Contador blasts LA

[thehog]

You wrote BS... the team plan was Lance's plan: to give Armstrong the win, to have a full team dedicated to HRH Lance 1st and to destroy his biggest threat named Contador. Nothing more.

http://english.ntdtv.com/ntdtv_en/ns_europe/2009-07-28/675343514787.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLP5fV5hFC4

- Watching him speak it doesn't sound vindictive at all. He really is a great champion and they love him in Spain. We should all celebrate the great champion Alberto Contador.

 

[unsheath]

I think Armstrong is the new Benjamin Button. Gets more childish as he ages.
Anyhow, I just wanted to point out that problems seem to follow Armstrong around like a bad smell.

Ferrari, Bassons, Simeoni, EPO 99, Actovegin, Vaughters/Andreau IM, SCA, Floyd Bloodbags, Cortisone TUE, Omerta, Stefanie McIlvein, Emma O’Reilly, UCI Donation, Lemond, Showergate, Don Caitlin, Transparency, Coffee Inspector??, Lots to Learn, RadioShack announcement, Team Dinner No-show.... Need I go on?

And we wonder why fanboys are so blindsighted. The stuff isn’t just made up.

 

[Jonathan]

http://english.ntdtv.com/ntdtv_en/ns_europe/2009-07-28/675343514787.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLP5fV5hFC4

- Watching him speak it doesn't sound vindictive at all. He really is a great champion and they love him in Spain. We should all celebrate the great champion Alberto Contador.

Still his timing shows he knows what he is doing. He's quite calculating, perhaps not as much as Armstrong, but that could be because he doesn't have as much practice fighting these verbal battles.

 

[balkou]

I was being sarcastic in mentioning that fact that to many on here LA is a broken down old man, hence by that logic it must make the rest look pretty bad.

Regarding LA winning: Personally I never thought he had a chance to win over AC. Would it have been bad for the sport if he had? maybe in the sense that it would have showed a weakness in the current generation of riders if a guy his age and three years out could come back and beat them. So in that sense it would have been bad. Publicity wise for the average joe it would have been great for the sport and it would have made a lot of riders take a long hard look at themselves.
In terms of respect: I believe (unlike others on here) that any rider who podiums at the TdF is worthy of respect.

A broken noway, an old man sure he is (and unfortunately me also ).
Nothing to add in the second & third paragraph.

 

[Bustedknuckle]

Looks as if AC finally snapped and got tired of being picked on. What a baby. Man up and drop your nuts AC. LA may only have 1, but at least he uses it.

http://tour-de-france.velonews.com/article/96109/contador-rips-armstrong

hmmmm, team built around one guy(Contador), excluded from the 'Tour in 2008, he enters late and wins the Giro. Team built again around Contador for the 2009 TdF, Lance 'decides' he wants to race with Bruyneel and effectivley shoves Contador aside. I'd be ****ed too. At least he showed who was the strongest rider, in spite of a team that didn't really race for him. Next year Contador, with a new team, will put it to Armstrong again, regardless of Bruyneel and Radioshack radios. Last 4 winners have been Spanish, the next will be also.

 

[HMacK2010]

