Contador Isolates Self

[Azdak6]

Ok, fair enough. But the point I was making is still the same: if I'm a DS, I put my money on the 26 year old who's already banked 3 Grand Tours and is close to bank his 4th in 4 tries, or the 38 year old 4 years out of retirement, but who won 7 Tours?

It seems like a no-brainer to me.

You and me both.

I wish Dan Coyle was writing another book about THIS Tour. I suspect there are a LOT of stories yet to be told.

 

[Azdak6]

I think there are apparently some who think we're going to get some kind of 'Gunfight at the Ventoux Corral' between AC and LA.

Unfortunately, only one will have a gun.

 

[schnebit]

Ok, fair enough. But the point I was making is still the same: if I'm a DS, I put my money on the 26 year old who's already banked 3 Grand Tours and is close to bank his 4th in 4 tries, or the 38 year old 4 years out of retirement, but who won 7 Tours?

It seems like a no-brainer to me.

I hear ya...

There's probably much more that went on behind the scenes that none of us know about that factored in to this.

And at the end of the day, JB is coming across like a poor manager... I mean heck, he can't keep his star player in check.

And by the same token, if I'm AC I'm going to listen to JB... the guy's got a proven track-record for winning grand tours.

 

[Psalmon]

Talent, Team, Tactics, Timing, Terror

For those of us who love bike racing, watching and/or participating, we know it's a fantastic blend of raw Talent, Teamwork, Tactics pulled off at the right Time, and inducing Terror (having that Killer Instinct - any humble champion bike racers out there?).

It's a different mix always for a Classic, a Stage, a Tour.

When it's all put together for the win over three weeks, it's magnificent.

Lance was so successful because he mastered all of these to "utter perfection" to use Paul Sherwin's phrase.

I don't think anyone is trying to dump on Contador. You can't help but admire his Talent and Terror. You would just like to see him achieve perfection with his abilities. His boneheaded move was almost offensive to that, what a football team would call an winning ugly.

Lance could have won on Talent and Terror at least four times through 2002 (though he didn't solely). From 2003-2005 you saw the value of the others. It was so sublime, it became boring. He stifled the race, choked it until it became a parade, a foregone conclusion most times.

I don't prefer boring, but like seeing perfection.

 

[Señor_Contador]

What is really, really sad is that Contador needs to prove himself on every stage. I think he's unfortunate in that he is at the wrong place at the right time with the wrong people: Astana.

The fact of the matter is that Kloden should've had enough gas to stay with AC. The problem is that Andreas has already spent most of his gas pacing LA when he was getting left behind. So AC is left to do his all this work all by himself. I suspect much of these "bad vibes" have to do with money problems and Lance Armstrong's cavalry coming in to save the day, with the only cost, I suspect, is forcing AC to relinquish his chances to win the TdF. That is why LA is now acting as though someone has betrayed him. The way JB and LA are using AC as a scapegoat is just shameless.

 

[Futuroscope]

I think the attack caught him by suprise, but I'd imagine that before the stage, Astana would have designated Wiggins as the bigger threat because of his TT ability. It looked like LA purposely shut down real quick once he realized that Wiggins wasn't also going, so that AC and Kloden could get a good gap.

sure he may have held back a bit but he could never have kept up with the schlecks and contador. but like i said before, lance is riding very well right now..only those three guys are climbing better than him.

 

[Publicus]

I'm not disagreeing with you re Armstrong/Twitter, but I also get the impression that the older riders on Astana find Contador very exasperating at times and they cannot hold that in completely. I also think that, although he gets annoyed, Armstrong sees something of his early self in Contador.

Makes me wonder what the comments about LA would have been like in 1992-96 if Twitter had been around then.

What gives you that impression?

 

[Señor_Contador]

Moreover, what is up with Phil Ligget's habit of using diminutive terms when talking about Spanish riders? He does it constantly, even with Contador, who is just as tall as Lance... and I'm pretty sure the guy never said "that little rider from Plano, Texas".

