Contador blasts LA

[Anonymous]

What do you mean by attacking? You mean via twitter like LA? or in the teambus like LA? Turning the entire team against AC. Why did AC attack - because he couldn't trust anyone in his team. It started back in March. Lance drip feed the insults so by Tour time Alberto could do nothing but attack, attack, attack. Good bike rider Contador.

Did you watch the race coverage?

 

[TRDean]

Who was closest in GC at the time. That's your answer.

Bull Shiiite!!! Going into stage 17 Contador was 1 and LA was 2...I would think AS and FS would have been just as important as the overall GC was not decided yet!!! You are very short sighted in your analysis...both LA and Wiggo were behind...why not put time into both...oh because it does not fit into your little world.

 

[thehog]

Did you watch the race coverage?

No, I didn't need to watch the race. I had the twitter updates to keep me entertained. Much more exciting.

 

[TRDean]

No, I didn't need to watch the race. I had the twitter updates to keep me entertained. Much more exciting.

Thats classic!!!

 

[Wheels Go Round and Round]

Yes, but I'm not argueing that. I am argueing the fact that if you need a bodyguard to be a cyclist then you're definitely doing something wrong. I mean... remember the now infamous ride up Alpe D'Huez in which the german fans were spitting at him? If people are THAT ****ed off with you it's probably because you're a *** to begin with.

And I'm pretty sure his ex-wife and Ms. Crow would agree with me.

was Monica Seles a **** too? She was stabbed and other athletes are attacked too so it's justified in my opinion. There are some real psycho's out there and it ONLY takes 1. Seriously... look at all of the jackasses on this board that alone would tell you to get some protection...

 

[Anonymous]

Franciep10 had an interesting anecdote that he shared about the events surrounding Stage 17 a few pages back that you should check out. Obviously it should be taken with a healthy dose of skepticism, but it certainly provides more context on the subject.

Fact or conjecture? Scribe put forth something silly too. But heck, could be true right. I mean it fits my argument....

 

[indurain666]

There is no I in team...only L- a- n -c -e

 

[Publicus]

I'll try and take one more stab at this. You assume (wrongly) that Kloeden's podium position was the only thing in play on 17. There were 4 riders in the final, no? The Schlecks, Klodi and el pistolero. The Schlecks were riding flat out to put time in to Wiggins (primarily) and Lance (secondarily). AC was riding 3rd wheel, Klodi 4th. Now, in my humble opinion, all AC had to do was follow the Schlecks, prepare for a late flurry from Andy and keep Klodi as close as possible just in case something went wrong. Are you with me so far? With Frank and Andy riding au bloc to the finish, for time, AC and Klodi get an ARCHAIR RIDE TO THE LINE. Get it? El Pistolero could have attacked very late for the stage or better yet set up Klodi for a well deserved stage win, or be patient and conserve for a better opportunity. Instead, WHAT DID HE DO? He blew up his own mate. Brilliant move, no doubt about it.

Not sure I can be clearer so we will have to agree to disagree.

I don't assume anything. What you are assuming is that your opinion about what Contador should have done is relevant. It isn't. He was riding in the race with the Schlecks and Kloden. He made a decision based on the advice from JB, talking to Kloden (who said go) and his own read of the Schlecks perceived strength. He made the move, the Schlecks were stronger than he thought and Kloden wasn't able to follow the acceleration. That's what happened. There is nothing to argue about in my book. GC leaders look to get time where they can. He tried and didn't get it. It, as they say, happens.

Now since you seem to be such a stickler for team tactics, perhaps you can weigh in on the tactical blunder (IMHO) by Lance Armstrong on the Col de Romme. Which one had a more lasting effect on Stage 17? Contador's attack on Col de Colombiere, or Lance's inattentiveness (looking at his pedals and almost causing an accident with Wiggins) allowing Frank Schleck to bridge up to Andy, Contador and Kloden?

 

[TRDean]

was Monica Seles a **** too? She was stabbed and other athletes are attacked too so it's justified in my opinion. There are some real psycho's out there and it ONLY takes 1. Seriously... look at all of the jackasses on this board that alone would tell you to get some protection...

gotta agree with this!!! There are some crazies out there...anyone hear those voices?

 

[Publicus]

Fact or conjecture? Scribe put forth something silly too. But heck, could be true right. I mean it fits my argument....

Two things, I said take it with healthy dose of skepticism. And second, Scribe doesn't have a source that has been making accurate comments about events. Whereas Franciep10 does.