No "I" in TEAM

Professional cycling has always been greater than any one individual. Merckx in the forward to a French book published on all the mountain climbs in the TdF states clearly that while he flew through mountain stages as though he were stronger than they, earlier in his career, they eventually reduce cyclists to who they really are - mere mortals while they continue to make and break careers. He sketches out the later failures as his career drew towards its inevitable conclusion.
It has to be observed that Mr LA is in the same situation and has to admit that time is no longer on his side and he is in the process of being reduced to what he is and this is nowhere near in sum total what Eddy and Bernard were as professional cyclists. Therefore, when he criticises Contador as he has done explicitly and by implication on several occasions, he has placed himself as a justified target for criticism himself.
It is evident that he agrees with the team ethos in cycling provided that he is the one who crosses the line first and wears the maillot of honour. Indeed, there is an "A" in TEAM & he thinks it is he who ought to be the centre of attention not his team mates. The images of him on the podium as third best in 2009 irked him endlessly as any psychologist can assess from the body language and his regards towards the victors crown borne by Alberto. His own words afterwards to journalists betray a man who was not really pleased with himself. His absence from the following festivities in the Astana team reveal much more than he is trying to allow us to understand. Thus, it is self-critical of Mr LA to accuse Contador of uttering 'drivel' and forgetting that cycling is team work of which he does neither. Mr LA should know that a good team mate would not make public comments about his team members that are transparently critical during a competition as he has done throughout the TdF this year about Alberto. Had anyone done this to him at US Postal or Discovery we can imagine the reaction from him.
Mr LA has himself attacked during tours that may not have been necessary and he has benefited from the tireless work of numerous teams on his behalf while assuming all the glory with few mentions of those around him who deserved more praise than he actually gave them publicly during his career. It is easy to go on about team work when it is all about one man winning but not so easy to swallow when the mountain you attempt to climb later in your career tells you that your day is over and it is the moment to yield with grace to the younger champion who is now your superior. He is not the only one either. There are others. Andy Schleck is clearly much better than him and once he has improved his time-trialing he will leave Mr LA in his wake on that day as he has done in the mountains.
Yes, Mr Armstrong, your day is done and it is the mountain top telling you to move over. There are others better and stronger than you who deserve the limelight because it is now their era. Yours is effectively done. Alberto has given you enough rope to hang yourself. Had you behaved with more discretion it is difficult to think he would have openly reviled your negative public acts of thoughtlessness towards him, after the Tour was finished as he has done. We can observe your actions and words during the TdF as they stand as a testimony against you where this is concerned. You have earned what you deserve. Your work for cancer sufferers may be worthy but your egoistical behaviour in cycling is not.
My advice to you is to build your new Radio Shack team around a younger cyclist who has championship potential, not yourself, and to desist from dragging us into your personality problems as you have done over the years, and the fact that you find it difficult to accept that the maillot jaune is no longer yours and never will be again.

 

[Aguirre]

Situations where the tactics denefits LA in order to demostrate the team rode for him not for AC.

1- stage 3 La grand Motte: very clear, Lance demands zubeldia and popo for his own benefit. The politics of if "I'm before contador for few seconds he should respect me". He gains 41 seconds

2-Arcalis, the Astana put a tempo, nothing to compare with the US Postal heras and rubiera of the old times. Politics of slowing down the rythm, of blocage, that benefits the more doubtfull (LA) rather than the suppose stronger AC. If Contador doesn't jump, then LA in leader and the politics of "listen young boy I am team leader the team, you included, have to protect me". He might gain 20 something seconds

3. Stage at Colmar, a day of hell, rain, hard climbs, once again the tempo. benefits LA. The non attacks politics.

4. Stage at Verbier, they set the tempo again!!!! they know, when much harder better for Lance, worst for AC. Thanks to Saxo Bank (the US postal tactic of another era) Contador benefits from that tactic of SB and not from his own team (Klodi stays with LA, as a good teammate, but only in the last 300 Klodi goes by his own after LA cracks. Team for LA again. Then he recognises his wekness in a politics of "AC is the best, from now I will ride for him). A joke.

5. Stage Le grand bornard. Much is written. The Astana rides for the fictive and illusionist 1, 2, 3 when in any other team in the history of cycling would be to secure the MJ, overall of AC. Here isn't that the Astana doesnt ride for AC but rather than AC, the leader, should be a exemplary coequiper for Klodi, who has been used by LA and JB as a dominated slave, and for LA. Again, the team rides for LA.

6. ITT in Annecy, nor team cars for AC because they are being used for LA familly, DS follows LA not AC, Gallopin follow him but suspiciously the radio is broken after few kms and AC needs to do the TT without references, focusing in the screens of the "parcours"... etc. team for LA again

7. Stage Ventoux. Here the history changes, LA feels strong and before the Ventoux he and JB decide to give full gas for the first time in the Tour in order to get tired brother Frank. A risk move, what if that move hurst the leader MJ? they don't care, instead of playing in a conservative way, to protect the MJ, they risk just in order to secure third. Then again Klodi works for LA. The whole team work for Lance, and AC plays the rol of the good teammate when he might win a prestige stage in glorious M. Ventoux.