Just a thought.

 

[Publicus]

I hear ya...

There's probably much more that went on behind the scenes that none of us know about that factored in to this.

And at the end of the day, JB is coming across like a poor manager... I mean heck, he can't keep his star player in check.

And by the same token, if I'm AC I'm going to listen to JB... the guy's got a proven track-record for winning grand tours.

I think the problem is that JB can't control LANCE and his ambitions, nor his favoritism toward him. If we can see his bias, think what Contador sees? Why would he put his complete trust in JB? He's made comments throughout the Tour that indicate that he doesn't believe JB has his back and the fact that he learned from the press that JB was leaving the team AND going to a new Armstrong lead team just made it clear where his loyalties lie.

And I don't know if it is true, but why the hell was JB riding in the car behind LANCE? That made ZERO sense with the yellow jersey up the road.

 

[Amsterhammer]

....That is why LA is now acting as though someone has betrayed him. The way JB and LA are using AC as a scapegoat is just shameless.

Kindly explain on what basis you make the above two statements, as I seem to have missed something, probably a twitt.

 

[Publicus]

Moreover, what is up with Phil Ligget's habit of using diminutive terms when talking about Spanish riders? He does it constantly, even with Contador, who is just as tall as Lance... and I'm pretty sure the guy never said "that little rider from Plano, Texas".

Just a thought.

I'm thinking it's more about girth than height. Contador weighs about 139 pounds, whereas Lance is closer to 160 or more.

 

[uphillstruggle]

I thought It went brilliantly for AC LA and Astana in generally today, and although he isn't going to win A. Schleck must be happy too.

Lance rode well today in that he didn't do anything to damage AC's chances for yellow and also gave himself into a potential podium position - don't really see anything wrong with what he did apart form not being the top dog any more.

As for the showdown on Ventoux it's all about schleck against LA for me. Contador has this in the bag barring the bonk or a crash but 2nd spot on the podium will be tight - LA will pretty much wipe out Shclecks lead tomorrow and schleck will attack him on ventoux. He will have a go at AC too of course but I don't think that will bear much fruit.

I'm hoping A Schleck doesn't mess it all up tomorrow.

 

[hwttdz]

moreover, what is up with phil ligget's habit of using diminutive terms when talking about spanish riders? he does it constantly, even with contador, who is just as tall as lance... And i'm pretty sure the guy never said "that little rider from plano, texas".

Just a thought.

i think it's just an overgeneralization from commentating on races yearlong. The races like pairs-roubaix and the tour of flanders would be generally be the playing ground of the big, hardmen. Stereotypically belgian, maybe german and scandanavian (see tom boonen, thor hushovd (also what an impressive ride today), magnus bäckstedt), and the grand tours would be for little climbers many of whom are spanish (ex. All of euskaltel, though I think one of them might not be spanish). I'm not saying it's fair.

 

[schnebit]

I thought It went brilliantly for AC LA and Astana in generally today, and although he isn't going to win A. Schleck must be happy too.

Lance rode well today in that he didn't do anything to damage AC's chances for yellow and also gave himself into a potential podium position - don't really see anything wrong with what he did apart form not being the top dog any more.

As for the showdown on Ventoux it's all about schleck against LA for me. Contador has this in the bag barring the bonk or a crash but 2nd spot on the podium will be tight - LA will pretty much wipe out Shclecks lead tomorrow and schleck will attack him on ventoux. He will have a go at AC too of course but I don't think that will bear much fruit.

I'm hoping A Schleck doesn't mess it all up tomorrow.

Truth be told, that's how I'd like to see it go down...

Alberto's got the Tour in the bag, barring injury/crash, etc. I'd like to see Lance go mano e mano with the Shlecks. If he loses, he loses... but I think that it would be an exciting race.

The Ventoux is the only thing that Lance really has left... he's got a date with destiny on that mountain. I'd like to see him throw down, and take the win.

If he doesn't, he doesn't.... life goes on.

