they've struggled for wins so far in 2021 so you need to maximise your assets - Reckon, Simon and the team would take GT stage wins instead of an anonymous top GC 10.

 

[ppanther92]

The team has misused Yates since the beginning of 2019 - Your role as a team is to get the most value from a prized asset - I'm running the team and Yates is riding 3 GT's a year as a STAGE HUNTER - He can take it easy in the first week, drop time and then go stage hunting - I am confident he could win two breakaway stages in each GT - You only have to look at the type of riders who've won stages from the breakaway at this Giro.

He is for sure capable of doing so. But I am not too sure if stage wins really beat a top 10 in GC in sponsor talks. At least in Austria and Germany a TdF top 10 is certainly above a Giro or Vuelta stage win, even if its multiple. Actually not even close if I compare the hype around Pöstlberger or Nerz with the hype around Kohl or Buchmann. Also Fothen and Gerdemann were really hyped just by the potential chance of them to make it in the top 10 some day.

 

[yaco]

He is for sure capable of doing so. But I am not too sure if stage wins really beat a top 10 in GC in sponsor talks. At least in Austria and Germany a TdF top 10 is certainly above a Giro or Vuelta stage win, even if its multiple. Actually not even close if I compare the hype around Pöstlberger or Nerz with the hype around Kohl or Buchmann. Also Fothen and Gerdemann were really hyped just by the potential chance of them to make it in the top 10 some day.

TBE is a privately owned team with Gerry Ryan the principal - Only for five years in ten have the team had a title sponsor.

 

[Red Rick]

I'm willing to walk back my altitude overrated hypothesis if Yates murders Bernal tomorrow. When he does it.

 

[johnymax]

I'm willing to walk back my altitude overrated hypothesis if Yates murders Bernal tomorrow. When he does it.

Have you looked at the weather forecast? Yates needs perfect conditions to deliver. 19-21°C sunny or partly cloudy, no rain, wind 0-10 km/h, 35-50% humidity. If all of the above conditions aren't met, then the result doesn't count.

 

[postmanhat]

Before we start discussing Simon Yates and the cold, his DS just said this was not a problem today. He just had a bad day. They were not expecting it.

Contradicted by Yates in his interview who said he hasn't gone that well in the cold this year. He said a few years ago that they're not his favourite conditions. It's not exactly a secret. No idea why his DS felt moved to say that

 

[dusty red roads]

There's also a chance he's been affected by having covid. Even people with milder symptoms can have strange long term effects further down the track. For example, maybe the cold//rain runs down his immune system more than normal to bring such effects into action.

Maybe it would happen without having covid, I don't know. But it can't be ruled out completely.

 

[CyclistAbi]

More likely affected by Ineos and Bernal then Covid.

 

[Red Rick]

I'm willing to walk back my altitude overrated hypothesis if Yates murders Bernal tomorrow. When he does it.

I am a cruel, capricious god

 

[Pinot's goat]

I hope Nieve and Schultz are ok, he will need them.

 

[Forever The Best]

That's much better. Soooo, try to gain more time on Alpe di Mera then all in at Passo San Bernardino?

 

[roundabout]

He will probably need allies and Bernal/Ineos to be weaker again though for a long range attack to have a chance

 

[Gigs_98]

That's much better. Soooo, try to gain more time on Alpe di Mera then all in at Passo San Bernardino?

Hopefully. He is massively dependend on Caruso being willing to go for the big one instead of just defending his podium. If the two teams work together against Bernal they have a chance. That is if today wasn't just a bad day for Bernal but the beginning of a trend.

 

[Forever The Best]

Hopefully. He is massively dependend on Caruso being willing to go for the big one instead of just defending his podium. If the two teams work together against Bernal they have a chance. That is if today wasn't just a bad day for Bernal but the beginning of a trend.

Yeah. Hopefully Caruso also joins him and their teams are strong enough. ( Who were the domestiques of Yates and Caruso involved with the crash today? )

 

[Strawberry_Jams]

I didn't actually realise how long the final flat time trial was...Caruso could well win the whole thing,
Yates might well have to start thinking more about him.

 

[Red Rick]

Hopefully. He is massively dependend on Caruso being willing to go for the big one instead of just defending his podium. If the two teams work together against Bernal they have a chance. That is if today wasn't just a bad day for Bernal but the beginning of a trend.

Bernal losing this without a complete back-related collapse requires way too much coördination and puzzle pieces falling into place. Maybe there's a chance of Caruso getting within 1'30 and taking it in the ITT but I don't see that either.

 

[memyselfandI]

Adam is that you..?