This is the history of how the team focused always in favour of LA and not for AC. So the whole twitter serie of LA seems so cynical

 

[gree0232]

I think Armstrong is the new Benjamin Button. Gets more childish as he ages.
Anyhow, I just wanted to point out that problems seem to follow Armstrong around like a bad smell.

Ferrari, Bassons, Simeoni, EPO 99, Actovegin, Vaughters/Andreau IM, SCA, Floyd Bloodbags, Cortisone TUE, Omerta, Stefanie McIlvein, Emma O’Reilly, UCI Donation, Lemond, Showergate, Don Caitlin, Transparency, Coffee Inspector??, Lots to Learn, RadioShack announcement, Team Dinner No-show.... Need I go on?

And we wonder why fanboys are so blindsighted. The stuff isn’t just made up.

Interesting. I just wanted to point out a few cycling issues that have nothing to do with Lance.

Operation Puerto
Freiberg Clinic
DiLuca
Ricco
Tin Tin
Shumacher
Kohl
Sinkewitz
Vino
Kashekin
Iban Mayo
Valverde
Ullrich
UCI vs. ASO
Pro Tour failure

Let's also not forget that Alberto was not allowed to start the 2006 Tour due to possible involvement in Operation Puerto. Let's also not forget that only two cyclists have so far been linked officially to the more than 50 blood bags found in Spain. (Three if you count Valverde).

Additionally, some of the things you list aren't criticisms at all. How exactly is team Radioshack a bad thing? A new American professional road racing team is something to criticise Lance for?

It is one thing to criticise, it is another thing to take the absolute worst possible spin on literally everything Lance does to the point where even positive steps are viewed as a dark cloud of problems.

There are plenty of problems in Cycling, and the four years Lance was absent were hardly peaceful years free of controversy or issues. The idea that Simeoni was a 'popular' rider free of issues and emotional outbursts until he was 'broken' by his confrontation with Lance is silly. Lance created Omerta?

To list every 'theory' surrounding Lance as an indictment amounts to little more than a grammar school whisper campaign. As usual from the Lance haters, everything is one sided, facts are cherry picked, and lost in the emotive diatribe of bandwagon mob actions is anything that looks like actual criticism or a solution.

About the only valid criticism this thread referring to Lance's actions vis a vis AC has produced is that he probably should have waited 24 hours to cool off before responding to Alberto's comments. The rest is nonsense.

The idea that Lance shouldn't have come out of retirement? Not anyone's choice but Lance's. The idea that he was out to malign AC by ridding for Astana? Well, if AC goes to Garmin he'll be ding exactly the same thing to Vandevelde and Wiggins that 'evil' Lance did to AC. In fact, if AC goes to any team but Astana, he'll be doing the exact same thing to that team that he was victimized by in the Tour that he won.

In the end, Lance won the Tour seven times with one ball. There is plenty to admire there. Honestly though, if everywhere you went there were nuts blaming you for omerta, you'd probably be a little on the surly side too. That surliness would be there without the benefit of having won the Tour seven times.

It would be nice to see something like the application of neutral standards, so that things that are innuendo are discarded in favor of actual facts when criticising.

 

[balkou]

Let's also not forget that Alberto was not allowed to start the 2006 Tour due to possible involvement in Operation Puerto.

Actually his team was left outside, it wasn't focused on any single rider...

edit: He was left out of the Tour last year, too. Oops! I forgot, it was with JB then so it was ASO's fault...

 

[Publicus]

Interesting. I just wanted to point out a few cycling issues that have nothing to do with Lance.

The idea that Lance shouldn't have come out of retirement? Not anyone's choice but Lance's. The idea that he was out to malign AC by ridding for Astana? Well, if AC goes to Garmin he'll be ding exactly the same thing to Vandevelde and Wiggins that 'evil' Lance did to AC. In fact, if AC goes to any team but Astana, he'll be doing the exact same thing to that team that he was victimized by in the Tour that he won.