Again, just a data point to consider in your analysis about the events surrounding the attack on Col de Colombiere.

 

[Anonymous]

Bull Shiiite!!! Going into stage 17 Contador was 1 and LA was 2...I would think AS and FS would have been just as important as the overall GC was not decided yet!!! You are very short sighted in your analysis...both LA and Wiggo were behind...why not put time into both...oh because it does not fit into your little world.

So you are in the camp where people actually in this line of work are all wrong. Bruyneel, LA, Levi, Horner, Axel Merckyx, Bob Roll are all wrong and you are right.

Ok then.

 

[Anonymous]

Two things, I said take it with healthy dose of skepticism. And second, Scribe doesn't have a source that has been making accurate comments about events. Whereas Franciep10 does.

And you know Francie's source is accurate but your skeptical? You have lost me there.

 

[padyakpinoy]

Sore Winner

Looks as if AC finally snapped and got tired of being picked on. What a baby. Man up and drop your nuts AC. LA may only have 1, but at least he uses it.

http://tour-de-france.velonews.com/article/96109/contador-rips-armstrong

We have heard of a sore loser, but man, what a sore winner this AC is!

 

[Ninety5rpm]

1. la RAI
2. Spanish article
3. Vaugter's-Andreu e-mail
4. International TV and newspaper media

By "citations" I meant reliable and verifiable secondary sources, not something less reliable than the National Enquirer.

 

[TRDean]

So you are in the camp where people actually in this line of work are all wrong. Bruyneel, LA, Levi, Horner, Axel Merckyx, Bob Roll are all wrong and you are right.

Ok then.

Funny thing...to a man everyone you listed is a LA desciple. Coincidence? I think not.

 

[Anonymous]

And who benefited from that move?

Andy Schleck.

 

[Publicus]

So you are in the camp where people actually in this line of work are all wrong. Bruyneel, LA, Levi, Horner, Axel Merckyx, Bob Roll are all wrong and you are right.

Ok then.

This is why your arguments fall flat. It's not enough to say that LA et al said a thing. It's not like they don't have an incentive to shade the truth or that they are impartial observers--just as you rightly question the validity/accuracy of the commentary shared by franciep10's friend, you should view statements by these folks with the same skepticism.

Lance Armstrong lost 2:18 seconds that day primarily because of his own inattentiveness. Not Contador's, his own. Did you see JB comment on that? How about Horner? Anything from Bob Roll? Axel Merckyx? No, then I guess it didn't actually happen then, right?

And if Lance was so worried about Kloden, why didn't he pace Kloden in? Hell, he tried to get on Kloden's wheel when it was clear that Kloden was pedaling blocks. If Kloden wasn't upset, then ask yourself why Lance was upset? He certainly never showed any concern for Kloden't podium position before that day or after. So I'd be interested to know why you think Lance was so upset.

 

[Publicus]

Two things, I said take it with healthy dose of skepticism. And second, Scribe doesn't have a source that has been making accurate comments about events. Whereas Franciep10 does.

And you know Francie's source is accurate but your skeptical? You have lost me there.

Following along then: (1) francie's source has made comments that proved to be accurate once before, (2) that means I give them more credibility than I would otherwise, but that I don't accept them as gospel truth. Just a data point to be considered when viewing a situation.

 

[Señor_Contador]

Fact or conjecture? Scribe put forth something silly too. But heck, could be true right. I mean it fits my argument....

Oh noooooo my friend. There's no way in hell the 50,000 Germans on Alpe D'Duez that day (taking turns at spitting at him) were all psychos. Let's be frank, Lance has acquired a lot of animosity from many people of all nationalities.

 

[Señor_Contador]

was Monica Seles a **** too? She was stabbed and other athletes are attacked too so it's justified in my opinion. There are some real psycho's out there and it ONLY takes 1. Seriously... look at all of the jackasses on this board that alone would tell you to get some protection...

Oh noooooo my friend. There's no way in hell the 50,000 Germans on Alpe D'Duez that day (taking turns at spitting at him) were all psychos. Let's be frank, Lance has acquired a lot of animosity from many people of all nationalities.

 

[Publicus]

I don't think that is a fair comment. Lance won 7 Tours, he's a legend and thus deserves more respect. He should have the car ahead of Contador who has only won 4 Grand Tours not 7.

Just imagine if Greg LeMond was coming back at age 39 and it was 1999 then Lance would have respected that and moved aside to let Greg lead the team.