 

[Publicus]

I thought It went brilliantly for AC LA and Astana in generally today, and although he isn't going to win A. Schleck must be happy too.

Lance rode well today in that he didn't do anything to damage AC's chances for yellow and also gave himself into a potential podium position - don't really see anything wrong with what he did apart form not being the top dog any more.

As for the showdown on Ventoux it's all about schleck against LA for me. Contador has this in the bag barring the bonk or a crash but 2nd spot on the podium will be tight - LA will pretty much wipe out Shclecks lead tomorrow and schleck will attack him on ventoux. He will have a go at AC too of course but I don't think that will bear much fruit.

I'm hoping A Schleck doesn't mess it all up tomorrow.

I just don't see Lance staying with or dropping either of the Schleck Brothers at this point.

 

[lean mean &green]

Kindly explain on what basis you make the above two statements, as I seem to have missed something, probably a twitt.

they're called tweets

 

[schnebit]

Kindly explain on what basis you make the above two statements, as I seem to have missed something, probably a twitt.

Yeah, I don't see anything indicating any of this... it's not like it's Alberto Contador vs. Astana.

 

[nslckevin]

Bruyneel's take on today's stage:

http://www.astana-cyclingteam.com/race_recaps/tdfst1709.html

"As a time trial specialist we knew Wiggins was the real danger," said General Manager Johan Bruyneel. "At the moment the Schlecks went Contador and Klöden went so it was fine. We knew the Schlecks would go to the end because they wanted to get rid of Bradley Wiggins. The attack from Contador at 3km from the top, I had advised Alberto not to go because he didn’t need to go. He didn’t need to go because it was clear that the Schlecks would go full gas to the finish. I told him, ‘You don’t have to attack to win the Tour de France today’. It’s a bit of a pity that Andreas couldn’t hold on because we could have been first, second and third on GC but now we are first, fourth and fifth." Regarding a late attack by Lance, Johan continued with, " A rider has to know when he can go and Lance really judged that attack. I know that he had a hard time the last few kilometers, it was a hard stage. I told him on the final of the Colombiere to go away from Wiggins so in the end we could be 1-2-3. But in the end you can’t want it all. Our purpose is to win the Tour and we got a big step forward today. If we want everything we can end up with nothing and that’s not what we want. Second and third are not a goal. If it happens that’s ok but we don’t go after it. Winning the Tour is the goal."

 

[slowoldman]

You don't have to like all the riders (LA, AC, AK, whoever), but at least TRY to watch what is actually happening and don't view it through fanboy or hater eyes. Is that so much to ask?

Kevin

If you read here long enough you will find the answer to your question is a definitive YES. That is all that happens here, on both sides of the argument with very few exceptions.

 

[fulcrum]

And by the same token, if I'm AC I'm going to listen to JB... the guy's got a proven track-record for winning grand tours.

Only if AC thinks that JB has his best interest in mind, which at this point, I seriously doubt he does.

 

[Futuroscope]

I think the problem is that JB can't control LANCE and his ambitions, nor his favoritism toward him. If we can see his bias, think what Contador sees? Why would he put his complete trust in JB? He's made comments throughout the Tour that indicate that he doesn't believe JB has his back and the fact that he learned from the press that JB was leaving the team AND going to a new Armstrong lead team just made it clear where his loyalties lie.

And I don't know if it is true, but why the hell was JB riding in the car behind LANCE? That made ZERO sense with the yellow jersey up the road.

it doesn't matter all contador needs to do is to ride a good TT and the sit on andy's wheel.

 

[lean mean &green]

I just don't see Lance staying with or dropping either of the Schleck Brothers at this point.

yeah, he'll get some time back in ITT but give it right back on ventoux

 

[Futuroscope]

I just don't see Lance staying with or dropping either of the Schleck Brothers at this point.

me neither. certainly not andy.

 

[schnebit]

it doesn't matter all contador needs to do is to ride a good TT and the sit on andy's wheel.

Exactly...

 

[cgould]

AC was selfish!