Interesting perspective. But I'm not sure it advances the discussion in any way. There are relevant facts that you are glossing over (JB's relationship with Lance, Lance's attitude, Lance's age, etc.) that are unique to the AC/LA/Astana situation that just aren't replicated in the scenario you game out. VdV and Wiggins want to win the TdF, as does Garmin and Contador. Now if you are Garmin, out of VdV, Wiggins and Contador, who gives you the best shot of winning the TdF in 2010? Now compare with Astana, between Lance Armstrong and Contador, who gives you the best shot of winning the TdF in 2009?

 

[TRDean]

Interesting perspective. But I'm not sure it advances the discussion in any way. There are relevant facts that you are glossing over (JB's relationship with Lance, Lance's attitude, Lance's age, etc.) that are unique to the AC/LA/Astana situation that just aren't replicated in the scenario you game out. VdV and Wiggins want to win the TdF, as does Garmin and Contador. Now if you are Garmin, out of VdV, Wiggins and Contador, who gives you the best shot of winning the TdF? Now compare with Astana, between Lance Armstrong and Contador, who gives you the best shot of winning the TdF in 2009?

Is that a trick question? LOL!

 

[Wheels Go Round and Round]

Professional cycling has always been greater than any one individual. Merckx in the forward to a French book published on all the mountain climbs in the TdF states clearly that while he flew through mountain stages as though he were stronger than they, earlier in his career, they eventually reduce cyclists to who they really are - mere mortals while they continue to make and break careers. He sketches out the later failures as his career drew towards its inevitable conclusion.
It has to be observed that Mr LA is in the same situation and has to admit that time is no longer on his side and he is in the process of being reduced to what he is and this is nowhere near in sum total what Eddy and Bernard were as professional cyclists. Therefore, when he criticises Contador as he has done explicitly and by implication on several occasions, he has placed himself as a justified target for criticism himself.
It is evident that he agrees with the team ethos in cycling provided that he is the one who crosses the line first and wears the maillot of honour. Indeed, there is an "A" in TEAM & he thinks it is he who ought to be the centre of attention not his team mates. The images of him on the podium as third best in 2009 irked him endlessly as any psychologist can assess from the body language and his regards towards the victors crown borne by Alberto. His own words afterwards to journalists betray a man who was not really pleased with himself. His absence from the following festivities in the Astana team reveal much more than he is trying to allow us to understand. Thus, it is self-critical of Mr LA to accuse Contador of uttering 'drivel' and forgetting that cycling is team work of which he does neither. Mr LA should know that a good team mate would not make public comments about his team members that are transparently critical during a competition as he has done throughout the TdF this year about Alberto. Had anyone done this to him at US Postal or Discovery we can imagine the reaction from him.
Mr LA has himself attacked during tours that may not have been necessary and he has benefited from the tireless work of numerous teams on his behalf while assuming all the glory with few mentions of those around him who deserved more praise than he actually gave them publicly during his career. It is easy to go on about team work when it is all about one man winning but not so easy to swallow when the mountain you attempt to climb later in your career tells you that your day is over and it is the moment to yield with grace to the younger champion who is now your superior. He is not the only one either. There are others. Andy Schleck is clearly much better than him and once he has improved his time-trialing he will leave Mr LA in his wake on that day as he has done in the mountains.
Yes, Mr Armstrong, your day is done and it is the mountain top telling you to move over. There are others better and stronger than you who deserve the limelight because it is now their era. Yours is effectively done. Alberto has given you enough rope to hang yourself. Had you behaved with more discretion it is difficult to think he would have openly reviled your negative public acts of thoughtlessness towards him, after the Tour was finished as he has done. We can observe your actions and words during the TdF as they stand as a testimony against you where this is concerned. You have earned what you deserve. Your work for cancer sufferers may be worthy but your egoistical behaviour in cycling is not.
My advice to you is to build your new Radio Shack team around a younger cyclist who has championship potential, not yourself, and to desist from dragging us into your personality problems as you have done over the years, and the fact that you find it difficult to accept that the maillot jaune is no longer yours and never will be again.

nice psycho babble

it's fun to see everyone writing Lance off, the guy takes over 3yrs off and still finishes 3rd in the worlds toughest bike race. That in itself is a tremendous accomplishment. If you believe yourself to be correct in your assumption of Armstrong then you know he will be obsessed next yr in winning the tour just to stuff it in your face. There were plenty of people on here who said he would never make it through the mountains, yet Lance got stronger during the race. The old guy still has something in the tank.