LOL. Clearly Otto didn't get your humor. I can totally see Lance giving up his spot to Greg in 1999. Not that that is parallel to this situation. It would be like LeMond coming back in 2003 and wanting the team leadership. Lance had already won 3 grand tours at that point. Same as Contador coming into this Tour de France. Oh and you have to add in that LeMond hadn't won anything during the season, hadn't looked like his old self on the bike in any of his races and had a broken collarbone. Add all that in and I could definitely see Lance stepping aside . . . to kick LeMond in the groin.

 

[TRDean]

What I don't get is what does LA have that makes all the other riders so passive and afraid of him? Heck, the vast majority don't ride with him or for him. He is not what he used to be. So far we have Cunego and Alberto as the only ones not intimidated by him. What gives?

 

[Anonymous]

I don't assume anything. What you are assuming is that your opinion about what Contador should have done is relevant. It isn't. He was riding in the race with the Schlecks and Kloden. He made a decision based on the advice from JB, talking to Kloden (who said go) and his own read of the Schlecks perceived strength. He made the move, the Schlecks were stronger than he thought and Kloden wasn't able to follow the acceleration. That's what happened. There is nothing to argue about in my book. GC leaders look to get time where they can. He tried and didn't get it. It, as they say, happens.

Now since you seem to be such a stickler for team tactics, perhaps you can weigh in on the tactical blunder (IMHO) by Lance Armstrong on the Col de Romme. Which one had a more lasting effect on Stage 17? Contador's attack on Col de Colombiere, or Lance's inattentiveness (looking at his pedals and almost causing an accident with Wiggins) allowing Frank Schleck to bridge up to Andy, Contador and Kloden?

So Lance is supposed to bridge up to a teamate up the road, who's in yellow, dragging GC threats with him? That would be about as smart as AC blowing up his only help. Lance coming to a near stop forces Wiggo and/or Frank Schleck to the front. Wiggo had the responsibiliy to follow AC and Klodi, not Lance. At that point Astana is 1, 2 on the road in GC. What Lance did is what he should have done. Force somebody else to the front. Lance had no responsibilty to follow Frank because Klodi was there with AC. Probably could not follow Frank. It does not matter. There was no mistake there if he was unable to follow Frank.

You and I have very different views of bike racing tactics. I appreciate your take but I don't agree with your conclusions.

 

[Ninety5rpm]

As I said, the only help he got is in the form of no attacks. Sitting on Wiggo's wheel is not working for AC, it's respecting the team leader. Working for AC would be Lance setting a tempo up Mt Ventoux for 10 km until he was exhausted and giving up 10 minutes in the GC. That's what domestiques do. The rest is BS. Lance never rode tempo for AC uphill. Because Lance was worried about his place in the GC, something Lance would have never allowed any domestique in Discovery or US Postal. Lance rode for Lance. We all saw it.

Not one team in this year's Tour, NOT ONE, devoted every single rider to their one GC rider. Several teams, including Saxo Bank, Astana, Garmin etc., had more than one GC rider.

I don't see anyone complaining about Cadel Evans not being a domestique for Van den Broeck, and I don't see Van den Broeck announcing his lack of respect for Evans upon returning to Belgium.

Yeah, Lance never road tempo for AC. So what? He was a GC rider.

Yeah, Lance would never allow the riders that were specifically hired to ride tempo for him to not do their job on Discovery or Postal teams. That's what leaders do.

Lance did his job, and his job was not to ride tempo for Contador. And for doing his job Contador denounces him. That's not what leaders do. Contador had an incredible once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to learn what it takes to be a leader, and he squandered it.

 

[TRDean]

So Lance is supposed to bridge up to a teamate up the road, who's in yellow, dragging GC threats with him? That would be about as smart as AC blowing up his only help. Lance coming to a near stop forces Wiggo and/or Frank Schleck to the front. Wiggo had the responsibiliy to follow AC and Klodi, not Lance. At that point Astana is 1, 2 on the road in GC. What Lance did is what he should have done. Force somebody else to the front. Lance had no responsibilty to follow Frank because Klodi was there with AC. Probably could not follow Frank. It does not matter. There was no mistake there if he was unable to follow Frank.

You and I have very different views of bike racing tactics. I appreciate your take but I don't agree with your conclusions.

People keep talking like Klodi was there and would have been a help. How? When? He couldn't stay with the little attack, and then got gapped by LA himself at the finish. How was Klodi going to do anything to help AC? Please...if anything he sat on AC wheel the whole time...who was riding for who?