Teams & Riders Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

[Red Rick]

Unfortunately we have to pay so much for taxes, but fortunately we get taxus for free.

Death

Taxus

And Froome saying he can still winning the Tour

 

[samhocking]

I thought it has always been stated the 5 mil was for his whole contract and we didn’t know the details on if any was performance and incentive based. Not 5 mil per season.

I think there was no time limit on the contract, it was simply a long-term 15 million contract in return that he finishes his career at ISN, so, assuming he will race for at least 2 more years it will equate to 5 million a year.

 

[SHAD0W93]

I think there was no time limit on the contract, it was simply a long-term 15 million contract in return that he finishes his career at ISN, so, assuming he will race for at least 2 more years it will equate to 5 million a year.

It was 15 mil(!), oh my gosh I thought it was 5 mil the whole time. Can’t say no to anything close to that a year.

 

[samhocking]

Yeah, I doubt he would have signed for only the equivalent of a couple of million a year, he would have stayed at Ineos.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Yeah, I doubt he would have signed for only the equivalent of a couple of million a year, he would have stayed at Ineos.

Were they offering that much though?

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Were they offering that much though?

I doubt it - marginal gains

 

[sir fly]

Yeah, I doubt he would have signed for only the equivalent of a couple of million a year, he would have stayed at Ineos.

I assume INEOS had a say too in regard to his stay

 

[Bolder]

Regarding the size of the contract, there has NEVER been any confirmation from Adams or anyone on the record that he's getting 5 million a year or 15 million total. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Every single article has used the weasely phrase "said to be."

Now, I have little doubt that Froome is making several million euros a year, but I have no idea what might be contingent on performance. And neither does anyone else, apparently.

Do I think he's overpaid? Based on performance? Absolutely. Based on what Adams knew in 2020? That's debatable.

This VN article from 2020 has some nuggets, including that ISN was the sole credible bidder. https://www.velonews.com/news/road/how-the-blockbuster-froome-israel-deal-came-together/

I'm not a Froome fan in the slightest, but to state over and over again certain suppositions and rumors as "facts" is willfully doing him a disservice, as is the continual dogpiling.

We get it: He's struggling. He makes a lot of money. ISN remains a lousy team despite Adams' millions, and it's played out pretty much how I expected: Froome is generating X millions of euros in free publicity, good or bad.

 

[glassmoon]

I doubt Froom is generating millions of euros for them... this is not a football and he's not Sagan after all.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

... is willfully doing him a disservice, as is the continual dogpiling.

Dawgpiling!

 

[sir fly]

Every fresh WT team needs some time to get things going... in whatever sense you wish. Take a look at the other two Mid-East teams.
That's my take regarding their results and prospects including Froome.
Winning another GT or anything of his previous reputation is a tall order, everybody's aware of that if we, forum members, are resolute about it. But looking at Froome's career and knowing his working ethics, once the ISN get themselves together the Peninsular rivalry will expand and Froome should feature prominently.

Regarding the marketing return Froome generates, I'd say that value of the four-time TDF winner, on a very (very) average and hermetic cycling market ISN covers, exceeds any other value the business offers.
That value's dropping, of course, but being already engaged it transferred in the bonds space and should become self-sustainable through identity-related effects.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

9 VS 6

TBF Contador wasn't going to win the Tour in 2007 so if anything it's 8 vs 6.

 

[tobydawq]

Contador wasn't going to win the Tour in 2007 so if anything it's 8 vs 6.

That's not the same. He did win.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

That's not the same. He did win.

For the same reason Froome won the Vuelta in 2011 - cause the best rider was disqualified (only timing was different).

 

[tobydawq]

For the same reason Froome won the Vuelta in 2011 - cause the best rider was disqualified (only timing was different).

No, I can't agree with that. Rasmussen didn't actually finish the race. No-one considers him a TdF winner.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

No, I can't agree with that. Rasmussen didn't actually finish the race. No-one considers him a TdF winner.

Let's put it this way - Contador wasn't the best rider of the Tour in 2007. As simple as that. His win is not really much better than Froome's in Vuelta 2011 (maybe by a few percent - probability of Rasmussen crashing in the remaining few stages). So being precise Contador won about 8.05 GTs on the road, which is closer to 8 than to 9.

 

[tobydawq]

Let's put it this way - Contador wasn't the best rider of the Tour in 2007. As simple as that. His win is not really much better than Froome's in Vuelta 2011 (maybe by a few percent - probability of Rasmussen crashing in the remaining few stages). So being precise Contador won about 8.05 GTs on the road, which is closer to 8 than to 9.

Lol, in that case you have to adjust most GTs in history to a number somewhere below 1.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Lol, in that case you have to adjust most GTs in history to a number somewhere below 1.

Yeah but I'm just pointing out that not everything is black and white. Some brag about 9 vs 6 but they can't ignore the fact that Contador was strongly beaten at the Tour'07 (by over 3 minutes) with just one important stage remaining. It's not really a more impressive GT victory than Froome's one (loss by 13 seconds to a disqualified rider), it's the same category of winning because the better guy was disqualified.

 

[tobydawq]

Yeah but I'm just pointing out that not everything is black and white. Some brag about 9 vs 6 but they can't ignore the fact that Contador was strongly beaten at the Tour'07 (by over 3 minutes) with just one important stage remaining. It's not really a more impressive GT victory than Froome's one (loss by 13 seconds to a disqualified rider), it's the same category of winning because the better guy was disqualified.

I just don't agree.

It's cycling, anything can happen during a race. At the end one rider wins. And then I don't care much about what happens afterwards.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

I just don't agree.

It's cycling, anything can happen during a race. At the end one rider wins. And then I don't care much about what happens afterwards.

That's why I mentioned those few percent. Looking at Contador's all GT wins, this victory is the odd one out. Similarly to Froome's Vuelta 2011.

And make no mistake, I was actually a Contador's fan for a decade (and was happy with the Tour'07 outcome) but I can't ignore these facts when comparing their GT wins.

 

[SHAD0W93]

There was still race left for something to happen but than you can’t ignore Astana withdrawing the whole team because of Vino with Klöden 5th and Kash 8th after stage 15. Things could have gotten crazy if they stayed in the race and Klöden was 9” behind Levi and put over a minute into him the first TT. That Tour had a lot of withdraws with Cofidis, Astana, and Rasmussen and Levi after the fact. Contador finished first at the end.

And Froome got that one like Andy and Scarponi. Andy is the only one that you could say would have won the race he was awarded if Contador wasn’t there. That’s why I dislike awarding to second in some cases as the race gets changed without the rider who won being present but we can’t have a do over.

 

[Froome]

I just don't agree.

It's cycling, anything can happen during a race. At the end one rider wins. And then I don't care much about what happens afterwards.

It's 7 vs 7 officialy ant that's what matters, but he won 4 tours france, contador two.
Giro or vuelta don't have the same value of the tour.
It's like europe league=champions league.

 

[SHAD0W93]

It's 7 vs 7 officialy ant that's what matters, but he won 4 tours france, contador two.
Giro or vuelta don't have the same value of the tour.
It's like europe league=champions league.

9 vs 6 on the road though. You can’t defend Froome’s situation and lambast Contador’s when they were the same.

 

[sir fly]

What's this Froome vs Contador discussion about?
H2H?

 

[SHAD0W93]

What's this Froome vs Contador discussion about?
H2H?

I think from comparing career of Nibali, Contador, and Froome and someone said those three in that order.