 

[Animal]

Interesting. I just wanted to point out a few cycling issues that have nothing to do with Lance.

What a bizarre non-sequitur!

Perhaps I'll point out a few things that have nothing to do with the price of fish!

 

[Azdak6]

I think Armstrong is the new Benjamin Button. Gets more childish as he ages.
Anyhow, I just wanted to point out that problems seem to follow Armstrong around like a bad smell.

Ferrari, Bassons, Simeoni, EPO 99, Actovegin, Vaughters/Andreau IM, SCA, Floyd Bloodbags, Cortisone TUE, Omerta, Stefanie McIlvein, Emma O’Reilly, UCI Donation, Lemond, Showergate, Don Caitlin, Transparency, Coffee Inspector??, Lots to Learn, RadioShack announcement, Team Dinner No-show.... Need I go on?

And we wonder why fanboys are so blindsighted. The stuff isn’t just made up.

Follow him?

They only "follow him" in places like these forums where the little boys clutch them to their chests like lockets with pictures of their imaginary girlfriends.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

nice psycho babble

it's fun to see everyone writing Lance off, the guy takes over 3yrs off and still finishes 3rd in the worlds toughest bike race. That in itself is a tremendous accomplishment. If you believe yourself to be correct in your assumption of Armstrong then you know he will be obsessed next yr in winning the tour just to stuff it in your face. There were plenty of people on here who said he would never make it through the mountains, yet Lance got stronger during the race. The old guy still has something in the tank.

Again not everyone is writing lance off.
Also I didnt see 'plenty of people' say he would not make it over the mountain's - another poster said that and when asked to produce names he did and was shown they had not said that at all.

As for Lance - I think he will go back to his 'old' format of some spring classics and then either the Dauphine or Tour de Suisse as a warm up. Again I expect him to be close - which as you pointed out is in itself an achievement- but I just don't see him on the top step, imo.

 

[gree0232]

Interesting perspective. But I'm not sure it advances the discussion in any way. There are relevant facts that you are glossing over (JB's relationship with Lance, Lance's attitude, Lance's age, etc.) that are unique to the AC/LA/Astana situation that just aren't replicated in the scenario you game out. VdV and Wiggins want to win the TdF, as does Garmin and Contador. Now if you are Garmin, out of VdV, Wiggins and Contador, who gives you the best shot of winning the TdF in 2010? Now compare with Astana, between Lance Armstrong and Contador, who gives you the best shot of winning the TdF in 2009?

Well, lots of people mention LA and JB's relationship, and it is very clear that AC didn't trust the situation. Having read quite a bit since the end of the Tour I think it is appropriate to remember that there are good and bad ways to handle any situation, and I do not think that AC handled the JB/LA situation well at all.

A few years ago JB was absolutely gushing about AC before he ever won a Grand Tour, and now he is ready to cast the greatest GT rider in a generation adrift? There is more going on there than just Lance in the past six months.

My read is that JB and LA came up with game plans and that at key moments AC ignored the script and did his own thing convinced that the JB/LA didn't have his best interests in mind. I do not think he has been particularly up front with the team or the public about these things either.

The most important things to take into account here is that LA was not physically capable of winning the Tour and that Cycling is a team sport. I think AC was so worried about the former to the point that he acted in ways that were bad for the later (though certainly not for AC). Despite all the polmics here, there is certainly not a time when Astana was clearly riding to the detriment of AC's GC contention.

AC is as much, and given his clear mistrust of his Team Director and the 'independant' actions that resulted, if not mostly responsible for the tensions he was apparently so badly victimized by. If you don't trust your manager and hide things from him, there is very little he can do to allay those fears and insecurities.

Now, if we cut down on all the conspiracy theories surrounding Lance, and please bear in mind every single person who has tried to use the legitimate system to prove LA guilty has failed (a strong indication of innocence given the results of similar targetting today), i.e. start with the presumption of good rather than evil intent, and take a hard look at the situation we can learn some lessons.

What is clear is that AC's actions and statements have effectively killed the team that rode behind him in all of his GT victories. Most riders will vote with their feet, and it will be interesting to see who moves to Radio Shack and who stays with AC. I think that, more than conspiracy theories and who followed what wheel, will tell us about who was the sore sport on this one.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Well, lots of people mention LA and JB's......

What is clear is that AC's actions and statements have effectively killed the team that rode behind him in all of his GT victories. Most riders will vote with their feet, and it will be interesting to see who moves to Radio Shack and who stays with AC. I think that, more than conspiracy theories and who followed what wheel, will tell us about who was the sore sport on this one.

As you have made a genuine attempt at having some facts this last part is not a fair representation of the situation.

Bruyneel has the riders contracts - not Astana - through his company Olympic SARL, so any of the team that had a valid contract for next year would have to have their contracts honored.

He also has Contador's - but as we have already seen he is prepared to let him go.

 

[hfer07]

Well, lots of people mention LA and JB's relationship, and it is very clear that AC didn't trust the situation. Having read quite a bit since the end of the Tour I think it is appropriate to remember that there are good and bad ways to handle any situation, and I do not think that AC handled the JB/LA situation well at all.

A few years ago JB was absolutely gushing about AC before he ever won a Grand Tour, and now he is ready to cast the greatest GT rider in a generation adrift? There is more going on there than just Lance in the past six months.

My read is that JB and LA came up with game plans and that at key moments AC ignored the script and did his own thing convinced that the JB/LA didn't have his best interests in mind. I do not think he has been particularly up front with the team or the public about these things either.

The most important things to take into account here is that LA was not physically capable of winning the Tour and that Cycling is a team sport. I think AC was so worried about the former to the point that he acted in ways that were bad for the later (though certainly not for AC). Despite all the polmics here, there is certainly not a time when Astana was clearly riding to the detriment of AC's GC contention.

AC is as much, and given his clear mistrust of his Team Director and the 'independant' actions that resulted, if not mostly responsible for the tensions he was apparently so badly victimized by. If you don't trust your manager and hide things from him, there is very little he can do to allay those fears and insecurities.

Now, if we cut down on all the conspiracy theories surrounding Lance, and please bear in mind every single person who has tried to use the legitimate system to prove LA guilty has failed (a strong indication of innocence given the results of similar targetting today), i.e. start with the presumption of good rather than evil intent, and take a hard look at the situation we can learn some lessons.

What is clear is that AC's actions and statements have effectively killed the team that rode behind him in all of his GT victories. Most riders will vote with their feet, and it will be interesting to see who moves to Radio Shack and who stays with AC. I think that, more than conspiracy theories and who followed what wheel, will tell us about who was the sore sport on this one.

perhaps a 107 pages of discussing this matter weren't enough for you to come up with this load of sh!t!!! at least take the time to "read, analyze, comprehend & write something worth to argue about"
unbelievable...

 

[padyakpinoy]

He could call it the "my head exploded and I survived" foundation.

Or HEAD-STRONG, being hardheaded that AC is!

 

[LugHugger]

Indeed, there is an "A" in TEAM & he thinks it is he who ought to be the centre of attention not his team mates.

What Armstrong has conveniently forgotten is that although there is no "I" in team, there is a "ME"....

 

[Carboncrank]

I think Armstrong is the new Benjamin Button. Gets more childish as he ages.
Anyhow, I just wanted to point out that problems seem to follow Armstrong around like a bad smell.

Ferrari, Bassons, Simeoni, EPO 99, Actovegin, Vaughters/Andreau IM, SCA, Floyd Bloodbags, Cortisone TUE, Omerta, Stefanie McIlvein, Emma O’Reilly, UCI Donation, Lemond, Showergate, Don Caitlin, Transparency, Coffee Inspector??, Lots to Learn, RadioShack announcement, Team Dinner No-show.... Need I go on?

And we wonder why fanboys are so blindsighted. The stuff isn’t just made up.

simply a case of hating someone so you look at every single thing they do in the worse possible light.
hearsay, innuendo, guilt by association.

he came back and proved himself.

 

[LugHugger]

Interesting. I just wanted to point out a few cycling issues that have nothing to do with Lance.

Operation Puerto
Freiberg Clinic
DiLuca
Ricco
Tin Tin
Shumacher
Kohl
Sinkewitz
Vino
Kashekin
Iban Mayo
Valverde
Ullrich
UCI vs. ASO
Pro Tour failure

Let's also not forget that Alberto was not allowed to start the 2006 Tour due to possible involvement in Operation Puerto. Let's also not forget that only two cyclists have so far been linked officially to the more than 50 blood bags found in Spain. (Three if you count Valverde).

Additionally, some of the things you list aren't criticisms at all. How exactly is team Radioshack a bad thing? A new American professional road racing team is something to criticise Lance for?

It is one thing to criticise, it is another thing to take the absolute worst possible spin on literally everything Lance does to the point where even positive steps are viewed as a dark cloud of problems.

There are plenty of problems in Cycling, and the four years Lance was absent were hardly peaceful years free of controversy or issues. The idea that Simeoni was a 'popular' rider free of issues and emotional outbursts until he was 'broken' by his confrontation with Lance is silly. Lance created Omerta?

To list every 'theory' surrounding Lance as an indictment amounts to little more than a grammar school whisper campaign. As usual from the Lance haters, everything is one sided, facts are cherry picked, and lost in the emotive diatribe of bandwagon mob actions is anything that looks like actual criticism or a solution.

About the only valid criticism this thread referring to Lance's actions vis a vis AC has produced is that he probably should have waited 24 hours to cool off before responding to Alberto's comments. The rest is nonsense.

The idea that Lance shouldn't have come out of retirement? Not anyone's choice but Lance's. The idea that he was out to malign AC by ridding for Astana? Well, if AC goes to Garmin he'll be ding exactly the same thing to Vandevelde and Wiggins that 'evil' Lance did to AC. In fact, if AC goes to any team but Astana, he'll be doing the exact same thing to that team that he was victimized by in the Tour that he won.

In the end, Lance won the Tour seven times with one ball. There is plenty to admire there. Honestly though, if everywhere you went there were nuts blaming you for omerta, you'd probably be a little on the surly side too. That surliness would be there without the benefit of having won the Tour seven times.

It would be nice to see something like the application of neutral standards, so that things that are innuendo are discarded in favor of actual facts when criticising.

Well, where to start? You list 15 non related LA cycling 'scandals' [my emphasis] versus a similar number relaed to a single rider, Lance Armstrong. Have you heard of the phrase "There's no smoke without fire"? Or is your contention that Armstrong is cycling's Messiah and without reproach?

Contador is, so far, not guilty of any irregularity with regard to doping and/or transfusions. Now, as to the number of cyclists banned or prosecuted over Puerto, that particular stunning piece of apathy can be laid squarely in the hands of the Spanish legal system and it's Ostrich Tendency.

Nobody says that Radio Shack is a bad thing. Not attending your existing team's victory party to announce a new rival team is pretty bad diplomacy in my eyes.

You're right that not all of cycling's problems are Armstrong related. Many of them were rife in the sport before he emerged and sadly, apathy and commercial interests looks like ensuring that they remain for year's to come.

However, to contend that Contador would be acting in the same way as Armstrong by switching teams is ridiculous. They are in no way similar. If Contador switches teams, it will be a career continuation. Armstrong's return was a futile attempt to fuel his Peter Pan syndrome. But we all know that was a fairy tale.

 

[Carboncrank]

perhaps a 107 pages of discussing this matter weren't enough for you to come up with this load of sh!t!!! at least take the time to "read, analyze, comprehend & write something worth to argue about"
unbelievable...

you have nothing but a cheap shot as rebuttal?

 

[Merckx11]

Alpha males

Lets see. We have "THE" two Alpha males of Pro Cycling on the same team.
One is young and coming up and the other an old retired champion who came back. This war of words is not surprising.

I only hope another year doesn't erode Lance's ability to compete at the top level and maybe he will even be a tic better.

It could be a great tour. On the knowledge and mental discipline I give Lance the edge and on explosive power, I give the edge to Contador. This is great stuff. Just like life itself.

 

[frizzlefry]

you have nothing but a cheap shot as rebuttal?

ad hominem.